BB: Our passing game isn't as efficient as it needs to be

[PatsRebuild]

I enjoy your optimistic glass half full posts. Seriously what has Stidham shown that would lead you to believe he is the future?

Eye test. Broke Brady's and Jimmy's preseason records. All the other QBs they drafted minus Bledsoe, all showed something there, and it's a very, very short list of people at the top. It's not made up. That happened.

When a QB on any team looks that good playing the bulk of preseason games, without a real gameplan, not even playign with the 1s, you've got something.

The pattern is clear, whether it's Brady, JimmyG, or Aaron Rodgers vs Dallas in 2005. It's not a mirage. That said, if the prospect doesn't take the coaching and improve or hits a wall, which can happen, then no. I am not saying he will be Aaron ROdgers, I am saying there is clearly something there AND the idea he got a bad deal in college like Brady, His coach gets brought up on some kind of sex scandal charges and needs to transfer, so he does, and it sort of ruins his senior year in some weird system at Auburn.

I mean, did you see the TD he threw to Harry vs KC? That's a really tough pass he made look easy. Beautiful ball. I mean, our fans are so spoiled and conditioned to believe only Brady can play QB in the NFL, that we must have the next guy who is even attempting to be vetted for the job, be completely disrespected because of what Brady accomplished.

Right now Stidham is Ray Bourque trying to follow Brady/Orr. I am not saying he is a HOF QB, but good lord why on earth are people angry about giving him a chance??

 

[PatsRebuild]

You draft works in progress in rounds 3 or later (maybe 2nd if they have huge upside).

AJ Brown was a more complete, NFL ready version of Harry and has been playing at an All-Pro level since being drafted with Tannehill throwing him the ball

Unless of course his football IQ is horrible, which it probably is. They're not going to take a WR that high if the kid is dumb and one dimensional.

A one dimensional, yet highly talented Moss type of WR here, is a luxury piece, not a building piece. A 20 on the Wonderlic is the minimum. People don't realize that a big reason why Brady won 3 SBs in 4 years the first time with David Patten or David Givens, was because defenses had no idea where the ball was going because all the WRs would run routes out of all the spots on the field so nothing ever looked the same.

 

[PatsRebuild]

No, it means, you're backed into a corner and have nothing. lmao

 

[jdlboot14]

Time to put some specific blame on BB for this year. I know it's sacrilegious around here, but it's fact...
1. I believe BB was legitimately unprepared for Brady's departure, and fell into a bit of a doldrum. Some claim he master-planned the whole thing to get Cam cheap... I think he second guessed and made a late switch, in fear of perception that if Stid wasn't great, his legacy would falter.
Problem is, we're no better off now at the QB position. We still don't really know what Stid is, but we know Cam isn't an answer. We'll have to start over next year again.
2. He has not sufficiently handled the departure of Gronk. Going back 2 seasons now, he has put the team in a very disadvantaged state with the lack of TE. And basically "Foxboro-flu-ing" the 2 rookies from even working through rookie mistakes in this already burnt year.
3. He always tends to play loose with the transactions, but this would have been the year to stick to the young potentials to work through their growing pains (Like waiting to play Meyers & Harris). Too many up and downs off the PS let some guys get away (Rivers & Ford)
4. Once again his doghouse antics only disqualifies potentially productive players. We were vastly inexperienced and undermanned at LB to start. But he benches Wino, delays Uche & Jenning's start, and goes with out-of-position Bentley which probably cost us a couple games.
5. I realize opt-outs and injuries are out of anyones control, and this team was falling off in talent the last couple years, but being stubborn till the end with Cam doesn't sit well with me. There is NO value in it - except for BB's ego.

