Debate Brady vs Belichick?

[RobertWeathers]

How so? It was more about years. Brady wanted multi years, Bill wanted 1 year incentive laden deals. That went on since 2017. Bill made the choice not to offer a multi year contract 3 years in a row. Brady should have retired a Patriot.

Thats money.

 

[DaBruinz]

If so he isn’t a great defensive coach anymore it seems. The old Bill the DC would have never let his run defense get embarrassed like yesterday. Or let SB LII happen.

Saying that BB would never let the run defense get embarrassed is completely false. You're forgetting years like 2002, 2005, and 2010,2011,2013 and 2017. All years where the run defense was pretty bad.

 

[sb1]

Saying that BB would never let the run defense get embarrassed is completely false. You're forgetting years like 2002, 2005, and 2010,2011,2013 and 2017. All years where the run defense was pretty bad.

I guess my point was he's never really thought of anymore as a defensive whiz. Maybe more of an offense one...

 

[BradytoMosstoGronk]

Wonderfully divisive topic.

They're obviously better together. Feels like these topics are just made to open up the door for people to sh** on BB or Brady.

 

[DaBruinz]

People have very short memories...

2020 Patriots (14 games): 20.6ppg, 6-8, 2.08 offensive TDs a game
2019 Patriots (last 9 games): 20.3ppg, 4-5, 1.9 offensive TDs a game

Why do we think the NEP would be better this year with Tom when he has less to work with than last year?

There is actually MORE to work with on the offense this year than last year. First off, the O-line is much improved. Having Andrews back is a plus. Mason is playing very well. You also have Onwenu and Herron. Wynn was playing very well until his ankle got rolled up on by Burkhead. Then you have Harris, Michel and Taylor. I would argue that they are better than the RBs from last year. You also have a competent fullback this year in Johnson. Something that Brady really didn't have last year.

Then you have the advancement of Meyers. Not to mention that I believe that Byrd would be doing as well or BETTER with Brady.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

I hope people realize that if the opposite occurred after 2019 - that Belichick left and Brady stayed - the Pats would be in the same boat or worse right now under McDaniels or just about any other HC.

 

[sb1]

I hope people realize that if the opposite occurred after 2019 - that Belichick left and Brady stayed - the Pats would be in the same boat right now under McDaniels and just about any other HC.

McDaniels as coach? yikes.

 

[RobertWeathers]

There is actually MORE to work with on the offense this year than last year. First off, the O-line is much improved. Having Andrews back is a plus. Mason is playing very well. You also have Onwenu and Herron. Wynn was playing very well until his ankle got rolled up on by Burkhead. Then you have Harris, Michel and Taylor. I would argue that they are better than the RBs from last year. You also have a competent fullback this year in Johnson. Something that Brady really didn't have last year.

Then you have the advancement of Meyers. Not to mention that I believe that Byrd would be doing as well or BETTER with Brady.

You can make a case for it, sure.

I think no TEs and JE on IR would still have gotten us Cranky Tom

 

[DaBruinz]

Brady was without Godwin a couple games and a hobbled Evans early in the season.

Godwin missed games 2,4,5,8. Guess What. Tampa won 3 of the 4 games.
Evans may have been hobbled, but he still was a factor in games 2,4,5. Only games 6 and 7 was he a non-factor. And Tampa won both of those games. But then, they had Godwin there as well as Gronk, Brate, Jones, and Fournette.

So, you're really not making a case.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

There is actually MORE to work with on the offense this year than last year. First off, the O-line is much improved. Having Andrews back is a plus. Mason is playing very well. You also have Onwenu and Herron. Wynn was playing very well until his ankle got rolled up on by Burkhead. Then you have Harris, Michel and Taylor. I would argue that they are better than the RBs from last year. You also have a competent fullback this year in Johnson. Something that Brady really didn't have last year.

Then you have the advancement of Meyers. Not to mention that I believe that Byrd would be doing as well or BETTER with Brady.

the advancement of Meyers is washed out by the subtraction of Jules and the non-advancement of Harry. And had Brady resigned here the return of Andrews is washed out by the subtraction of Thuney.

