Kraft Orchids Case - Prosecuters Want a Tug Rule?

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

I was going to post the same clip. :highfive:

Regards,
Chris

 

[QuantumMechanic]

Isn't:

[(33,000)(0.9)+(303,000)(0.1)]/1=60,000

No, because that is MEAN. We’re talking about MEDIAN.

Median HH income of $60K, by definition, means that 50% make less and 50% make more.

 

[venecol]

No, because that is MEAN. We’re talking about MEDIAN.

Median HH income of $60K, by definition, means that 50% make less and 50% make more.

Sure but when trying to measure income inequality the median is pretty useless so why use it? I thought discussion was about inequality.

 

[Drewski]

all fair points. But the header of the chart said “Average Income” which automatically implies “per capita”. So I understand it includes all income types, but can not include accumulated wealth(because that’s not income).

I stand by my point that it’s the wrong metric to use because per capita doesn’t provide a fair comparison of INCOME distribution. That’s because it includes those that choose not to work, children and retired citizens.

As of today, almost 45% of Americans don’t pay any taxes. That explains the #1 reason why income distribution per capita has fallen so much. It’s not so much about actual income earned from working

1. I agree wealth is a much, much better metric, however that metric shows an even more dire (I guess depending on your POV) situation. Hello Gilded Age 2.0; it ended so well the last time we tried it.

2. Income doesn’t mean per capita. For instance my household income is my income. My wife is a stay at home mom with two kids. No one would say my income is 1/4 if what it is because there are four people supported by it.

 

[captain stone]

anything on the Anselmo pederasty case?

Do you mean Phil Anselmo, the former lead singer of Pantera? Didn't know he was into that, but I was never a Pantera fan anyway.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Get a clue.

Law enforcement has had the mafia under surveillance 365 days a year while they are commiting crimes.

Law enforcement also survels drug rings for years sometimes to catch everyone.

That's your way out this?

That has absolutely nothing to do with the point here, which is about possibly misusing the intent of a warrant. Warrants are a major part of criminal investigations and judges will highly scrutinize their purpose. Do you really think the judge granted a warrant to videotape for a misdemeanor solicitation charge? If that’s the case, there would be satellites video recording street corners all around the world. The question here is whether or not the obtained evidence is within the admissible scope of the warrant’s allowed evidence.

 

[QuantumMechanic]

Sure but when trying to measure income inequality the median is pretty useless so why use it? I thought discussion was about inequality.

Someone has been consistently claiming that 90% of households make less than $30K. Which is blatantly wrong.

 

[Antdawg]

That has absolutely nothing to do with the point here, which is about possibly misusing the intent of a warrant. Warrants are a major part of criminal investigations and judges will highly scrutinize their purpose. Do you really think the judge granted a warrant to videotape for a misdemeanor solicitation charge? If that’s the case, there would be satellites video recording street corners all around the world. The question here is whether or not the obtained evidence is within the admissible scope of the warrant’s allowed evidence.

I still think even if the video is deemed admissible, the prosecution has a problem here, because the video supposedly doesn't have audio and audio is really what you need when you're trying to take down a john. To me, that is the biggest, glaring potential flaw for the prosecution. They obviously have a mountain of circumstantial evidence, but unless you can prove without a shadow of a doubt Kraft arranged sexual services for payment, then you have no solicitation case. Based on the legal team Kraft has assembled, it must be very apparent to Bob that he has a real chance of getting out of this one and I would wager the lack of audio is the biggest thing in his favor.

If Kraft's legal team somehow gets the video thrown out as evidence, the charges pending against him are DOA and will be summarily dismissed.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I still think even if the video is deemed admissible, the prosecution has a problem here, because the video supposedly doesn't have audio and audio is really what you need when you're trying to take down a john. To me, that is the biggest, glaring potential flaw for the prosecution. They obviously have a mountain of circumstantial evidence, but unless you can prove without a shadow of a doubt Kraft arranged sexual services for payment, then you have no solicitation case. Based on the legal team Kraft has assembled, it must be very apparent to Bob that he has a real chance of getting out of this one and I would wager the lack of audio is the biggest thing in his favor.

If Kraft's legal team somehow gets the video thrown out as evidence, the charges pending against him are DOA and will be summarily dismissed.

Wow - so close to busting a massive international sex trafficking ring and opted for the non-audio cameras?

 

[Antdawg]

Wow - so close to busting a massive international sex trafficking ring and opted for the non-audio cameras?

Ha, right. I have been saying police botched this all along. This is what happens when you allocate crime fighting resources to very old men getting consensual handies from middle-aged Asian women.

 

[Drewski]

Someone has been consistently claiming that 90% of households make less than $30K. Which is blatantly wrong.

For such a simple bar graph, the misinterpretation of it was an interesting aspect of the discussion to see

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

not sure how this relates to this thread or football in general

It was a joke

 

[PatsFanInVa]

As of today, almost 45% of Americans don’t pay any taxes.

