Impact WR….whom do you want?

[Ivan]

Because in the history of Belichick, he does not go after a bunch of high end receivers in the offseason. He probably thinks the receiving corp was fine and got Ju ju to replace who left. Why people think Bill is going to do something he never does is odd to me.

If true we can all look forward to coming In last in the AFCE. And if they are ok with sucking year in and year out then maybe it is time for regime change. I don’t believe that’s the case, but if it is then it’s completely unacceptable.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Because in the history of Belichick, he does not go after a bunch of high end receivers in the offseason. He probably thinks the receiving corp was fine and got Ju ju to replace who left. Why people think Bill is going to do something he never does is odd to me.

If BB still believes you don't need wide receivers to win in 2023 then he is stuck in the dinosaur age and his time has passed.

I've criticized BB for his drafting errors and his mad scientist experiment using an inexperienced Matt Patricia as offensive play-caller with established failure Joe Judge as the bumbling offensive helper and that criticism was justified. But BB is still at the top of his game as far as coaching the defense goes and I've never accused him of being stupid. Making mistakes in judgment yes, but he's not blatantly ignorant of reality.

BB has admitted reality through his actions. BB 'internally' admitted his own mistakes and moved on as demonstrated by him shedding Patricia and hiring BOB this offseason as well as getting rid of his WORST free agent blunder by trading away Jonnu Smith.

So yes, I'd agree that BB hasn't valued the WR position in the past. But surely he will course correct his thinking for the current nfl 'meta' in which statistical analysis shows that WRs rank behind only QBs and CBs as the 3rd most valuable position contributing to winning.



I expect the Patriots to either trade for former Alabama wideout Jerry Jeudy or take a WR in the first two rounds of the 2023 NFL draft to address this critical position.

 

[Ivan]

If BB still believes you don't need wide receivers to win in 2023 then he is stuck in the dinosaur age and his time has passed.

I've criticized BB for his drafting errors and his mad scientist experiment using an inexperienced Matt Patricia as offensive play-caller with established failure Joe Judge as the bumbling offensive helper and that criticism was justified. But BB is still at the top of his game as far as coaching the defense goes and I've never accused him of being stupid. Making mistakes in judgment yes, but he's not blatantly ignorant of reality.

BB has admitted reality through his actions. BB 'internally' admitted his own mistakes and moved on as demonstrated by him shedding Patricia and hiring BOB this offseason as well as getting rid of his WORST free agent blunder by trading away Jonnu Smith.

So yes, I'd agree that BB hasn't valued the WR position in the past. But surely he will course correct his thinking for the current nfl 'meta' in which statistical analysis shows that WRs rank behind only QBs and CBs as the 3rd most valuable position contributing to winning.

View attachment 50606

I expect the Patriots to either trade for former Alabama wideout Jerry Jeudy or take a WR in the first two rounds of the 2023 NFL draft to address this critical position.

If Belichick can swing a trade for Jeudy or Hopkins then it allows them to ignore WR in the 1st round. If they can’t get that done then a WR in the 1st is in play. I would be really surprised if they just went for depth and camp bodies.

 

[Jangles]

If Belichick can swing a trade for Jeudy or Hopkins then it allows them to ignore WR in the 1st round. If they can’t get that done then a WR in the 1st is in play. I would be really surprised if they just went for depth and camp bodies.

After N’keal Harry Belichick shouldn’t be allowed to draft receivers

Dude would have been a bust in the 6th round.

 

[JMC00]

I'm fully on trade down, pick up some picks and take Zay Flowers train

 

[PatsFan2]

I'm fully on trade down, pick up some picks and take Zay Flowers train

Jordan Addison ain't bad either.

 

[Ivan]

After N’keal Harry Belichick shouldn’t be allowed to draft receivers

Dude would have been a bust in the 6th round.

Belichick has given Groh and Wolf a much bigger role in drafting the past couple of year, and the results have been better, I trust them to make a good pick,

 

[Ivan]

I'm fully on trade down, pick up some picks and take Zay Flowers train

Initially I wasn’t really looking at Flowers in the first, but he would fill a serious need by his ability to get open instantly, and his explosiveness after the catch. It would be like having Marcus Jones as a receiver on the field all the time, and he can play ST’s as well.

 

[PowerRunRevival]

I'm fully on trade down, pick up some picks and take Zay Flowers train

what do you think the Pats could pick up when moving back? Or what would you want in a trade back?

If the Pats are going receiver in the first, I'd want them to trade up in the second to get one of the top 5 tackles or corners.

