Pro Football Focus individual grades for Patriots roster

[Shockt327]

Here's the link....
New England Patriots | NFL roster by position | Pro Football Focus

I just created a spreadsheet, wondering to hear everyone's thoughts.

My first observations:
Brady, Flowers, & Gilmore are no surprise, but...
...Lawrence Guy is that good?
Malcolm Brown is that bad?
James Develin is just 5th at FB? How? Are there even 4 other active FBs in the league anymore?
The McCourtys are ranked 6th & 16th, respectively, but I wouldnt've guessed Jason > Devin
Oh, and how is Trent Brown the lowest graded O-lineman?

 

[maineman209]

Interesting.

No "elite" players, only three "high quality", but a lot of "good to very good".

OTOH, apparently HT and KVN are barely above average.

I think Guy has been performing better than most folks understand. But Brown being rated below Shelton (and by that margin)? I'm not sure I'm getting their criteria on that one.

Also, kinda funny that Develin is rated the #5 FB in the league, but still just "average".

 

[TomPatriot]

These grades piss me off. No way Develin is below average. No way does the OL (except for Mason, who might have graded a bit high) grade that low.

 

[Deus Irae]

These grades piss me off. No way Develin is below average. No way does the OL (except for Mason, who might have graded a bit high) grade that low.

It's PFF, so who cares? PFF grades and analytics aren't to be taken seriously.

 

[Shockt327]

These grades piss me off. No way Develin is below average. No way does the OL (except for Mason, who might have graded a bit high) grade that low.

This too. The Patriots are stacked with talent on O-line. How can they be graded so low individually?

Likewise, how can the Pats have two "High Quality" D-linemen, but such a poor D-line & pass-rush?

 

[jmt57]

I am having difficulty with the concept of Elandon Roberts being virtually as productive as Kyle Van Noy or Dont'a Hightower.

Same goes for the idea of James Develin being 'average' at his position.

 

[Ring 6]

It’s PFF. Make a chart and throw darts and you will be as accurate.

 

[primetime]

The color codes are funny because I guess Gilmore, despite being the best corner in the league, still wasn't "elite."

There's some value to this in a squinty kind of way, like this gives you a broad idea of how well Patriots players played and it seems reasonable for the most part. I think Guy is very underrated and Malcom Brown is awful and Gilmore is among the very best cornerbacks in the league and Trent Brown has been barely adequate, and obviously anything that confirms my preconceptions must be good and right.

That said, the quantification and ranking is ******** because it's totally unclear what the units even are (90.1... what?) and the grading rubrics, if they even exist and this isn't just pure ********, aren't public info. So you can't really rank players against each other because the graders may be wildly different in the standards they apply.

It's funny because PFF graders actually watch a lot of football and probably have some pretty interesting qualitative insights into play that even fans might miss, but all of that is discarded so they can turn those observations into goofy and meaningless numbers in order to have the appearance of mathematical rigor, so all we're left with is these numbers that tell us nothing except in very broad strokes. It's basically like grading essays on a 100 point scale and providing no context on how a 94 differs from a 91. Professors and teachers do that all the time of course but it's with a sort of tacit understanding that the whole practice is mystified ******** graded on a curve based on feel for what a student deserves, and they at least provide comments on why the essay worked or didn't. PFF doesn't even do that.

 

[Boomer B]

Unless the person grading knows exactly what the assignments are, what the call is, the adjustments, etc... then these have to be taken with a grain of salt.

 

[TomPatriot]

It's PFF, so who cares? PFF grades and analytics aren't to be taken seriously.

I can see why. They don’t watch the games or they don’t know what they are watching.

 

[Shockt327]

Wait...didn't see his name, but PFF also has the following special-teamer on their All Pro list:

ST – Albert McClellan, New England Patriots

(scroll to the very bottom of the page)

 

[Deus Irae]

I can see why. They don’t watch the games or they don’t know what they are watching.

