Can we finally stop pretending that Cam is good?

[lancerman]

I'm not arguing our weapons aren't bad. But 5 passing tds over 13 games is just abysmal.

Even gardner minshew has 15 tds. I just don't know if we upgraded the offense that cam newton would go to a 25 or even 20 td guy

It isn't a good stat but you have to put it into context

1. Cam Newton has far and away the least passing attempts of any QB in the league who started the same amount of games. You actually have to find QB's who started a minimum of 3 games less to even have someone with less attempts. Minshew has 1 less attempt despite starting 4 less games. Extrapolate that and it leads to Minshew having far more attempts per game. Cam averages 25 arempts, Minshew averages 36.

2. Cam is tied for 3rd in the league in rushing TD's. So he is making up that production somewhere else. In total he has 16TD's. Minshew has 1 rushing TD. So they are both at 16 total on the season.

I think it's very hard to say what anybody would do in an upgraded offense. Right now you could pick any QB in the league and their stats go way down in this offense. It's really not unrealistic to say Patrick Mahomes would not be viewed as a top 10 QB if he was throwing to these guys same with Rodgers. It's a sharpe decrease that is compounded on less attempts anyways.

The point isn't that Cam is some star being held back. He clearly lost something in his arm. But he's not the only problem on offense and some of these problems were apparent last year and are actually worse this year and you did have people saying that a great QB was on the decline last year in a somewhat better variation of this offense. Swapping QB's will not make this a team that realistically will be aiming at a Super Bowl.

 

[crawhammer]

We actually have as many wins against winnings teams this year (Miami first time, Ravens, Cardinals) as we did last year (hell even the Raiders might push us over that by the end and we still have the Bills game). The difference is we just played more winning teams this year compared to last year.

The difference from last year to this year obviously is quarterback play. Their starting quarterback has 5 passing TD's and it's week 16 for Christ's sake. Newton has no arm/shoulder left. Pre-snap he's not identifying defenses, he doesn't handle pressure well, he doesn't move well in the pocket, he doesn't read through his progressions, his release is awkward and slow, he takes too many sacks, he's inaccurate, he throws too many picks, he makes too many mistakes in crunch time. He's the exact opposite of Tom Brady.

 

[lancerman]

The difference from last year to this year obviously is quarterback play. Their starting quarterback has 5 passing TD's and it's week 16 for Christ's sake. Newton has no arm/shoulder left. Pre-snap he's not identifying defenses, he doesn't handle pressure well, he doesn't move well in the pocket, he doesn't read through his progressions, his release is awkward and slow, he takes too many sacks, he's inaccurate, he throws too many picks, he makes too many mistakes in crunch time. He's the exact opposite of Tom Brady.

The main problem is the team is devoid of talent across the board. That includes the QB position.

But compared to last year. Edelman is injured more, Dorsett who was somewhat productive isn’t here, Gordon who was arguably our most explosive receiver isn’t here. Hightower isn’t here, Chung isn’t here. Van Noy left, Collins left, Evnsr left, Shelton left, and Roberts left.

Last year we had one of the easiest schedules we’ve ever seen and limped into the playoffs and got one and done’s for the first time since 2010.

It goes far beyond QB and swapping Cam for the best QB is still equaling a team with no SB aspirations. It would be nice if there was one clear fix

 

[amfootball]

The main problem is the team is devoid of talent across the board. That includes the QB position.

But compared to last year. Edelman is injured more, Dorsett who was somewhat productive isn’t here, Gordon who was arguably our most explosive receiver isn’t here. Hightower isn’t here, Chung isn’t here. Van Noy left, Collins left, Evnsr left, Shelton left, and Roberts left.

Last year we had one of the easiest schedules we’ve ever seen and limped into the playoffs and got one and done’s for the first time since 2010.

It goes far beyond QB and swapping Cam for the best QB is still equaling a team with no SB aspirations. It would be nice if there was one clear fix

With at least competent QB play this team is in the playoffs and possibly contending for the division. Despite all the changes, the defense was pretty good, comparable to 2018 when we won the chip, the Oline is volumes better than last year as is the run game with Harris.

 

[lancerman]

With at least competent QB play this team is in the playoffs and possibly contending for the division. Despite all the changes, the defense was pretty good, comparable to 2018 when we won the chip, the Oline is volumes better than last year as is the run game with Harris.

This team was only in the playoffs last year because we beat up on bad teams early before our offense fell apart. We have a much harder schedule this year

 

[letsgopats]

This team was only in the playoffs last year because we beat up on bad teams early before our offense fell apart. We have a much harder schedule this year

That's true but to amfootball's point. We were a few plays or a possession away from winning some of those close games this year, and if we had a better QB, at worse we'd in the playoff run at this time.

 

[lancerman]

That's true but to amfootball's point. We were a few plays or a possession away from winning some of those close games this year, and if we had a better QB, at worse we'd in the playoff run at this time.

