Game Day Thread Official Pre Game Thread- Pats @ Dolphins

[Patjew]

Why? He is not good, but does he contribute to losing? I don't understand the emotional reaction.

Why? He is not good, but does he contribute to losing? I don't understand the emotional reaction.

It is not emotional. It is because he does contribute to losing. I’m not sure how that is not evident.

edit: sorry for quoting you twice. My iPad went a little nuts.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

It is not emotional. It is because he does contribute to losing. I’m not sure how that is not evident.

edit: sorry for quoting you twice. My iPad went a little nuts.

Sorry for being dense. How does Harry contribute to losing?

Glad to get double quoted. It is nice to be noticed when you are me.

 

[DaBruinz]

Hightower and Dugger are out . The Dolphins if smart can run 200 yards against crappy Godchaux and Bentley. The biggest weakness on this Pats defense.

You're a buffoon. Godchaux is better at run defense than you are at posting.

 

[DaBruinz]

The crux of the discussion is probably whether the Patriots approach to LBs stays the same (larger/stonger vs lighter/quicker).

They got High with the 25th pick...about similar to where they likely pick this year so that's a definitive possibility to try and snatch someone with similar measureables as those level attributes all in one dude (large, strong and fast) drop precipitously after the first round.

But there's also a FS hole (although I could really see them sliding either Mills or Williams there), a likely #1 CB hole (hope springs eternal but someone's gonna give JCJ $22m per), and for many here at least a #1 WR hole.

Can't fill em all with one pick.

Love when people throw **** at the wall pretending to have insight.

Could you please show us where anyone has suggested that Jackson is looking for $22m?

 

[patfanken]

Hightower may be the most underrated Patriot of the BB era. A guy who can be as effective at DE as Mike and who plays everything in between at a star level. His versatility and usage is as legendary as it is overlooked. If Belichick had made him a 34 OLB day 1 and left him there he would be considered Von Miller. If he made him a 43 MLB in a system that keeps blockers off him he’d be Urlacher. Instead BB used all of his attributes and built a scheme around all of the things having a Hightower allows you to do.
We invented the nickel base and having Hightower in the middle is mostly how it worked.
It’s a shame he doesn’t get the appreciation he earned

I think we all appreciate High's contributions over the years. I know I do and I hope my post didn't make that clear. BUT... that Hightower isn't what I'm seeing THIIS year. He hasn't been THAT guy since early 19.

 

[venecol]

Or Bill’s just f*ckin with us.

Looks like @DaBruinz's letter writing campaign in support of Harry is working.

Damn it.

 

[stcjones]

Or Bill’s just f*ckin with us.

Meaning they are going run heavy and thus that’s why Harry is there for blocking….he’s worthless otherwise!

 

[Ring 6]

I think we all appreciate High's contributions over the years. I know I do and I hope my post didn't make that clear. BUT... that Hightower isn't what I'm seeing THIIS year. He hasn't been THAT guy since early 19.

We’ll see what happens in the post season. I’m expecting some adjustments that give him more impact.

 

[patfanken]

The crux of the discussion is probably whether the Patriots approach to LBs stays the same (larger/stonger vs lighter/quicker).

They got High with the 25th pick...about similar to where they likely pick this year so that's a definitive possibility to try and snatch someone with similar measureables as those level attributes all in one dude (large, strong and fast) drop precipitously after the first round.

But there's also a FS hole (although I could really see them sliding either Mills or Williams there), a likely #1 CB hole (hope springs eternal but someone's gonna give JCJ $22m per), and for many here at least a #1 WR hole.

Can't fill em all with one pick.

Yeah, our very brief time out of the 20's and 30's in the draft is over. Our last time in the top 10 WAS at 10 the year we got Mayo. So once again we will be picking at a spot where the 2nd tier of athlete is available. No Micah Parsons to be found there. So if I'm running the draft, I would be looking for a CB first, a DT 2nd, and a LB 3rd (sorry WR nerds). Even if we keep Jackson, you cannot have too many quality CB's, but I think there might be more quality DT's in the late 20's than CB's.. But who knows at this stage.

BTW- I'm always going to wonder if both Jones and Parsons had been available at 15, I find it hard to think BB would have passed on the next Lawrence Taylor. I know QB is more important, but I wonder if he thought he might thought be could get Davis in round two and win that way. Makes for interesting supposition.

 

[venecol]

BTW- I'm always going to wonder if both Jones and Parsons had been available at 15, I find it hard to think BB would have passed on the next Lawrence Taylor. I know QB is more important, but I wonder if he thought he might thought be could get Davis in round two and win that way. Makes for interesting supposition.

This sounds like heresy.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Yeah, our very brief time out of the 20's and 30's in the draft is over. Our last time in the top 10 WAS at 10 the year we got Mayo. So once again we will be picking at a spot where the 2nd tier of athlete is available. No Micah Parsons to be found there. So if I'm running the draft, I would be looking for a CB first, a DT 2nd, and a LB 3rd (sorry WR nerds). Even if we keep Jackson, you cannot have too many quality CB's, but I think there might be more quality DT's in the late 20's than CB's.. But who knows at this stage.

BTW- I'm always going to wonder if both Jones and Parsons had been available at 15, I find it hard to think BB would have passed on the next Lawrence Taylor. I know QB is more important, but I wonder if he thought he might thought be could get Davis in round two and win that way. Makes for interesting supposition.

Mills has been good. Wonder what he would have looked like in New England. Of course getting Parsons means we would not have Barmore.