I will say that Brady at 43 is still light years ahead of Cam so on this fact alone the offense would be better.

 

[jah]

Lmao

 

[amfootball]

Your theory that Tom would be struggling is completely unfounded. He's 43 for Christ's sake and he has had to get acclimated to an entirely new team, coaches and players. He's a borderline pro bowler. What he's doing is unprecedented and incredible.

Belichick looks like a total fool for not doing everything possible to have Brady finish out his career in NE. The Patriots are a total disaster right now and their future looks very bleak, not only because they have a rather untalented roster, and no plan whatsoever at quarterback, but two teams in their own division are skyrocketing past them. Not to mention several other teams in the conference will be leaving them in the dust for the next several seasons.

Look, for at least this season, had Brady remained their starter, they would be cruising toward another division title, even with the otherwise putrid roster.

Yep. I said that on the other thread. He looks like a complete clown.

 

[DaBruinz]

You can make a case for it, sure.

I think no TEs and JE on IR would still have gotten us Cranky Tom

I'll be honest. I think that JE would have had the surgery in the off-season if TB was coming back. But that's a different story.
I think that we'd have had Cranky Tom regardless. But that's also a topic for a different thread.

 

[condon84]

After one year the debate is over?

 

[amfootball]

I'll be honest. I think that JE would have had the surgery in the off-season if TB was coming back. But that's a different story.
I think that we'd have had Cranky Tom regardless. But that's also a topic for a different thread.

I agree. I also don't think Tom feeds Jules the way Cam did vs Seattle which is what got his knee problems rolling. Tom really managed Jules last year when he was struggling with multiple injuries. But aside from Jules, the Oline this year and run game are light years better than what Tom had to work with last year. If Tom was here, we would be looking at a run to the SB like we did in 2018 riding the run game and Tom's clutch throws on third down.

 

[DaBruinz]

the advancement of Meyers is washed out by the subtraction of Jules and the non-advancement of Harry. And had Brady resigned here the return of Andrews is washed out by the subtraction of Thuney.

I will say that Brady at 43 is still light years ahead of Cam so on this fact alone the offense would be better.

You're making some HUGE assumptions.

First off, the advancement of Meyers has nothing to do with Jules or Harry. Harry has advanced, contrary to so many of you.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but I showed exactly how the Pats could have kept Thuney while also signing Brady. Your claiming that there would be a subtraction is erroneous.

You also can't seem to be bothered to acknowledge Onwenu and Herron or Eleumenor. All of which helped to solidify this O-line over what we had last year.

 

[amfootball]

You're making some HUGE assumptions.

First off, the advancement of Meyers has nothing to do with Jules or Harry. Harry has advanced, contrary to so many of you.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but I showed exactly how the Pats could have kept Thuney while also signing Brady. Your claiming that there would be a subtraction is erroneous.

You also can't seem to be bothered to acknowledge Onwenu and Herron or Eleumenor. All of which helped to solidify this O-line over what we had last year.

Not to mention the emergence of Harris.

 

[DaBruinz]

I guess my point was he's never really thought of anymore as a defensive whiz. Maybe more of an offense one...

Agree to disagree. BB was thought of as a defensive whiz when his defenses did well. It's a matter of execution. And that's something that has been inconsistent this season. And it will cost some players (Butler in particular) money in free agency.

 

[BobDigital]

The debate was never who was more important in my mind. Players play and coaches coach. The question was 'what would each be without the other'. For Brady we will never really know, as we are only seeing him without BB on the down slope of his career. As for BB, we are getting to see more of that now.

 

[Triumph]

People have very short memories...

2020 Patriots (14 games): 20.6ppg, 6-8, 2.08 offensive TDs a game
2019 Patriots (last 9 games): 20.3ppg, 4-5, 1.9 offensive TDs a game

Why do we think the NEP would be better this year with Tom when he has less to work with than last year?

Because Cam cant get the ball to White or Edelman and Brady could. Cam is starving these guys out.

White 107 yds and 2 TDs.
Edelman has 0 TDs.

Brady would have this team in the post season because Meyers is better in his 2nd season and Byrd is as good if not better than Dorsett. Moncrieff was showing promise. Harris is way better than Sony.