Possibly. But Cam decided to have his best game of the year against Seattle and I can't really say someone else was going to do better. It's not Cam's fault he got Covid and we lost to the Chiefs. The Rams game wasn't competetive. He was sort of a live by the sword die by the sword situation with Buffalo, and then he ran for the crucial first down and took the penalty that won us the Cardinals game

 

[1960Pats]

The difference from last year to this year obviously is quarterback play. Their starting quarterback has 5 passing TD's and it's week 16 for Christ's sake. Newton has no arm/shoulder left. Pre-snap he's not identifying defenses, he doesn't handle pressure well, he doesn't move well in the pocket, he doesn't read through his progressions, his release is awkward and slow, he takes too many sacks, he's inaccurate, he throws too many picks, he makes too many mistakes in crunch time. He's the exact opposite of Tom Brady.

Yeah, but he's a nice guy and everyone likes him. He's a smooth talker and a snappy dresser too.

 

[cupofjoe1962]

Okay, but we had trash out there last year as well and went 12-4.

Cam newton has 5 passing TD's. if we give him all the weapons in the world what is his ceiling? 10TDs? 15TDs? still horrible

Brady had better weapons last year.
At least Edelman played last year & Brady did have Gordon for part of the season & even AB for a game.

I agree Newton sucks, but I give him credit for not blaming the horrible cast of receivers & tight ends on this team.

Just don’t tell me Maholmes could win with these weapons. He may get us in the playoffs, but he would struggle going from a group of receivers better than any group Brady ever had with the possible exception of 2007 & that was just Randy Moss.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

This team was only in the playoffs last year because we beat up on bad teams early before our offense fell apart. We have a much harder schedule this year

Last year’s team could have been special with a healthy offensive line!

 

[sb1]

Okay, but we had trash out there last year as well and went 12-4.

Cam newton has 5 passing TD's. if we give him all the weapons in the world what is his ceiling? 10TDs? 15TDs? still horrible

To be fair we had a very easy schedule and it wasn’t really because of the offense that we got that record except maybe the first two games. The Bills shut the offense down pretty easily in game 3 and it was never the same after that.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

I'm not arguing our weapons aren't bad. But 5 passing tds over 13 games is just abysmal.

Even gardner minshew has 15 tds. I just don't know if we upgraded the offense that cam newton would go to a 25 or even 20 td guy

Agreed but it is worse than you note.

Minshew has 16 passing TDs in 9 games. Cam has 5 TDs in 13 games. That is a comparison of 1.8 versus 0.4 passing TDs per game played. Minshew is 4x better than Cam.

Spare me the "But, but Cam has rushing TDs". This is not the 1970s, the rules have changed, and it is a passing league.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

Agreed but it is worse than you note.

Minshew has 16 passing TDs in 9 games. Cam has 5 TDs in 13 games. That is a comparison of 1.8 versus 0.4 passing TDs per game played. Minshew is 4x better than Cam.

Spare me the "But, but Cam has rushing TDs". This is not the 1970s, the rules have changed, and it is a passing league.

Any touchdown is a good touchdown.

But when is the last time newton has led us to a touchdown?

 

[lancerman]

To be fair we had a very easy schedule and it wasn’t really because of the offense that we got that record except maybe the first two games. The Bills shut the offense down pretty easily in game 3 and it was never the same after that.

Yup. The Steelers game was the only impressive win on the entire season imo and that was because the Steelers were good and would have been a winning team had Ben not been injured later. The Dolphins were garbage the first time we played them and we had a healthy Edelman, Gordon, AB, and Dorsett was our 4th best receiver on the field that day. That was a far cry from Harry, Meyers, and Byrd being the top 3.

We weren't going 12-4 with the team last year if we had this schedule.

 

[captain stone]

Last year’s team could have been special with a healthy offensive line!

And with TEs who weren't the Worst in NFL History...up to that point...

 

[Love The Drake]

I’m hoping Newton throws 2 picks then Stidham comes in and we lost to the next 2 games by a combined 2 points.

 

[203Pat]

Cam seems to be getting this kid glove Pop Warner treatment. "Well the tries really hard and he is good in the locker room!" That is all well and good but unfortunately he just can't play. I am sure 5 minutes after the season wraps up some report will come out that he played most of the season with X injury and all that but I just think he is at the end of the road. With his personality and charisma he should have tons of avenues to explore post career and I wish him the best but I don't want to seem him in a Patriots uniform in 2021.

 

[Santi]

Cam newton has 5 passing tds over 13 games played. That is very below average idk if there is another QB in the league who has that few TDs over a 13 game span.

Stidham might not be good, but his TD to harry in the Chiefs game is something cam newton can't do.

Well yes but he also has or at least had the most rushing TD's for a QB so whats your point? We now his throwing isn't the strong point and his running has to try and make up for it.

 

[sb1]

Cam is not good.

 

[captain stone]

Well yes but he also has or at least had the most rushing TD's for a QB so whats your point? We now his throwing isn't the strong point and his running has to try and make up for it.

It's an absolute sickening Disgrace that he tied Grogan's record.