 

[Kontradiction]

Time to put some specific blame on BB for this year. I know it's sacrilegious around here, but it's fact...
1. I believe BB was legitimately unprepared for Brady's departure, and fell into a bit of a doldrum. Some claim he master-planned the whole thing to get Cam cheap... I think he second guessed and made a late switch, in fear of perception that if Stid wasn't great, his legacy would falter.
Problem is, we're no better off now at the QB position. We still don't really know what Stid is, but we know Cam isn't an answer. We'll have to start over next year again.
2. He has not sufficiently handled the departure of Gronk. Going back 2 seasons now, he has put the team in a very disadvantaged state with the lack of TE. And basically "Foxboro-flu-ing" the 2 rookies from even working through rookie mistakes in this already burnt year.
3. He always tends to play loose with the transactions, but this would have been the year to stick to the young potentials to work through their growing pains (Like waiting to play Meyers & Harris). Too many up and downs off the PS let some guys get away (Rivers & Ford)
4. Once again his doghouse antics only disqualifies potentially productive players. We were vastly inexperienced and undermanned at LB to start. But he benches Wino, delays Uche & Jenning's start, and goes with out-of-position Bentley which probably cost us a couple games.
5. I realize opt-outs and injuries are out of anyones control, and this team was falling off in talent the last couple years, but being stubborn till the end with Cam doesn't sit well with me. There is NO value in it - except for BB's ego.

It’s not sacrilege at all. This year’s draft aside (which is looking good so far), he didn’t draft well from 2013-2019. Izzo is maybe the worst starting TE in the league and the rookies, to date, have either been injured or have been non-factors in the little time they have seen the field. The WR corps is maybe the second worst in the league behind Philly. Meyers looks promising, but should be operating as the Y/slot receiver. When going up against some of the better corners in the league, such as Ramsey last week, he’s been completely shut down. Cam has been utter trash. His legs are done and it’s also had an effect on his mechanics, which are poor at best. Stidham was a 4th rounder who is simply not the guy who gives us the best chance to win with the way the offense is currently constructed. We have the best run-blocking OL in the NFL and Harris is a rising star as a RB. That’s how we need to hit defenses, which is the reason why Cam is still starting.

But, in the end, it’s only sacrilege to blame BB for this with a select number of posters on this forum. The rest of us saw this coming and have assigned blame appropriately. Some blame also needs to be thrown at Caserio and the scouting department as well.

 

[PatsRebuild]

It’s not sacrilege at all. This year’s draft aside (which is looking good so far), he didn’t draft well from 2013-2019. Izzo is maybe the worst starting TE in the league and the rookies, to date, have either been injured or have been non-factors in the little time they have seen the field. The WR corps is maybe the second worst in the league behind Philly. Meyers looks promising, but should be operating as the Y/slot receiver. When going up against some of the better corners in the league, such as Ramsey last week, he’s been completely shut down. Cam has been utter trash. His legs are done and it’s also had an effect on his mechanics, which are poor at best. Stidham was a 4th rounder who is simply not the guy who gives us the best chance to win with the way the offense is currently constructed. We have the best run-blocking OL in the NFL and Harris is a rising star as a RB. That’s how we need to hit defenses, which is the reason why Cam is still starting.

But, in the end, it’s only sacrilege to blame BB for this with a select number of posters on this forum. The rest of us saw this coming and have assigned blame appropriately. Some blame also needs to be thrown at Caserio and the scouting department as well.

Did you just say "he didn't draft well from 2013-2019" as he built a second dynasty and will have another team built through the draft into 2021?

I mean, how do we have the best OL in the league if he "didn't draft well"? Care to explain that one?

The entitlement you people show is astounding.

 

[Kontradiction]

Did you just say "he didn't draft well from 2013-2019" as he built a second dynasty and will have another team built through the draft into 2021?

I mean, how do we have the best OL in the league if he "didn't draft well"? Care to explain that one?

The entitlement you people show is astounding.

Those titles were won with a core that wasn’t drafted during that time. That core = McCourty (2010), Hightower (2012), Chung (2010), Gronk (2010), Edelman (2009), and of course Brady (2000). Those were the staples of the second dynasty. Then you have a laundry list of trades and FA signings. Revis, Browner, Hogan, Lewis, Butler, Van Noy, Blount, etc. The only two players you could really make an argument for would be Harmon and White, although the latter wasn’t really a part of the 2014 team, but did come up big in 2016. Of course, I’m really not sure why I’m debating this with you since you’re totally insane. I might toss you on the ignore list this time around. That list has zero people on there currently.