 

[RIpats88]

I’ve come to the conclusion that Bill is all set with the receiving corps. Anything major going forward would be a surprise to me. I definitely could see us drafting some WR’s or a TE in the draft for future contracts and what-not. I wouldn’t be surprised if Bill sees JJSS as the WR 1, and Gesicki as your primary slot. You’d have JJSS, KB, HH, and Gesicki on the field together quite a bit. Then you’d mix in DP and TT. That’s not toooo bad.

It's mediocre is what it is. Are any teams gameplanning for juju or Henry or Bourne? I don't think so.

Edelman/gronk had to be gameplanned for. They were true #1s.

 

[cmasspatsfan]

If Belichick can swing a trade for Jeudy or Hopkins then it allows them to ignore WR in the 1st round. If they can’t get that done then a WR in the 1st is in play. I would be really surprised if they just went for depth and camp bodies.

I'd like them to get Jeudy and take a top CB in the first, they can get line help in later rounds. If they don't trade for a WR I'd be thrilled if they actually got s top receiver in the first.

 

[Ivan]

I'd like them to get Jeudy and take a top CB in the first, they can get line help in later rounds. If they don't trade for a WR I'd be thrilled if they actually got s top receiver in the first.

I’m fine with that, I’m fine with a number of different approaches, just as long as they do something serious. They are all good at depth across the team, they are in great shape financially, and they put themselves right in the mix if they make a couple of good movies.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

There is this fallacy in the NFL that if you go into the next season with the same players, you will get the same results. It does not work that way; you have to continuously upgrade your team just stay afloat. The Patriots have not upgraded their team and must be hoping to have a big draft. The problem is that BB is constitutionally unable to draft impact WRs, at least in the first few rounds and does not seem to be able to learn from his mistakes...so I see a problem this season.

 

[patfanken]

If BB still believes you don't need wide receivers to win in 2023 then he is stuck in the dinosaur age and his time has passed.

I've criticized BB for his drafting errors and his mad scientist experiment using an inexperienced Matt Patricia as offensive play-caller with established failure Joe Judge as the bumbling offensive helper and that criticism was justified. But BB is still at the top of his game as far as coaching the defense goes and I've never accused him of being stupid. Making mistakes in judgment yes, but he's not blatantly ignorant of reality.

BB has admitted reality through his actions. BB 'internally' admitted his own mistakes and moved on as demonstrated by him shedding Patricia and hiring BOB this offseason as well as getting rid of his WORST free agent blunder by trading away Jonnu Smith.

So yes, I'd agree that BB hasn't valued the WR position in the past. But surely he will course correct his thinking for the current nfl 'meta' in which statistical analysis shows that WRs rank behind only QBs and CBs as the 3rd most valuable position contributing to winning.

View attachment 50606

I expect the Patriots to either trade for former Alabama wideout Jerry Jeudy or take a WR in the first two rounds of the 2023 NFL draft to address this critical position.

 

[patfanken]

A couple of thoughts:

1. I think the offensive fiasco of last year was caused by Bill being determined to hire BOB as his OC. You cannot hire an OC just for one year, so he THOUGHT he could get by for a year with Patricia and Judge. CLEARLY he was in error.

2. But like you said, Bill KNOWS that when you are making hundreds of decisions, you are bound to make mistakes, and more than a few. What has set him apart is he is not afraid to acknowledge them and fix them. Agular gone, Smith, gone, Wynn gone, etc

3. The 3rd thing to at least THINK about is this. The long term plan. I believe that back in 2000 he had a 3 year plan to get the team into championship contention by year 4. The first year was to clear out the deadwood and get the cap in order. Result was a 5-11 record but was a better team at the end of the year than where we started at. By the end of the 2001 TC, he knew that Brady was the QB he wanted to run HIS offensive system. It really didn't fit Drew. Who knows WHEN they would have made the switch, but his injury made it moot. THAT championship not only came as a shock to US, but I bet to the coaching staff as well. We caught a LOT of breaks that year that led to getting a bye, etc. **** happens FOR us sometimes too. The stars aligned and we SHOCKED the world.

2002 We regressed a bit towards the mean, but in the end the team wasn't talented or DEEP enough to survive injuries and the 9-7 record reflected that. BUT by 2003 we WERE that wagon. It took until the FOURTH year for it all to come together. Players improved, talent was added, yada yada yada and the story was told

I see the SAME kind of improvement in the building of THIS team. Look at 2020 like 2000, yet we won 7 games. 2021 as a team that had a better record than the representative talent. AND last year, was an just an aberration. The talent wasn't great, the QB regressed, and the coaching on the offense just didn't work, and the OL was just awful Kind of amazing that they won 8 games and were in playoff contention on the last day of the season. when you think about it.