Which states and cities do they live in? I know Delaware is a famous example, where the DuPonts just pay everybody's income/sales tax. I know Alaska pays your lazy on-the-dole ass for living there. Tongue in cheek.

But where else are these people who pay no taxes? Certainly none of them in Virginia, Maryland, or DC. None in Mass either. Sure ain't no 45%.

Now if you mean that 45% are below the line at which you have a net federal income tax liability, maybe. I know that on the federal level I've been paying positive amounts into Social Security/Medicare since my teens. You were too, unless you were working under the table or not working

But if you're further shaving down our issues to only federal income tax labeled income tax, okay, MAYBE. Unless you mean (as you might, check your source) that 45% get back money, having paid it in regularly and not owing the amount they were required to save. When people are trying to pretend that the terrible poor are ripping off their betters, they tend to gild the lily from time to time. Just saying check it out.

the #1 reason why income distribution per capita has fallen so much. It’s not so much about actual income earned from working

It means nothing to say income distribution has fallen. The distribution is the distribution. You mean income per capita has fallen, or do you mean that income per capita does not sort out as you would expect? Or do you mean that tax revenue per capita has fallen? Remember, I came in in the middle.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Not quite. I have a source that has evidence that Asian spas only started this up after LII.

Butlers fault

The Butler Did her

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Agree mostly, but sex is different. Human trafficking to make egg rolls and human trafficking just for prostitution are 180 degrees apart.

The matter has big significance on football. The other owners can force Kraft out. He has embarrassed the franchise and the NFL with his actions. The NFL is trying to stamp out the abuse of women and here comes Kraft taking advantage of women who are less fortunate. This could be a career ender.. Mere accusations of sexual improprieties nearly took down a supreme court justice.

Its serious.

The ultimate irony.

Kraft always did everything to support the league, caving in to any and all denigration ["Yes! We totally sucked before I bought the team! Whatever you say! I'm your guy!"] until tiny, too little too late gestures in Defamegate, doing what's best for the 32, to preserve his leading position in the league. He has been arguably more responsible than any other owner in securing the present Goodell-led position of the league, which totally caters to the owners' greed, ignorance and stupidity, and now for his trouble, they can toss him out.

Cannot envision same treatment of Mara or Rooney under same circumstances.

 

[JetFan79]

The ultimate irony.

Kraft always did everything to support the league, caving in to any and all denigration ["Yes! We totally sucked before I bought the team! Whatever you say! I'm your guy!"] until tiny, too little too late gestures in Defamegate, doing what's best for the 32, to preserve his leading position in the league. He has been arguably more responsible than any other owner in securing the present Goodell-led position of the league, which totally caters to the owners' greed, ignorance and stupidity, and now for his trouble, they can toss him out.

Cannot envision same treatment of Mara or Rooney under same circumstances.

Seems like Kraft got himself involved in something bigger than him.

Sure a billionaire, nfl team owner getting picked up for ... well you know, is worthy of a little news.

But this seemed to get more attention than it deserved nationally.

Seems someone knew more was coming, and now we're starting to see it.

Kraft was just in the wrong happy ending massage parlor at the wrong time.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Seems like Kraft got himself involved in something bigger than him.

Sure a billionaire, nfl team owner getting picked up for ... well you know, is worthy of a little news.

But this seemed to get more attention than it deserved nationally.

Seems someone knew more was coming, and now we're starting to see it.

Kraft was just in the wrong happy ending massage parlor at the wrong time.

Not lost on me that it's in Shula/Dolphins country.

But, Jones and Irsay are still there. Why be harder on Kraft?


Well,


ditto...Brady? ditto...Belichick? ditto...Patriots?

I mean, you don't need to be on Sesame Street to see the obvious pattern here...


I never supported the unwarranted or unfair abuse of other teams, whether it's the Jets, Raiders or Giants or whoever. Irrelevant that I'm not a fan of them.

 

[JetFan79]

Not lost on me that it's in Shula/Dolphins country.

But, Jones and Irsay are still there. Why be harder on Kraft?


Well,


ditto...Brady? ditto...Belichick? ditto...Patriots?

I mean, you don't need to be on Sesame Street to see the obvious pattern here...


I never supported the unwarranted or unfair abuse of other teams, whether it's the Jets, Raiders or Giants or whoever. Irrelevant that I'm not a fan of them.

I really think it's because Krafy got himself caught up in something much bigger than the NFL.

This isn't going away any time soon. Likely is gonna get much worse too.

 

[Deus Irae]

This thread really needs to be doused in gasoline and set on fire.

 

[LJRomanoff]

I really think it's because Krafy got himself caught up in something much bigger than the NFL.

This isn't going away any time soon. Likely is gonna get much worse too.

Nah.