OT: Official 2021 Tompa Bay Gronkaneers Thread

[amfootball]

Even Keyshawn (notorious Brady hater) is saying the Bucs have an excellent chance to repeat because they have a great run game which you need in the playoffs. Could not agree more.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

I really don't understand this sentiment at all. Brady was OUR QB for 20 years helping to win 6 SBs and become the undisputed GOAT. A Pats board is the perfect location to still follow and root for him as I see his success in Tampa as just an extension of his career success in NE. I mean this thread/sub forum was moved off the main board specifically to no conflict with Pats threads, so why come here if you don't like it?

Yes, but Brady WAS our QB. Doesn't mean you have to follow him around to another team and root for said team also. And he's already proven he can win outside Bill's system - who cares what he does at this point? I can understand someone like Ian who is rooting for Brady NOT to lose another SB, but that is far different than actively rooting for him to win when another title does nothing to his legacy.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

LOL. Weren't you the one on the Other Games thread rooting for the Colts yesterday when it was in the Pats best interest for the Bucs to win?

If it helps knock Tennessee out of the playoffs or out of a division title, I am all for it

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Not a knock on the Patriots because the cost/investment is far apart, but the Bucs offensive line is probably better than any Brady had in NE. 2018 was awesome, though run blocking was their forte. The line is dominant if healthy.

Ironically, when Brady joined the Bucs, the line was thought to be subpar. The skills players (Evans, Godwin, Brate, Howard, Jones) were supposedly spectacular, but that group really wasn’t/isn’t that great.

Even as a 1-2 combo, it’s not like Evans and Godwin are some all-time great pairing. They’re comparable, in overall value, to a number of NFC rival combos we’ve seen recently. Cooper-Lamb, Kupp-Woods, Adams-Jones, Hopkins-Green, Thomas-Kamara, Jones-Ridley, Metcalf-Lockett.

It turns out the Gronk, AB and Fournette signings were far from luxury/insurance spoiler additions. Those 2019 skill players who were so highly vaunted were not good enough on their own, when running a real offense where the QB didn’t just chuck it deep.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

All the talk today appears to be the Colts blew it by not running Taylor more. I could not disagree more. The TOs is what killed them. Wentz was on fire until Barrett and Winfield changed the game.

Running the clock down is only a good idea of running also helps you pick up first downs. Looked like the Bucs defense ran out of gas in the 4th quarter and the Colts were ripping off some yardage on the ground. Prior to that, running into a brick wall is flat out stupid. They lost because of Wentz and a muffed punt. In fairness to Wentz, the turnovers were clearly great defensive plays.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

If it helps knock Tennessee out of the playoffs or out of a division title, I am all for it

Why? Indy is as good as Tennessee and poses some big problems for whoever they play. And they have almost no shot at the division, as they’ve lost twice to Tennessee. That’s not why you were rooting for the Colts over the Bucs.

 

[amfootball]

Not a knock on the Patriots because the cost/investment is far apart, but the Bucs offensive line is probably better than any Brady had in NE. 2018 was awesome, though run blocking was their forte. The line is dominant if healthy.

Ironically, when Brady joined the Bucs, the line was thought to be subpar. The skills players (Evans, Godwin, Brate, Howard, Jones) were supposedly spectacular, but that group really wasn’t/isn’t that great.

Even as a 1-2 combo, it’s not like Evans and Godwin are some all-time great pairing. They’re comparable, in overall value, to a number of NFC rival combos we’ve seen recently. Cooper-Lamb, Kupp-Woods, Adams-Jones, Hopkins-Green, Thomas-Kamara, Jones-Ridley, Metcalf-Lockett.

It turns out the Gronk, AB and Fournette signings were far from luxury/insurance spoiler additions. Those 2019 skill players who were so highly vaunted were not good enough on their own, when running a real offense where the QB didn’t just chuck it deep.

Defensive schemes are too good to beat with just 2 guys. Brady realized this early on which is why he pushed for Gronk and Fournett and then AB when he came off of suspension. I don't think it is a matter of Godwin/Evans not being a great duo, I think it is a matter of needing more if you really want to compete for a chip.

Great point on the Oline. I could not agree more. Even down to their third LT, they were still great yesterday. But in terms of the Pats, Bill always believed in having a solid TE, RB and slot guy to make teams defend the whole field. Where he fell short is he could never draft a true outside weapon. It is missing from this year's team too as Agahlor is not great by any means. If the Pats do come up short, it will be because a defense takes away the middle of the field and stops the run. You really need all 3 levels to stress a great D.

 

[Tottie]

Not a knock on the Patriots because the cost/investment is far apart, but the Bucs offensive line is probably better than any Brady had in NE. 2018 was awesome, though run blocking was their forte. The line is dominant if healthy.

Ironically, when Brady joined the Bucs, the line was thought to be subpar. The skills players (Evans, Godwin, Brate, Howard, Jones) were supposedly spectacular, but that group really wasn’t/isn’t that great.

Even as a 1-2 combo, it’s not like Evans and Godwin are some all-time great pairing. They’re comparable, in overall value, to a number of NFC rival combos we’ve seen recently. Cooper-Lamb, Kupp-Woods, Adams-Jones, Hopkins-Green, Thomas-Kamara, Jones-Ridley, Metcalf-Lockett.

It turns out the Gronk, AB and Fournette signings were far from luxury/insurance spoiler additions. Those 2019 skill players who were so highly vaunted were not good enough on their own, when running a real offense where the QB didn’t just chuck it deep.