It's pretty clear, from the across the board results, that their formulae suck. That's been the problem with PFF since the day it went from couch geeks counting snaps to couch geeks trying their hands at statistical, but lousy, analysis.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Tom Brady Was 33rd Best Player in NFL in 2010, According to Pro Football Focus, Despite Unanimous MVP Selection

 

[Shockt327]

I can see why. They don’t watch the games or they don’t know what they are watching.

Well, in all fairness, since Cris Collinsworth took over, PFF has hired nothing but former NFL/NCAA scouts to grade the games. So, it's no longer just a bunch of fans trying to grade every player off of a TV broadcast (which was an utter joke).

Now, obviously, there's still plenty of room to (head-scratchingly) disagree with their grades. But, flaws and all, it's about as close to a legit professional 'grade' as you'll ever get; and if they still "don't know what they are watching" then I'd wager a good chunk of of NFL Front Offices/Coaching Staffs "don't know" either (which very well may be the honest truth, lol). So, I think it's still relevant; flawed, but still relevant.

 

[maust]

How can they expect their ratings system to be taken seriously when their #1 rated CB receives a 'High Quality' but not 'Elite' grade? By definition that would mean there are no 'Elite' corners?

 

[Deus Irae]

ow, obviously, there's still plenty of room to (head-scratchingly) disagree with their grades. But, flaws and all, it's about as close to a legit professional 'grade' as you'll ever get; and if they still "don't know what they are watching" then I'd wager a good chunk of of NFL Front Offices/Coaching Staffs "don't know" either (which very well may be the honest truth, lol). So, I think it's still relevant; flawed, but still relevant.

You lost me when you went to this paragraph. If the current PFF is as close to a legit professional 'grade' as you'll ever get, we might as well shut every one of these sites down and never bother with this type of analytics again.

 

[Shockt327]

You lost me when you went to this paragraph.

I'm simply saying that PFF is as close to a professional evaluation as a fan can get. So, while I get the criticisms of PFF, I still wouldn't entirely dismiss their process as if it were completely useless. They use former scouts now. So, if there are flaws in their evaluation of talent, I'd imagine that a great deal of that is true for actual NFL coaches/staff, too.

For example, Belichick himself has pointed out that even he can mistakenly assume blame to a certain NE defender for, say, a hole in coverage (without knowing the call) but then realizing he was wrong after talking with his own players. So, despite this, they still have to at least try and breakdown plays from opposing teams as best they can, albeit, without certainty. So, even the best coach in the NFL knows that there's room for holes/flaws in their evaluation process, right? So, with that being said, I think PFF is about as close to a professional "grade" as you can get as a fan. Yeah, it's flawed. Yeah, they make a guess on uncertain plays, too. But it's still as close to a professional evaluation as you're going to get.

 

[Shockt327]

If the current PFF is as close to a legit professional 'grade' as you'll ever get, we might as well shut every one of these sites down and never bother with this type of analytics again.

Huh? Now you lost me.

 

[Brady6]

It's PFF, so who cares? PFF grades and analytics aren't to be taken seriously.

Somebody cares and some people take it seriously otherwise there wouldn’t be a PFF website and it wouldn’t be recognized as a standard player evaluation site.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Here's the link....
New England Patriots | NFL roster by position | Pro Football Focus

I just created a spreadsheet, wondering to hear everyone's thoughts.

My first observations:
Brady, Flowers, & Gilmore are no surprise, but...
...Lawrence Guy is that good?
Malcolm Brown is that bad?
James Develin is just 5th at FB? How? Are there even 4 other active FBs in the league anymore?
The McCourtys are ranked 6th & 16th, respectively, but I wouldnt've guessed Jason > Devin
Oh, and how is Trent Brown the lowest graded O-lineman?

I really have no idea how they come up with these grades.

Develin for example. Are they saying he is a sucky blocker?

Harmon plays a lot of deep zone so he MIGHT be in the vicinity of a player that makes a catch. Does that count against him?

What did Danny Shelton do to be above average? Clayborn?