OT: Report: Lamar Jackson is wearing out his welcome in Baltimore

[mgteich]

The Ravens organization probably thinks so.

Either way, I think it’s really rare that a club is going to get rid of their coach when they’re having success unless the coach leaves on his own.

They might get rid of their coach because of his 2nd half game plan and play calling.

 

[Wozzy]

Take away his legs and Lamar becomes Brian Hoyer, maybe a shade worse.

Anyone trading for him now is a moron… but as a Pat’s fan I fully endorse the Dolphins or Jets doing so.

 

[Wozzy]

As I read this, I was thinking KC should be thinking the same thing with Mahomes. They could get a nice haul from the Jets who would gladly pick up his monster contract.

No way, Mahomes is a passer first and foremost. He can run, but it’s not entirely why he’s successful like Lamar… he doesn’t have to run.

 

[mike_usagisan]

They might get rid of their coach because of his 2nd half game plan and play calling.

I don’t disagree, but I think this is more one of those media/fan narratives and doesn’t really happen in real life.

 

[Huckleberry1]

I agree with your post at the high level, but I also think at the time Rehbein advocated for Brady I feel there was NFW that BB projected him as the guy who would take Bledsoe's job. I feel BB probably did what he always did, wanted a training camp arm and 'project QB' for the offensive coaches to work with. He was probably thinking the same way he did when he signed guys like Kevin O'Connell or Rohan Davey, why not burn a 6th...

I agree with that. I don't believe that Belichick saw what Brady was going to turn into, I think he saw him as a back up, but when Rehbein died and Belichick decided to keep 4 quarterbacks Belichick decided to run the quarterback room that season. And imo what Brady figured out immediately was that Belichick wanted a quarterback who read the field and options exactly the way Belichick did, and he made himself into the quarterback Belichick wanted on the field, because he made every decision the way Belichick would, as opposed to Bledsoe, whose philosophy was " just huck it," and who thought his arm would bail him out if every situation. The best example I ever saw of this was on the Monday Morning Quarterback show with Jaworski and Merrill Hogg, the day after they beat Pittsburgh for the AFC Championship. On that they gave an example where Brady was quarterback, it was 3rd and long, and Pitt was in a specific defense for the situation. Brady dropped back, saw his downfield receivers were covered, dumped it underneath for a few yards and Faulk worked through the **** and got the first down. That continued the drive and I think they got points from it. Then they showed a situation in the second half, Bledsoe was in for Brady, again it was 3rd and long in the same area of the field and Pitt ran the same defensive set for the play. Bledsoe dropped back, the deep receivers were covered, Faulk was open underneath, and Bledsoe hucked it at Troy Brown who was double covered down the sidelines, and the Steelers defensive back knocked it away and they had to punt. To me this was the classic example of the difference between Brady and Bledsoe, and ultimately the reason Belichick chose Brady over Bledsoe, as Brady was going to be the guy who would always make the decision Belichick wanted made, and Bledsoe was just going to huck it. I think it took a number of years for Belichick to realize that Brady was special, and he never treated him like it.

 

[Huckleberry1]

There have been so many stories, it's hard to pick something to believe. But the Yoko theory does make sense. Tom told Gisselle what was going on and she didn't like it. In fact, Giselle started speaking for Tom as described in this meeting with Bob Kraft where the origin of "Johnny Foxboro" began. Bob set up a meeting when Tom initially stated he wanted out after the 2017 Super Bowl loss to the Eagles:

"Soon after, Benedict writes, Kraft summoned Brady and his wife Gisele Bündchen to his home for a discussion. Bündchen took up for Brady. After pointing out how much Brady had done for the organization:

She also pointed out how ridiculous it was that after all these years, Belichick still treated Brady like "f****** Johnny Foxboro." It was bad enough to never voice approval. It was ******** to still be dressing down the most accomplished quarterback in league history during team meetings and treating his personal trainer and best friend like some kind of outcast.

When the conversation shifted to the future, Brady and Bündchen indicated it was time for them to make some changes that were in the best interest of their family. Among other things, they were contemplating a change of scenery."

As the article later points out, Bob was initially reluctant to allow Tom to leave, but later agreed if Tom still wanted out. Tom decided to return to NE under his conditions. This was why he was absent during the 2018 off-season. Bob was also going to lobby with Bill to "lighten up". Meanwhile, BB had a trade in place with Detroit for Gronk which not only pissed Gronk off, but blocked the trade.

New book reveals how close Tom Brady came to leaving Patriots after Super Bowl loss to Eagles

Tom Brady eventually left the Patriots after 20 seasons and six Super Bowl titles, but as Tom E. Curran writes, Brady's exit almost took place two years earlier after a Super Bowl loss to the Eagles.

sports.yahoo.com

Even in the situation you describe Giselle was just repeating what Brady was telling her about the way Belichick was treating him, she wasn't just going to Kraft on her own and making **** up. . And even I had heard stories during the dynasty years that Belichick would walk past Brady in the halls and not even acknowledge him, which, if true, demonstrate just what a douchebag Belichick could be.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Even in the situation you describe Giselle was just repeating what Brady was telling her about the way Belichick was treating him, she wasn't just going to Kraft on her own and making **** up. . And even I had heard stories during the dynasty years that Belichick would walk past Brady in the halls and not even acknowledge him, which, if true, demonstrate just what a douchebag Belichick could be.

