If you were Kraft and this season doesn’t improve, do you move on from Bill after this season?

[PATSYLICIOUS]

ben johnson, mcvay,

Now, if a guy like mcvay suddenly becomes available ill admit that changes things. if you are moving on from bb youd better be damn sure of who you’re bringing in. Things can just as easily get worse as they can get better if we are just moving on in frustration without a solid plan.

 

[StockingAnarchyNumber12]

Now, if a guy like mcvay suddenly becomes available ill admit that changes things. if you are moving on from bb youd better be damn sure of who you’re bringing in. Things can just as easily get worse as they can get better if we are just moving on in frustration without a solid plan.

I think we need a younger mind. I question if our coach connects with the modern crop of players. Mcvay would be good.

 

[btdrnks]

Absolutely not. To suggest he should be fired is ridiculous.

 

[203Pat]

ben johnson, mcvay,

I would love McVay were he to become available but Ben Johnson is the guy I really want us to target. Granted the Lions have more offensive talent but he caters the offense to what works for Goff. Goff is a better QB than Mac is but he is still somewhat limited in areas and Johnson finds ways around that to help him succeed.

 

[Steve102]

Agreed. To me, they still have to spend next year on offense, whether it's for Mac or a 1st round QB. Go after Higgins and maybe Jeudy and maybe Evans and find a f-ing tackle. If that elevates Mac, great. if not, have a rookie QB that can step in when Mac craps the bed.

All that is just on Bill's lap IMO. He's completely mismanaged the offensive side of the ball via FA and the draft. I am pretty high on Higgins, but Jeudy feels like more of the same to me. I don't get everyone's obsession with him. I reserve the right to come around, but I don't get it yet.

 

[203Pat]

Absolutely not. To suggest he should be fired is ridiculous.

Yeah let's just hope what we have seen the last 4 years is an outlier and not the norm.

 

[upstater1]

What is it about McVay that impresses people? He went 5 and 12 last year.

He was thoroughly depantsed by Belichick just 4 1/2 years ago.

Yes, he won a pattycake Super Bowl in which both teams played like dreck but since then he is 7-14. Not very good. He has stars all over the field as well. Stafford, Cupp, a bunch of good #2 WRs, Aaron Donald.

 

[mike_usagisan]

All that is just on Bill's lap IMO. He's completely mismanaged the offensive side of the ball via FA and the draft. I am pretty high on Higgins, but Jeudy feels like more of the same to me. I don't get everyone's obsession with him. I reserve the right to come around, but I don't get it yet.

I don't think it's just Higgins though. We need to double dip at WR, if not Jeudy, someone else.

The only place I cut Bill slack is I just don't see the WR he should have targeted in free agency last year that would have made the difference. Lazzard seemed like the top choice and he seemed pretty committed to the Jets. And we don't draft high enough for a premier WR draft pick. And the high priced free agent OTs aren't really working out that well, so sticking with Brown and someone in the draft was the way to go. I just don't want them to be complacent this off season, whether that's Bill making the call or someone else. No more buying cheap on the Parkers of the world.

 

[upstater1]

All that is just on Bill's lap IMO. He's completely mismanaged the offensive side of the ball via FA and the draft. I am pretty high on Higgins, but Jeudy feels like more of the same to me. I don't get everyone's obsession with him. I reserve the right to come around, but I don't get it yet.

People keep saying this but other than taking Tyquan Thornton I want to know about the mismanagement. What exactly are you advociating? He made a bad pick for WR in the 2nd round. Acknowledged. Is that complete mismanagement?

Is there any other team that has spent more or allocated more resources (draft, etc.) on receiving and OL in the last 3 years? I actually believe in this OL and think it has a lot of talent. I think the QB makes them look horrible, the complete reverse of a QB making the OL look good. We have allocated a ton of resources to the OL and with a decent QB, they'd look a helluva lot better than playing in front of the guy who panics and runs out of the pocket right into the head of a pass rush. He is Zach Wilson without the legs.