I actually LIKE how THIS off-season has gone....so far. We upgraded at the slot a bit, at least in my estimation. We replaced a mistake (smith) with a better version. We added at least some OL competition, and we resigned most of the our guys from a very good defense and most importantly vastly improved the offensive coaching staff. BUT the team is lacking a bit in high end talent, proven depth, and guys who are used to playing with each other.

I think we are STARTING to assemble a solid foundation of a championship caliber team. I'd like to think this will be a playoff team EXCEPT for the schedule. They will play 6 games against the best division in the league, PLUS they have to play the NFCE who had 3 playoff teams, PLUS all of the AFCW. That is a HORRENDOUS schedule. Easily the worst I can remember. That's NINE games against playoff teams PLUS 2 more against a good Jet team that MIGHT be the best team in the division....ON PAPER. OUCH!

So my goal this year is to be better than last year. Maybe not in the win loss area, but just how we see them. I want them to be in every game at the end against the best competition in the league. Maybe we get some breaks and get into the playoff, but more important than this is the eyeball test ARE they better. Is Mac a better version on 2021. Have we fixed the coaching element, etc

Finally it SHOULD all come together in that 4th year. The talent WILL be better with some high end talent added next March with all the cap space with have, AND between this draft and the next we will find 5 or 6 good players to add to the roster. THEN hopefully we will have a run of teams for 3 or 4 years that CAN compete for championships.

4. As for the THIS draft, I cannot see a WR in the first 3 picks, THOUGH I can see a TE picked in that area. The TE group is very good this year and all of our current TE group will be FA's next year. CB, OT and TE are my first priorities before you get to WR. Besides it usually takes a couple of years for young WR's to develop into stars. If you STILL feel you need to get better there, after this year, I think it would be better to add a proven one with all the cap space we will have.

 

[archstanton543]

A couple of thoughts:

1. I think the offensive fiasco of last year was caused by Bill being determined to hire BOB as his OC. You cannot hire an OC just for one year, so he THOUGHT he could get by for a year with Patricia and Judge. CLEARLY he was in error.

That makes no sense. Bill's plan was for the Matt/Judge combo to work out. If he wanted BoB all along, then he would have gotten him. You don't waste a year of your young QB's development by putting in a placeholder OC. The point you're making makes no logical sense.

 

[Ivan]

There is this fallacy in the NFL that if you go into the next season with the same players, you will get the same results. It does not work that way; you have to continuously upgrade your team just stay afloat. The Patriots have not upgraded their team and must be hoping to have a big draft. The problem is that BB is constitutionally unable to draft impact WRs, at least in the first few rounds and does not seem to be able to learn from his mistakes...so I see a problem this season.

I agree, building depth but not creating a true contender. I can excuse that the first couple of years of a rebuild, but 5 years is a reasonable time. to build a really good team, and they are in year 4. They need a couple of real upgrades or they will be no more than an average team looking in from the outside come January. To me the best case scenario is a trade for a really good WR, and then the best player at # 14, the only thing I’m really opposed to is not making a significant move. They have the $$$ room both now and going forward to make a move, so do it, at a minimum you will find out if the QB is worth the future $$$ at the position.

 

[BUSTAMOVE]

Same here. I don’t like passing on tackles, or great help on DL, but this roster, and the current state of play in the NFL you have to be able to keep up up or outplay opposing offenses, and I don’t see that ability with an offense that really threatens defenses.


Isaiah Wynn was a first round pick, how many playoff games did they win with him? Matt Light was a 2nd round pick, how many playoff games did they win with him? And the two receivers I named were a great possession receiver, and a smaller receiver who gets open instantly, nowhere in my off-season discussions have I talked about adding a WR to take the top off of defenses, because that’s Thornton’s role.

Watching draft prospect videos. Zay Flowers catches my eye every time.
You will always have an open receiver with him on the field
JSN also. But being injured all last year scares me.
Tired of drafting injury prone players in high rounds

 

[RIpats88]

In today's NFL having a #1 receiver is very important. I don't care how we get one but we need one. It's no coincidence the Bill, dolphins, eagles all improved when the team invested in a #1 receiver and their QBs improved massively.

You can't go into the season with Juju, Bourne, parker, Thornton as your top 4. That doesn't strike fear into opposing defenses.

If you add a #1 to that all of a sudden everyone falls into place.

 

[jdlboot14]

I'm starting to change my tune on this.
I'd be willing to grab Zay Flowers at #14. He is the next Steve Smith.
As long as the Patriot WR curse doesn't destroy him, he's going to be a dynamic playmaker.
He's the next Pats Slot type that we've been waiting for.
(Since JMD and MP and Brady are gone, as long as BB can stay out of BOB's way, our young WR's should flourish).
Make it happen!