 

[PatsRebuild]

Time to put some specific blame on BB for this year. I know it's sacrilegious around here, but it's fact...
1. I believe BB was legitimately unprepared for Brady's departure, and fell into a bit of a doldrum. Some claim he master-planned the whole thing to get Cam cheap... I think he second guessed and made a late switch, in fear of perception that if Stid wasn't great, his legacy would falter.
Problem is, we're no better off now at the QB position. We still don't really know what Stid is, but we know Cam isn't an answer. We'll have to start over next year again.
2. He has not sufficiently handled the departure of Gronk. Going back 2 seasons now, he has put the team in a very disadvantaged state with the lack of TE. And basically "Foxboro-flu-ing" the 2 rookies from even working through rookie mistakes in this already burnt year.
3. He always tends to play loose with the transactions, but this would have been the year to stick to the young potentials to work through their growing pains (Like waiting to play Meyers & Harris). Too many up and downs off the PS let some guys get away (Rivers & Ford)
4. Once again his doghouse antics only disqualifies potentially productive players. We were vastly inexperienced and undermanned at LB to start. But he benches Wino, delays Uche & Jenning's start, and goes with out-of-position Bentley which probably cost us a couple games.
5. I realize opt-outs and injuries are out of anyones control, and this team was falling off in talent the last couple years, but being stubborn till the end with Cam doesn't sit well with me. There is NO value in it - except for BB's ego.

1. This is false. Tom Curran described Brady's feelings as being "marginalized" in 2019. BB walked from Brady after the Rams Super Bowl. In fact, everyone in the room after the SB where I was, said the same thing...."Time to hang it up, Tom, and go out on top".... BB was not happy he couldn't keep JimmyG. BB walked in 2019. Brady knew it. He was done. It's why he skipped OTAs. He then sabtoaged the 2019 season by being a jerk. This is true. His own teammates went to BB and basically said "we don't want to deal with him again in 2020"....Truth. Reported, corroborated, etc. I am imagining it was a player like a McCourty or a Chung type who got sick and tired of holding teams to 9 points every week an in offensive league were my dog can throw for 250 yards, blind and drunk. Sad, but true.

I think JimmyG was willing to take the short term extension he was offered by BB to bridge the Brady gap, so to speak. In other words, BB was fine paying JimmyG 8 mil as a back up in 2018, just to let Brady have won more go. Would they have won the SB with that? I don't know. Maybe the 8 million wouldn't have gone to Jason McCourty or another FA who helped them win it, or new money for a new contract for someone already on the team. Who knows.

2. Who replaced a HOF TE overnigh? Hilarious. It took KC years to backfill Tony Gonzalez with Kelce. Very hard position to get project.

3. Who is Ford? Isiah Ford? Wow. A little desperate in your argument, huh?

4. What is a "doghouse" antic?

5. This is debatable as I agree it's a mystery, but I don't think it has to do with BB's ego. I think it has to do with this thing called the pandemic. Newton is a lame duck band aid until they can get back to normal. When Ivan Fears comes out and says how odd all of this is, that should tell you something.

 

[PatsRebuild]

Those titles were won with a core that wasn’t drafted during that time. That core = McCourty (2010), Hightower (2012), Chung (2010), Gronk (2010), Edelman (2009), and of course Brady (2000). Those were the staples of the second dynasty. Then you have a laundry list of trades and FA signings. Revis, Browner, Hogan, Lewis, Butler, Van Noy, Blount, etc. The only two players you could really make an argument for would be Harmon and White, although the latter wasn’t really a part of the 2014 team, but did come up big in 2016. Of course, I’m really not sure why I’m debating this with you since you’re totally insane. I might toss you on the ignore list this time around. That list has zero people on there currently.

Halfway true...I can also name key pieces that came after those names like Jon Jones, Thuney, Mason, Andrews, Van Noy, etc. Tons of key pieces made those wins happen.

You're a snowflake deluxe. Congratulations.

 

[sb1]

Time to put some specific blame on BB for this year. I know it's sacrilegious around here, but it's fact...
1. I believe BB was legitimately unprepared for Brady's departure, and fell into a bit of a doldrum. Some claim he master-planned the whole thing to get Cam cheap... I think he second guessed and made a late switch, in fear of perception that if Stid wasn't great, his legacy would falter.
Problem is, we're no better off now at the QB position. We still don't really know what Stid is, but we know Cam isn't an answer. We'll have to start over next year again.
2. He has not sufficiently handled the departure of Gronk. Going back 2 seasons now, he has put the team in a very disadvantaged state with the lack of TE. And basically "Foxboro-flu-ing" the 2 rookies from even working through rookie mistakes in this already burnt year.
3. He always tends to play loose with the transactions, but this would have been the year to stick to the young potentials to work through their growing pains (Like waiting to play Meyers & Harris). Too many up and downs off the PS let some guys get away (Rivers & Ford)
4. Once again his doghouse antics only disqualifies potentially productive players. We were vastly inexperienced and undermanned at LB to start. But he benches Wino, delays Uche & Jenning's start, and goes with out-of-position Bentley which probably cost us a couple games.
5. I realize opt-outs and injuries are out of anyones control, and this team was falling off in talent the last couple years, but being stubborn till the end with Cam doesn't sit well with me. There is NO value in it - except for BB's ego.