As for receivers: Algholor, Bourne, Parker, Hunter Henry, Gesicki, Jonnu Smith, Smith-Schuster. Seems we have spent a ton in free agency, but we can't find a #1. And that's because they aren't available in free agency.

So what would have been a better alternative?

 

[upstater1]

I don't think it's just Higgins though. We need to double dip at WR, if not Jeudy, someone else.

The only place I cut Bill slack is I just don't see the WR he should have targeted in free agency last year that would have made the difference. Lazzard seemed like the top choice and he seemed pretty committed to the Jets. And the high priced free agent OTs aren't really working out that well, so sticking with Brown and someone in the draft was the way to go. I just don't want them to be complacent this off season, whether that's Bill making the call or someone else. No more buying cheap on the Parkers of the world.

This is the problem right there. There wasn't anyone available the prior year either. At the very least we got out of the Algholor and Jonnu Smith contracts. You should see the teams stuck with $18m a year 3rd WRs from prior FAs.

Let's face the news: #1 WRs are NEVER EVER in the FA market any longer. You either draft for them or give up 2 premium picks for one, and that's only IF the WR wants to come to your team at all. Let's face it: Tyreek Hill would not have come to new England. So what are you left with? Trading for Higgins. Trading for Jeudy. Hoping they want to come. Or drafting a guy you hit on.

 

[203Pat]

What is it about McVay that impresses people? He went 5 and 12 last year.

He was thoroughly depantsed by Belichick just 4 1/2 years ago.

Yes, he won a pattycake Super Bowl in which both teams played like dreck but since then he is 7-14. Not very good. He has stars all over the field as well. Stafford, Cupp, a bunch of good #2 WRs, Aaron Donald.

He took 2 different QBs to the Super Bowl. He took a 4-12 team then went 55-26 in his first 5 years. Calling any Super Bowl win a patty cake is an embassingly bad take. The guy is a phenomenal coach and has a skeleton crew at 2-2 right now.

 

[203Pat]

People keep saying this but other than taking Tyquan Thornton I want to know about the mismanagement. What exactly are you advociating? He made a bad pick for WR in the 2nd round. Acknowledged. Is that complete mismanagement?

Is there any other team that has spent more or allocated more resources (draft, etc.) on receiving and OL in the last 3 years? I actually believe in this OL and think it has a lot of talent. I think the QB makes them look horrible, the complete reverse of a QB making the OL look good. We have allocated a ton of resources to the OL and with a decent QB, they'd look a helluva lot better than playing in front of the guy who panics and runs out of the pocket right into the head of a pass rush. He is Zach Wilson without the legs.

As for receivers: Algholor, Bourne, Parker, Hunter Henry, Gesicki, Jonnu Smith, Smith-Schuster. Seems we have spent a ton in free agency, but we can't find a #1. And that's because they aren't available in free agency.

So what would have been a better alternative?

The mismanagement is not putting any true top dollar resources into the offense. Trade up and get a blue chip QB or receiver or trade for one of the 2 or 3 legit number 1 receivers that seem to be available every offseason. Sign a real tackle in free agency. Not Riley Reiff.

As for receivers, those guys suck. Hunter Henry and a few flashes from Bourne are the only ones out of that group that produced. Stop looking for deals and pay up.

 

[chasa]

People keep saying this but other than taking Tyquan Thornton I want to know about the mismanagement. What exactly are you advociating? He made a bad pick for WR in the 2nd round. Acknowledged. Is that complete mismanagement?

Is there any other team that has spent more or allocated more resources (draft, etc.) on receiving and OL in the last 3 years? I actually believe in this OL and think it has a lot of talent. I think the QB makes them look horrible, the complete reverse of a QB making the OL look good. We have allocated a ton of resources to the OL and with a decent QB, they'd look a helluva lot better than playing in front of the guy who panics and runs out of the pocket right into the head of a pass rush. He is Zach Wilson without the legs.

As for receivers: Algholor, Bourne, Parker, Hunter Henry, Gesicki, Jonnu Smith, Smith-Schuster. Seems we have spent a ton in free agency, but we can't find a #1. And that's because they aren't available in free agency.