Correct. She's just going by what Brady had told her and she had her opinion on it which may have influenced Tom. We all talk about work with family and then they have opinions.

Regarding walking past people, I believe BB was doing that to Mayo as well in 2023. Apparently, Bill did not approve of Mayo having he successor clause. Also I heard O'Brien as well.

 

[rochrist]

Take away his legs and Lamar becomes Brian Hoyer, maybe a shade worse.

Anyone trading for him now is a moron… but as a Pat’s fan I fully endorse the Dolphins or Jets doing so.

Well, to be fair, Lamar has a better arm than Brian. But passing skill-wise you might be right.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Correct. She's just going by what Brady had told her and she had her opinion on it which may have influenced Tom. We all talk about work with family and then they have opinions.

Regarding walking past people, I believe BB was doing that to Mayo as well in 2023. Apparently, Bill did not approve of Mayo having he successor clause. Also I heard O'Brien as well.

He had a good reason with Mayo. Belichick put him on his staff and Mayo went behind his back to succeed him. If Kraft wanted him to replace Belichick he should have had the balls to fire Belichick then and make Mayo the coach. Kraft has the right to do what he did, but that doesn't make it right. What Mayo did was completely unethical.

Belichick had no reason to treat Brady like that. Vrabel is right in demanding that everyone treat everyone who works there with dignity.

 

[1960Pats]

**** Rehbein made him pick the GOAT, otherwise IMO it would not have happened.

Even when it did happen Bill waited until pick #199 to draft him.
If BB had any inclination that Brady would turn out great (as Rehbein did) then he wouldn't have waited so long to take him.

 

[Grogan14]

The Ravens organization probably thinks so.

Either way, I think it’s really rare that a club is going to get rid of their coach when they’re having success unless the coach leaves on his own.

Andy Reid with the Eagles

 

[mike_usagisan]

Andy Reid with the Eagles

Yeah, that’s kind of as close as I can find. But when Reid was fired, Vick was 32 and clearly toward the end. They hadn’t won a playoff game in several years and had had two losing seasons.

That feels pretty different from having a younger MVP-level QB and a coach who had the team deep in the playoffs the year prior.

I think if any team might make a change, it might be the Bengals. But the team is so cheap, they probably won’t want to pay two coaches at once.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

He had a good reason with Mayo. Belichick put him on his staff and Mayo went behind his back to succeed him. If Kraft wanted him to replace Belichick he should have had the balls to fire Belichick then and make Mayo the coach. Kraft has the right to do what he did, but that doesn't make it right. What Mayo did was completely unethical.

FWIW reporting has Kraft making that decision on the contract clause on his own. Plus it's kinda hard to square the Machiavellian attitude he would need here with the Mayo we saw in 2024.

In any case, the clauses have existed for a long time (BB had one with the NYJ), so, in theory at least, I have no problem with them.

 

[Bill Lee]

Even in the situation you describe Giselle was just repeating what Brady was telling her about the way Belichick was treating him, she wasn't just going to Kraft on her own and making **** up. . And even I had heard stories during the dynasty years that Belichick would walk past Brady in the halls and not even acknowledge him, which, if true, demonstrate just what a douchebag Belichick could be.

Since we have an entire forum to discuss it, all I'll say is Bill's actions late in his stay here and ever since then show that he's high on his own supply, and it's not too big a leap to say that was the case for quite a long time before his departure from here.

 

[Huckleberry1]

FWIW reporting has Kraft making that decision on the contract clause on his own. Plus it's kinda hard to square the Machiavellian attitude he would need here with the Mayo we saw in 2024.

In any case, the clauses have existed for a long time (BB had one with the NYJ), so, in theory at least, I have no problem with them.

Kraft wouldn't have made it without Mayo's consent, and I'm almost positive that Parcells knew and approved of the deal Belichick made with Hess, he may even have recommended it believing he could pull the GM stunt he did that caused Belichick to leave.

Belichick clearly didn't approve of Mayo making that deal with Kraft, that's why he shut him out. There are ethical lines drawn in every business, imo Mayo crossed one when he made that deal without Belichick signing off on it.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Well, to be fair, Lamar has a better arm than Brian. But passing skill-wise you might be right.

I agree, Jackson had a stronger arm than Hoyer had.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Since we have an entire forum to discuss it, all I'll say is Bill's actions late in his stay here and ever since then show that he's high on his own supply, and it's not too big a leap to say that was the case for quite a long time before his departure from here.

It's nice to be able to comment on it without it turning into Armageddon.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Belichick clearly didn't approve of Mayo making that deal with Kraft, that's why he shut him out. There are ethical lines drawn in every business, imo Mayo crossed one when he made that deal without Belichick signing off on it.

You are correct. There were reports that Bill didn’t approve of Mayo succeeding. We found out why.

 

[lancerman]

Well, to be fair, Lamar has a better arm than Brian. But passing skill-wise you might be right.

It's a dumb comparison anyways by someone who barely watches Lamar. He's a very good passer. Dude has a 101 career passer rating, had 41 passing TD's a season ago, had a top 10 all time Y/A. A top 5 all time passing TD% a top 10 all time INT%. He's legitimately a very elite passer who also can run.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

He has a Cannon, not sure what's going on with him.