Stidham will much more likely be out of the league shortly than amount to anything with the Patriots. I wouldn't worry about him. With Cam we got a very inconsistent QB but a great teammate and someone who has kept us more or less competitive even with his limitations. IT was a low risk high reward signing. You make a signing like that 10 times out of 10.

ALso we have no idea why Uche and Wino had limited playing time and you don't either. Also have no idea why you're bringing up Ford at all lol.

 

[JMC00]

SB 49 vs Legion of Boom

2016 28-3 comeback greatest game ever

2018 AFCCG vs Chiefs

He had a good 4th qtr against Seattle.

28-3. They were in that hole because he wasn't good for 3 quarters. Even spotted them 7 points.

AFCCG. Ya he made some clutch 3rd throws but he threw a terrible pick in the endzone and was lucky Dee Ford was offside or he would have thrown a game ending pick.

 

[Guts]

He had a good 4th qtr against Seattle.

28-3. They were in that hole because he wasn't good for 3 quarters. Even spotted them 7 points.

AFCCG. Ya he made some clutch 3rd throws but he threw a terrible pick in the endzone and was lucky Dee Ford was offside or he would have thrown a game ending pick.

Football is 60 minutes.

 

[Sam Bam Cunningham]

It’s not sacrilege at all. This year’s draft aside (which is looking good so far), he didn’t draft well from 2013-2019. Izzo is maybe the worst starting TE in the league and the rookies, to date, have either been injured or have been non-factors in the little time they have seen the field. The WR corps is maybe the second worst in the league behind Philly. Meyers looks promising, but should be operating as the Y/slot receiver. When going up against some of the better corners in the league, such as Ramsey last week, he’s been completely shut down. Cam has been utter trash. His legs are done and it’s also had an effect on his mechanics, which are poor at best. Stidham was a 4th rounder who is simply not the guy who gives us the best chance to win with the way the offense is currently constructed. We have the best run-blocking OL in the NFL and Harris is a rising star as a RB. That’s how we need to hit defenses, which is the reason why Cam is still starting.

But, in the end, it’s only sacrilege to blame BB for this with a select number of posters on this forum. The rest of us saw this coming and have assigned blame appropriately. Some blame also needs to be thrown at Caserio and the scouting department as well.

You mean to say BB is human and not 100% perfect. Hard to swallow but its true and he would tell you the same thing, because he is honest. BB is one of the 5 greatest coaches of all time, but we have built him up to godlike status in NE, because we have such a hunger for heroes to look up to. We can honestly criticize him without taking away from his accomplishments. Does he have an ego...yes...most great ones do. Does his ego and self confidence get in the way sometimes for decision making...yes. Has he made egregious mistakes in player personnel evaluations over the last 3 years yes.
That being said he is one of the greatest...and most true Patriots fans appreciate everything he has done for this franchise and hope for better days ahead.

 

[PatsRebuild]

You mean to say BB is human and not 100% perfect. Hard to swallow but its true and he would tell you the same thing, because he is honest. BB is one of the 5 greatest coaches of all time, but we have built him up to godlike status in NE, because we have such a hunger for heroes to look up to. We can honestly criticize him without taking away from his accomplishments. Does he have an ego...yes...most great ones do. Does his ego and self confidence get in the way sometimes for decision making...yes. Has he made egregious mistakes in player personnel evaluations over the last 3 years yes.
That being said he is one of the greatest...and most true Patriots fans appreciate everything he has done for this franchise and hope for better days ahead.

I mean, I agree with you, but people outside NE wonder why the media and some fans hate him so much when he is the guy who made this happen.

