Game Day Thread Official Post Game Thread- Pats beat Arizona

[Lagaffe_07]

But is that on Mac or the defense completely falling apart? In the five losses (including the playoffs), the Pats gave up 27, 33, 33, and 47 points. Yes, the Miami game, seven came from a pick six. Jones could have had career games in both of the Bills' losses and still the Pats probably still lose. The Bills didn't punt once in either of those games.

People want to blame Jones for the losses at the end of the season yet ignore that the defense completely fell apart down the stretch.

We get it. It’s everybody fault but Mac.

 

[crawhammer]

Brady skews it big time . It's not gonna happen again. We got lucky. Leaving Brady we had

Rodgers (1)
Ben (2)
Eli (2)
Flacco
Brees(1)
Peak Manning (1)
Non peak Manning (1)
Foles
Mahomes
Stafford

Ben did not completely carry and had all RPO defense. Same goes with Eli, Stafford , foles, manning with broncos and flacco. So that's 7 out of 12 years . Let's say it's cherry picking it can still be 5 out of 12 .

My point is you need a great team and when you have a game manager pullibg above his weight to a certain extent we can win Superbowl , not consistently but occasionally.

Well, getting off the general quarterback debate, if we're just focusing on Mac and the Patriots given the current state of the AFC, which is loaded with good teams with excellent quarterbacks (Kansas City, Buffalo, Cincinnati, Baltimore, LA Chargers). We may have to add Miami to this list with Tua, and by next season when Watson is back up to speed, I'm adding Cleveland. KAN, BUF, CIN and BAL alone are going to present a major obstacle for the rest of the conference in the foreseeable future. So unless Mac can elevate his play significantly, I don't see the Patriots competing with the upper class of the AFC.

 

[Rob0729]

We get it. It’s everybody fault but Mac.

I am not saying it is not his fault anything. I am responding to someone who blamed Jones for all the losses down the stretch. I am pointing out the defense played a big role in those losses.

I will blame the defense for the losses to the Bills though. You don't make a team punt in two games and basically in the second game you let them score a TD on every meaningful drive, that is 100% the defense for the loss.

 

[crawhammer]

But is that on Mac or the defense completely falling apart? In the five losses (including the playoffs), the Pats gave up 27, 33, 33, and 47 points. Yes, the Miami game, seven came from a pick six. Jones could have had career games in both of the Bills' losses and still the Pats probably still lose. The Bills didn't punt once in either of those games.

People want to blame Jones for the losses at the end of the season yet ignore that the defense completely fell apart down the stretch.

Right, the defense stunk. Mac wasn't any good either. Buffalo is in a category of it's own, because they're in our division, and they are totally dominating us... that's a major problem.

 

[p8ryts]

Some good analysis from Dan Orlovsky. The second video shows where Matt Patricia the O-line Coach is a big problem with the o-line. He pointing out how the o-line keeps making the same mistakes with blocking assignments. The o-line coach should be coaching that up and fixing it. Obviously, they are not. Orlovsky claims this is basic stuff they are screwing up.

I don't know about blaming Patricia in this post. Do we know that the receiver or TE set to the right were not supposed to pick up the rusher? Maybe McDermott just off the bus missed his assignment. Maybe Mac should have seen the hot receiver to the right and thrown the ball instead of retreating. IDK, just to easy to say it's Patricia coaching and play calling.

 

[n6249c]

…so we might be expecting Kirk cousins or below standard of play .

Who else would be happy with that?

 

[Toofy]

Well, getting off the general quarterback debate, if we're just focusing on Mac and the Patriots given the current state of the AFC, which is loaded with good teams with excellent quarterbacks (Kansas City, Buffalo, Cincinnati, Baltimore, LA Chargers). We may have to add Miami to this list with Tua, and by next season when Watson is back up to speed, I'm adding Cleveland. KAN, BUF, CIN and BAL alone are going to present a major obstacle for the rest of the conference in the foreseeable future. So unless Mac can elevate his play significantly, I don't see the Patriots competing with the upper class of the AFC.

I also don't think we can consistently compete with Mac as franchise QB. I am saying we just need to build a solid team and do the QB carousel till we land a mahomes in draft or veteran or franchise QB on poor team wants to come here say herbert or Burrow . I don't want us to pay 30 million + dollar contract to anyone outside the top 7 QBs. It is similar to agholor or Jonnu contract and will hold us back for 3-4 years .

 

[Mike the Brit]

He could just as well have taken the second Patriots play from scrimmage.

Mac has made a nice throw for a first down and it's 1st-and-10. There are 4 Cardinals lined up with one, number 41, offset to the right. Trent Brown just looks straight ahead and blocks the man in front of him. Number 41 comes in behind the line completely unblocked and stops Stevenson in the backfield. My goodness!

 

[Rob0729]

He could just as well have taken the second Patriots play from scrimmage.

Mac has made a nice throw for a first down and it's 1st-and-10. There are 4 Cardinals lined up with one, number 41, offset to the right. Trent Brown just looks straight ahead and blocks the man in front of him. Number 41 comes in behind the line completely unblocked and stops Stevenson in the backfield. My goodness!

View attachment 48252

Looks like Strange isn't blocking anyone on that play.