 

[patfanken]

Bedard make a point after the Bills game that the Pats secondary has been way too passive and not NEARLY as physical enough with receivers in BOTH man and zone coverages. Crossers within the 5 yd box have had free reign to run their routs untouched by human hands. When he mentioned it and showed some clips on it, it rang true. The Pats really need to get back to that style if they want to go far in the playoffs.

This is especially true of the LB's No one is knocking anyone off their routes. Bedard showed clips of LB's who have had shots at guys, but let them go by untouched. NOT GOOD.

BTW- I have always thought that Williams would be an excellent outside CB you could align on an opponents "big WR" and have him be physical and play man in the trail position. He is NOT the fastest guy, but we've seen him cover quick guys WHEN he is physical with them. He shut out Devibte Smith in the preseason for example (though I'm not suggesting he cover Waddle tomorrow). Just that he HAS done it and might have some success against a bigger guy like Adams

I'm not sure what he's NOT doing that made him a healthy scratch last week, but I have at time watched him closely and I believe he can be an effective CB when playing to his strengths. I don't know what's going on and we certainly aren't going to find out, but something isn't right there.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Watching Denver’s three tight end offense expose the kc defense today makes me think that is what bb is trying to do with harry, Henry and smith. But because we do not have a judy on the outside like Denver does, teams just put ten in the box against us.

Instead of putting speed outside, bb’s answer is to put onwenu out there as a 6th offensive lineman.

we really need one good outside threat for our offense.

 

[PScottman]

Jackson is looking for $22m?

Can you show any insight where some team isn't going to offer it? (which is what I opined)

 

[farn]

I'm going to be highly disappointed if Harry is activated over Wilkerson

Knowing BB, my advice would be ‘keep the Zoloft at arm’s length’ in that case…

 

[Rob0729]

Not a deep position.

I am ok with Hightower being out. First, except for a handful of games, he hasn't been remotely like he was in the past. Second, historically, Highertower ups his game in the playoffs. There are so many playoff games where he has been a difference maker. I would rather get him to 100% next week than play him today. The Dolphins don't have a good offense anyway.

 

[Scotty]

Pats game not on UK TV we have the 49'rs v Rams at that slot time

 

[Rob0729]

I'm not so sure about that. I've been a huge fan of Hightower over the years. But I've felt very disappointed with his performance this year. There have been too many games where he has seemed to disappear. For a guy who can play in the middle or on the edge you'd think he'd be around the ball all the time....and he hasn't. When he came back lighter and hopefully quicker I thought he'd have a big year. He hasn't.

I'm not sure what his contract situation is beyond this seasson, but he's certainly NOT playing at $10MM level. I'm not sure he's playing at a 2 million doller level. It could be that he's done. Ten years is a long time to be hanging your head against that wall. OR maybe he will show us another year of his playoff magic. Hope is a wonderful thing. Hopefully McGrone and Perkins can resupply our aging LB corps next season.

I'm guessing Hightower and Collinx won't be on the team next season. KVN should be back as he's had a decent year thus far.

Hightower is a free agent after this season. My guess is he will either take a value contract with a lot of incentives with the Pats or retire. Unless McDaniels gets a head coaching job and brings him along with him for leadership on his new team, I just don't see Hightower providing any value to anyone other than the Patriots.

 

[Rob0729]

Bedard make a point after the Bills game that the Pats secondary has been way too passive and not NEARLY as physical enough with receivers in BOTH man and zone coverages. Crossers within the 5 yd box have had free reign to run their routs untouched by human hands. When he mentioned it and showed some clips on it, it rang true. The Pats really need to get back to that style if they want to go far in the playoffs.

This is especially true of the LB's No one is knocking anyone off their routes. Bedard showed clips of LB's who have had shots at guys, but let them go by untouched. NOT GOOD.

BTW- I have always thought that Williams would be an excellent outside CB you could align on an opponents "big WR" and have him be physical and play man in the trail position. He is NOT the fastest guy, but we've seen him cover quick guys WHEN he is physical with them. He shut out Devibte Smith in the preseason for example (though I'm not suggesting he cover Waddle tomorrow). Just that he HAS done it and might have some success against a bigger guy like Adams

I'm not sure what he's NOT doing that made him a healthy scratch last week, but I have at time watched him closely and I believe he can be an effective CB when playing to his strengths. I don't know what's going on and we certainly aren't going to find out, but something isn't right there.

It was clear that the Pats were too passive. They played a soft zone most of the game. It wasn't like they did they not care if the Bills picked up 4-6 a play at an easy clip between the 20s and tighten up in the red zone, but they seemed to not care if the Bills picked up 8-12 a play at an easy clip and not tighten up until ...and goal situations.

They just let Allen sit back in the pocket for 4-5 seconds on most plays. And when you are playing zone, your going to get picked apart if you let the QB have that much time. They should have designed ways to dial up more pressure. They should have disguised their rushes better and sent a few more blitzes. Allen was great that game, but people overrate his performance because the Pats let him be great. Any top QB would have had as good or better game than Allen had if they had that much time to throw against a soft zone.

 

[Rob0729]

I am ok with Wilkerson being inactive today. I don't think this is a game where the passing game will be at a premium. By watching how the Titans ran all over the Dolphins last week (40 carries for 198 yards and 2 TDs), I expect the offensive game plan to be a heavy dose of Harris and Stevenson with Jones playing more of a controlled passing offense to compliment it. I assume with amount of passing and the type of passing the Pats are likely to do, Wilkerson wouldn't be getting a lot of targets even if he played. Better to use the roster spot on defense.