It's sort of a mental illness by the media and then the people that take cues from that media are just as bad. Half of this board is in that group.

This is like Celtics fans being enraged at Red Auerback in 1986. Absolutely bizarre to think about.

 

[PatsRebuild]

He had a good 4th qtr against Seattle.

28-3. They were in that hole because he wasn't good for 3 quarters. Even spotted them 7 points.

AFCCG. Ya he made some clutch 3rd throws but he threw a terrible pick in the endzone and was lucky Dee Ford was offside or he would have thrown a game ending pick.

Truth. I think what people miss is, the games he sucked in, he sucked in and he didn't fight back. That happened in every game he faced a good D in from 2007-2012 in the postseason. I mean, it almost looked like he was trying to lose the game at times.

But, yeah, I was really proud of him vs Seattle, obviously Atlanta, and the KC game was, IMO, his last Brady Stand. On the road, tough environment, etc, but yeah, he did some pretty bad things to get them in a bad position in the first place.

It's appalling to me that this is an offensive league, with all rules favoring offenses, special protections, etc, and somehow our D was maligned to protect his legacy.

For example, his horrible 1st half vs Atlanta, if the D doesn't shut the door midway through the 3rd qtr after a less than good performance by them as well the comeback isn't a reality. It wasn't just Brady. It was James White, the OL, Malcolm Mitchell, Amendola, Edelman, etc.

In fact, I honestly think after that SB win, that's really where his ego exploded. The comeback was so amazing, he thought it was all him. I can just picture Giselle in his ear all offseason. What's his face on 98.5 does a spot on impersonation.

 

[Sam Bam Cunningham]

I mean, I agree with you, but people outside NE wonder why the media and some fans hate him so much when he is the guy who made this happen.

It's sort of a mental illness by the media and then the people that take cues from that media are just as bad. Half of this board is in that group.

This is like Celtics fans being enraged at Red Auerback in 1986. Absolutely bizarre to think about.

It would be stupid for ANY true Patriots fan to hate BB. OK to become frustrated with some of his decisions or communication style, but other than Red Auerbach he is in a class by himself in the pantheon of Boston sports.

 

[sb1]

It would be stupid for ANY true Patriots fan to hate BB. OK to become frustrated with some of his decisions or communication style, but other than Red Auerbach he is in a class by himself in the pantheon of Boston sports.

I'd say there are two things that stain Belichick's legacy.

1) Spygate
2) Benching Malcolm Butler and giving up a sure Super Bowl win.

Other than that there's nothing to hate at all about BB. Arguably the greatest coach of all time.

 

[Guts]

I'd say there are two things that stain Belichick's legacy.

1) Spygate
2) Benching Malcolm Butler and giving up a sure Super Bowl win.

Other than that there's nothing to hate at all about BB. Arguably the greatest coach of all time.

He is the GOAT. League designed for parity due to salary cap and yet other than 2000, 02, 08, 09, and this rebuild year always put the team in position to at least be in the mix.

 

[PatsRebuild]

I'd say there are two things that stain Belichick's legacy.

1) Spygate
2) Benching Malcolm Butler and giving up a sure Super Bowl win.

Other than that there's nothing to hate at all about BB. Arguably the greatest coach of all time.

Spygate is a myth perpetuated by Goodell after a rule change on 9.6.06 that was not voted on by the league. Mike Tomlin tries to interfere with a live play and gets a 100K fine. It's an insult to my intelligence especially after learning the facts after Goodell did what he did.

This is like saying Deflategate stains Brady. It's embarrassing, really. Misinformation via the interwebs has made our country dumb. Congratulations.

As for Butler, he dug his own grave and he was enabled by selfish Brady. I question if he even had the flu. I bet he didn't. I bet he saw the gameplan, he wasn't going to be used much, faked the flu in retalation for being insulted being offered 8 mil per after BB made him a millionaire, pulling him out of a Popeye's with a Div 2 college degree in Bama.

It's laughable to me that BB made these guys millionaires, and somehow in your brain, the millionaires are victims. Seek the help you need.

 

[PatsRebuild]

He is the GOAT. League designed for parity due to salary cap and yet other than 2000, 02, 08, 09, and this rebuild year always put the team in position to at least be in the mix.

He's so great as GM and Coach, the league hired a commissioner to try to cheat him and our team.