 

[Stu Pidassle]

Brady skews it big time . It's not gonna happen again. We got lucky. Leaving Brady Superbowls we had

Rodgers (1)
Ben (2)
Eli (2)
Flacco
Brees(1)
Peak Manning (1)
Non peak Manning (1)
Foles
Mahomes
Stafford

Ben did not completely carry and had all pro defense. Same goes with Eli, Stafford , foles, manning with broncos and flacco. So that's 7 out of 12 years . Let's say it's cherry picking it can still be 5 out of 12 .

My point is you need a great team and when you have a game manager pullibg above his weight to a certain extent we can win Superbowl , not consistently but occasionally.

You could argue that at least one of Brady's super bowls would qualify as won by a game manager before he ascended to greatness. At a minimum Warner was the better QB in the 2001 super bowl.

 

[Mike the Brit]

Looks like Strange isn't blocking anyone on that play.

No. Strange blocks the guy coming in from the right (no doubt, as planned) but the rest of the O-Line had men free and number 41 knifed in from the other side.

 

[SVN]

 

[venecol]

Buffalo has the tiebreaker against KC, so if Buffalo is up 1 going into Week 18, they will rest guys. Very possible.

True but I see KC winning out and BUF losing a game. BUF will be fighting with CIN for the 2 seed.

 

[JMC00]

I can't see why the lack of co-ordination of the offensive line, the failure of the players to progress and the obvious alienation of, for example, Isaiah Wynn, isn't down to the OL coach.

From what I have watched a decent amount of the OL's problem has been "Lazy" Trent showed up for the season. We'll get unlazy Trent next year because it's a contact year, playing for his last big contract.

 

[Mike the Brit]

From what I have watched a decent amount of the OL's problem has been "Lazy" Trent showed up for the season. We'll get unlazy Trent next year because it's a contact year, playing for his last big contract.

I think that's unfair. From what I can see, he's someone who needs the right kind of intensive coaching -- and responds to it. As Dante said "all done with love".

Too bad he doesn't seem to be getting it.

 

[Rob0729]

No. Strange blocks the guy coming in from the right (no doubt, as planned) but the rest of the O-Line had men free and number 41 knifed in from the other side.

Ok, I can't tell from the one screen capture, but it makes sense.

 

[venecol]

Waiting to fix known issues one at a time is how bad NFL franchises are managed. Have to fix the whole problem, and Mac is part of the whole problem. Again, Mac did not progress well and finished weakly last year. No reason to mask that if we want to fix the whole problem.

Not sure you completely understand Robo's theory:

1. Mac had superpowers last season.
2. Patricia comes in this season, and is Mac's kryptonite, removing his superpowers and turning them into weaknesses.
3. As far as the 2021 last 5 games, wasn't Patricia in the building? Just his presence was enough to begin the drain of Mac's superpowers.
4. Only solution is to remove Patricia from the building, entirely.
5. You may ask what about in the MIN game where Mac played pretty well. Patricia is no fool. He toned down the kryptonite so as to not seem so obvious, but turned it back on again in the 4th Qtr when Mac proceeded to suck ass.
6. I believe Robo is working on a comic strip where Mac is the hero, called "Sunshine" and Patricia is the evil villain called "Fat Bastard." It's bound to be a hit.

 

[Ian]

Good bit from Hurley here with a film breakdown from Monday night:

Film review: A closer look at Mac Jones' deep passes during Patriots' win over Cardinals

The Patriots didn't take too many shots downfield vs. the Cardinals. Here's a closer look at why that was likely the case.

www.cbsnews.com

 

[upstater1]

The combination between the OL play and the coaching staff not thrusting Mac fully throwing deep is the reason you see those type of game plans.

I don’t think it is a coincidence that Mac was top 3 in the league in ADOT before his injury and throwing 6 picks in 3 games. And being, after his injury, at the bottom of the league in ADOT and throwing 2 picks in 6 games.

It is clear to me that the coaching staff put the rein back on when he came back.

The thing that's very hard to measure in this analysis is that many of Mac's picks were unnecessary desperation heaves while on the run and off his back foot. It's one thing to throw the ball into tight coverage in order to give your WR a chance. It's quite another to blindly heave the ball like you're at the craps table in Vegas.

I'm sure that many of those INTs were not part of the basic risk calculation of the offensive design.

The thing that makes me agree with you though is that Mac sat for 3 or 4 games, understood what his problem was, and then he came into the Chicago game and he did the EXACT same thing on the 2nd series, the very thing he had surely been warned NOT to do (granted the ball definitely hit the camera wire!)!

 

[upstater1]

I like your rational posts
I admit finding someone like Allen or mahomes is tough especially picking outside the top 10
Despite this I would like to see us taking shots at late rd prospects we like and who are bringing the physical tools with them, those are projects I know but if the tools are there (size, arm strength) you can take a shot
I don’t like the undersized murray‘s as a qb

Thanks. There are a huge number of QB busts in the top 5 though, that's what's scary. I shudder when I think of all the #1 picks the Jets and Bills have made over the last 25 years. And ironically, one high draft pick that the Jets spent on a guy and then tossed him aside, well he's playing pretty well as the starter in Seattle right now.