We're on to the OFF-Season

[signbabybrady]

There is Tom Brady on one level, all alone, and there is every other QB who's played since Montana, on lower levels. People here say things like "People don't give Belichick credit for his wins" and the like, but they turn around an deride other top coaches for winning less with a lesser QB. It's as if people still can't admit that Brady makes that difference even after these past 3 years, and it's embarrassing to read.

I don't play the Brady vs Bill game they each are the greatest

 

[venecol]

He wasn't drafted. He was a UFA in 2018. Does it matter when he was a rookie, when he made AP and what team?

Your argument is the Pats haven't developed All Pros and they have in recent years.

Sure it matters when they were drafted, since the argument is over the quality of recent drafts. The fact Slater was an AP-2 in 2021 doesn't butress against that argument. At least JC was more recent, as were Gunner (2019) and Bailey (2019).

I lump UFA with draftees since they're in effect left overs of the draft and still rookies.

 

[crawhammer]

Reid has a .641 winning % vs Bill's .662% (which incl. 20 years w/ the GOAT). He's the only active coach that can catch Bill. He's 71 wins behind Halas' regular season wins (218) which Bill has yet to pass (20 behind). He could get there in 6 years when he's 70, though looking at his majestic roundness it's debatable he can last that long.

Bill's lost his fastball. He's the head coach of a team that has finished a combined 6-16 over the last 4 seasons without a playoff win.

 

[RIpats88]

I hate that bill is just deflecting blame all day In his conference. Hiring judge/Patricia is what he thought was best for the team, we spent the least cash in 3 years (kind of a shot at Kraft).

No responsibility taken... Hopefully behind the scenes he doesn't feel this way.

 

[PScottman]

It happened frequently... sometimes against 4.3 CBs.

Couldn't agree more.

Speed is irrelevant if the RT let their rusher to the QB in less than .2 seconds, the QB was told the deep pass was option five in progression by the OC (or worse a decoy), or the LT false started before the play even was run.

Judging the WRs after this year in a vacuum (i.e. ignoring the rest of the context of the myriad concerns about the offense) is about as bad as proclaiming the need to draft 8 more 1st round QBs just so we can all ***** when they're not the GOAT after 300 snaps.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Between 2010-2019 Pats had a ton of All Pro's. Lot's of recurring players, but they had at least 4 per year until 2019 (3).

I do notice an error that Cody Davis was added in 2020 (Pro Football Reference), but he did not make the All Pro team.

 

[Stu Pidassle]

I can't believe there is a BB v Tomlin debate.

You pro-Tomlin's are out of your tree. The BB hate has clouded your logic

Tomlin does have 1 sideline tackle to BB 0

 

[PScottman]

He's the head coach of a team that has finished a combined 6-16 over the last 4 seasons without a playoff win.

The Patriots only played 22 games in four years. Weird NFL schedule.

 

[crawhammer]

Ok so JC Jackson & Slater were 2nd team AP in '21. So, JC was the last drafted player to make AP-2 but not AP-1. Better than nothing. When was he drafted, in 2018?

The "special teamer" pro bowler, all pro, whatever, is the most worthless "award" in professional sports.

 

[crawhammer]

The Patriots only played 22 games in four years. Weird NFL schedule.

Doesn't diminish my point which is matter of fact.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Sure it matters when they were drafted, since the argument is over the quality of recent drafts.

Whos arguing? The last 3 drafts have been of high quality. Thats not up for debate.

Your question was the last All-Pro. It was JC in 2021 and was a rookie 3 years prior.

The fact Slater was an AP-2 in 2021 doesn't butress against that argument. At least JC was more recent, as were Gunner (2019) and Bailey (2019).

I didn't bring up Slater.

I lump UFA with draftees since they're in effect left overs of the draft and still rookies.

Agree.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Tomlin does have 1 sideline tackle to BB 0

LOL. BB would get trucked. Like Don Zimmer getting tossed by Pedro by the head.


Whats with Steeler coaches and that. Cowher almost did the same thing years ago.

 

[Love The Drake]

LOL. BB would get trucked. Like Don Zimmer getting tossed by Pedro by the head.


Whats with Steeler coaches and that. Cowher almost did the same thing years ago.

Tomlin would have never allowed those kick returns.
Just Saying.

 

[Jim Beankie]

McVay : boy Genius. I don’t think posters here understand how many losing seasons ‘better than BB coaches’ have… Payton went 7-9 two years in a row with Brees ? Tomlin « always makes the playoffs » : one SB trophy. List goes on.

*Payton 3 years in a row at 7-9

 

[Deus Irae]

McVay : boy Genius. I don’t think posters here understand how many losing seasons ‘better than BB coaches’ have… Payton went 7-9 two years in a row with Brees ? Tomlin « always makes the playoffs » : one SB trophy. List goes on.

Belichick has 7 losing seasons.

 

[upstater1]

*Payton 3 years in a row at 7-9

And I keep telling people that Harbaugh has 2 playoff wins in the last 10 years!

 

[Deus Irae]

*Payton 3 years in a row at 7-9

Belichick 3 year span:

6-10
7-9
7-9

 

[Jim Beankie]

Belichick:

6-10
7-9
7-9

He also had 2 5-11s "in a row." Looks like those are his 1st 3 years at CLE? I don't think BB had an arguably top 10 (maybe 20... anyway way up there) QB of all time like Payton did during those 3 7-9 years in a row.

 

[Deus Irae]

He also had 2 5-11s "in a row." Looks like those are his 1st 3 years at CLE? I don't think BB had an arguably top 10 (maybe 20... anyway way up there) QB of all time like Payton did during those 3 7-9 years in a row.

If the level of the QB matters, then every pro BB stat and comment should be starting with "But he had Brady....". And that's been a big part of the point of this exercise.


BB without Brady is a sub .500 head coach, yet people here are saying things like "But Payton had Brees"/"But Tomlin had Roethlisberger" as if that's supposed to be some magical reason that those coaches couldn't have down years. Brady just had his first losing season, because his head coach sat most of the team in much of the last game. But even Peyton and Montana had losing seasons after they'd had 13 win seasons, yet before they reached their NFL dotage (Granted, Montana's was in a shortened season, but he went 3-6).

And I don't point that out to belittle Belichick. I point that out to note that such context has to be taken into account, and that it's been a huge advantage for BB.

 

[Jim Beankie]

If the level of the QB matters, then every pro BB stat and comment should be starting with "But he had Brady....". And that's been a big part of the point of this exercise.


BB without Brady is a sub .500 head coach, yet people here are saying things like "But Payton had Brees"/"But Tomlin had Roethlisberger" as if that's supposed to be some magical reason that those coaches couldn't have down years. Brady just had his first losing season, because his head coach sat most of the team in much of the last game. But even Peyton and Montana had losing seasons after they'd had 13 win seasons, yet before they reached their NFL dotage (Granted, Montana's was in a shortened season, but he went 3-6).

And I don't point that out to belittle Belichick. I point that out to note that such context has to be taken into account, and that it's been a huge advantage for BB.

Yes, certainly. However, I'm still trying to figure out your point from "6-10, 7-9, 7-9." I mean I wouldn't call them down seasons for BB - that's the start of his HC career taking over a 3-13 team.