So what would have been a better alternative?

Letting Myers Walk and instead signing Juju
Cole Strange in round 1
Redoing Jonnu's contract adding a TON of dead money before he even played.
Having Patricia be Offensive Coordinator essentially wasting a year of being able to evaluate Mac with a real offense.
Not making a legitimate office for Dhop
Not making a play for any of the other receivers that Moved.
Only drafting bust receivers with injury issues.
Sending out Olinemen away for pennies on the dollar.

BB has made some good calls throughout the years (letting JC Jackson get a brinks truck from the Chargers) but he's also made a ton of really bad calls. The team's talent level is super low.

 

[PatsFan2]

No

Ship Mac Gump out of town and drop him off in New York.

That MFer was laughing on the sideline when Zappe went in.

He was crying that's how he laughs.

 

[upstater1]

He took 2 different QBs to the Super Bowl. He took a 4-12 team then went 55-26 in his first 5 years. Calling any Super Bowl win a patty cake is an embassingly bad take. The guy is a phenomenal coach and has a skeleton crew at 2-2 right now.

That Super Bowl was an embarrassment. The players weren't hitting; the offenses were inept. One of the worst played Super Bowls ever. You're making a lot of excuses for McVay here. I don't think he's anywhere near as good a coach as Belichick even now.

 

[Rob0729]

This is the problem right there. There wasn't anyone available the prior year either. At the very least we got out of the Algholor and Jonnu Smith contracts. You should see the teams stuck with $18m a year 3rd WRs from prior FAs.

Let's face the news: #1 WRs are NEVER EVER in the FA market any longer. You either draft for them or give up 2 premium picks for one, and that's only IF the WR wants to come to your team at all. Let's face it: Tyreek Hill would not have come to new England. So what are you left with? Trading for Higgins. Trading for Jeudy. Hoping they want to come. Or drafting a guy you hit on.

They might have been able to trade for AJ Brown or Hollywood Brown. The latter is clearly not as good as the former, but far better than what the Pats have.

 

[mike_usagisan]

This is the problem right there. There wasn't anyone available the prior year either. At the very least we got out of the Algholor and Jonnu Smith contracts. You should see the teams stuck with $18m a year 3rd WRs from prior FAs.

Let's face the news: #1 WRs are NEVER EVER in the FA market any longer. You either draft for them or give up 2 premium picks for one, and that's only IF the WR wants to come to your team at all. Let's face it: Tyreek Hill would not have come to new England. So what are you left with? Trading for Higgins. Trading for Jeudy. Hoping they want to come. Or drafting a guy you hit on.

Yep. I think we have to go for Higgins because he might be the only guy available with major upside. And I think the Bengals are willing to let him walk because of all the money they threw at Burrows. I don't know how many years Evans has left, but I feel like he's the guy Bill would target instead.

Or look for someone on a trade, even though it's going to be pricey both in terms of picks and salary.

 

[mike_usagisan]

They might have been able to trade for AJ Brown or Hollywood Brown. The latter is clearly not as good as the former, but far better than what the Pats have.

Yep, the AJ Brown trade was the one we should have made.

 

[Rob0729]

Yep. I think we have to go for Higgins because he might be the only guy available with major upside. And I think the Bengals are willing to let him walk because of all the money they threw at Burrows. Or look for someone on a trade, even though it's going to be pricey.

The thing is if the Bengals lose a couple more games before the trade deadline, they might trade Higgins. If they trade him this year, I think there is zero chance he is coming to New England.

 

[btdrnks]

I would love McVay were he to become available but Ben Johnson is the guy I really want us to target. Granted the Lions have more offensive talent but he caters the offense to what works for Goff. Goff is a better QB than Mac is but he is still somewhat limited in areas and Johnson finds ways around that to help him succeed.

Unless he's bringing an top 10 QB with him he's not doing any better than Bill. The idea that any of these coaches would improve this team is laughable.