The line is the reason the offense is good at its core. Of course the QB has alot to do with that and I'm sure they are much happier to block now compared to Winston running all over the place. People mentioned double teams on the 2 bucs legacy receivers. Some have said Godwin is being bracketed and others just repeat what they hear and claim Evans is always double teamed. JE11 was double teamed an entire superbowl and many other clutch games. He still got open and we still targeted him on crucial downs. Godwin should be able to do something in the middle of the field on 3rd down yet they don't go there.

The defense love their turnovers but this team can't get off the field. Play coverage FFS! Playing off coverage zone type defense and sending 5 is getting them destroyed! In the playoffs Bucs need to put up 2 scores fast for this stuff to work or the D will get tired and better hope AB is healthy so Brady can sustain drives. Gronk will break down if they target him 10 times a game.

 

[RicoG]

All the talk today appears to be the Colts blew it by not running Taylor more. I could not disagree more. The TOs is what killed them. Wentz was on fire until Barrett and Winfield changed the game.

They should know that a top run stopping D will win out against a top rb almost all the time.

Colts Learned The Hard Way: Thou Shalt Not Run On Bucs - JoeBucsFan.com

Nearly everyone Joe spoke to expected the Colts to try to run on the Bucs all game. Why not when the Colts had ridden beastly Jonathan Taylor to become one of the hottest NFL teams? So in the first quarter, the […]

www.joebucsfan.com

 

[Deus Irae]

All the talk today appears to be the Colts blew it by not running Taylor more. I could not disagree more. The TOs is what killed them. Wentz was on fire until Barrett and Winfield changed the game.

The people crying about the Colts not running the ball are ignoring four big realities of the game:

1. The run wasn't working, at all, in the first half.
2. The run wasn't working until after White was out of the game.
3. The run wasn't working until Vea lost a Chicklet.
4. The run wasn't working until Tampa "knew" that the Colts had to play catch up and pass the ball.

 

[Tottie]

Lose too often on 1st down. Too many 3 and outs. Play designs not good enough to give playmakers YAC. Too many turnovers.

 

[Deus Irae]

The line is the reason the offense is good at its core. Of course the QB has alot to do with that and I'm sure they are much happier to block now compared to Winston running all over the place.

Tom Brady has turned Donovan Smith into a good left tackle. That's been huge for the team.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Barrett was a waste of $. They needed to sign a couple of FA DBs.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Why? Indy is as good as Tennessee and poses some big problems for whoever they play. And they have almost no shot at the division, as they’ve lost twice to Tennessee. That’s not why you were rooting for the Colts over the Bucs.

Had Indy won yesterday, they would have been 1 game back of Tennessee who is missing some important pieces and could very well lose their lead on the division.

 

[RicoG]

Defensive schemes are too good to beat with just 2 guys. Brady realized this early on which is why he pushed for Gronk and Fournett and then AB when he came off of suspension. I don't think it is a matter of Godwin/Evans not being a great duo, I think it is a matter of needing more if you really want to compete for a chip.

They are a very good duo but not great.

Then there is OJ/Brate who are middle of the pack TEs. So is Rojo.
Between them all, they are just good, not very good, great or elite.

Now with Gronk and AB, WR and TE is elite. Lenny is very good and seems to be so clutch, we might have to put him in the great category.

So before Brady and his crew came, the Bucs just had a good offense and nothing more.

 

[Guts]

Barrett was a waste of $. They needed to sign a couple of FA DBs.

He had a huge game yesterday. I think they'll need him for the postseason run

 

[amfootball]

They are a very good duo but not great.

Then there is OJ/Brate who are middle of the pack TEs. So is Rojo.
Between them all, they are just good, not very good, great or elite.

Now with Gronk and AB, WR and TE is elite. Lenny is very good and seems to be so clutch, we might have to put him in the great category.

So before Brady and his crew came, the Bucs just had a good offense and nothing more.

I would not go that far. The Bucs in 2019 were 3rd in points and yards. They were one of the best offenses and most explosive but Winston was a turnover machine. OJ was very good/borderline elite before the Achilles. Fournette has probably been the biggest and best addition as I don't think any of us saw him being this dominate and versatile. Rojo is the perfect back to come in and pinch hit. But honestly, it is Brady that makes everything go and he was never going to play hero ball as much as Arians probably wanted so naturally guys like Evans will be more muted even though Evans is leading the team in yards and TDs.

 

[amfootball]

Barrett was a waste of $. They needed to sign a couple of FA DBs.

I don't get the Barrett dislike at all. Guy balls out every game. It is more Suh and JPP who has been injured that have underperformed IMO and of course White has had a down year as well which effects the front. I like Tyron a lot though. What a motor on that kid. He just has to play a little more disciplined.

 

[Deus Irae]

Barrett was a waste of $. They needed to sign a couple of FA DBs.

Any DBs they signed would have gotten injured. It's just been that year.


Beyond that, what Tampa is missing is the CB1. Was there one available (serious question, because I can't remember off the top of my head)?

 

[Deus Irae]

Lenny is very good and seems to be so clutch, we might have to put him in the great category.

And people have forgotten that he was all but cut by the Bucs last year, and that he's only gotten to where he is now because, after having basically been given an ultimatum by Arians, he pulled his head out of his ass, started focusing on the team rather than pouting, and has been turned into an adequate receiving back by Brady and the coaches.