Some Thoughts on the JAX Game

[Ring 6]

The Pats seemed to have run alot on 3rd down for no luck.

Brady passed for 12 - 1st downs and Bortles 22 - 1st downs.

Patriots ran on 4 of 12 3td downs and converted 2. One was a scramble. One was a qb sneak. One was a 3rd and 5 draw. One was a 3rd and short run.

 

[TommyD4207]

McDaniels was trying to exploit the Jags run defense and test that. The play calling was fine in the first half as well. The execution was terrible because the Patriots don't have a wideout that can legitimately scare defenses away from cheating up and pressing. They were also missing their starting RT.

3rd and 5 at midfield is a tough time to test that, when you're already trailing.

 

[Brewskies]

Wait...you think Miami is going to win the AFC East this year? Based on one bad loss?

I am sorry, I didn't base my position about Miami on the Pats loss instead I watched both Miami's wins. They have improved IMO.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

You can only run the hurry-up offense when each and every player knows the plays like the back-of-their-hand...

On the other hand, if you still believe that Brown, Thuney, Andrews, Mason, and Waddle can fully protect Brady in the hurry-up, while he's standing back there looking for an inexperienced open receiver, then hell, go for it. But, you'd better have Hoyer warming up on the sideline.

I agree that inexperience on offense is keeping them from running the no-huddle/hurry-up, and that is a problem since it has often been an effective weapon.

I don't, however, agree that it is incompatible with our O-line (though Waddle is a weak point). The no-huddle has a tendency to SLOW DOWN the pass rush, NOT leave you more vulnerable to it. Defenders get confused, rushed, and unable to disguise their coverages and rushes. IMO more no huddle will keep Brady MORE upright, not less, but only when the receivers can handle it and see what Brady sees, in an instant.

 

[Brewskies]

The Pats bad luck and misses in the draft in recent years may be starting to catch up to them as well.

If your serious, I agree but when you are on the low rung of picking order because you have a great season the choices are tough. Hard to pick up top players in the draft if you are picking last.

 

[Kontradiction]

If your serious, I agree but when you are on the low rung of picking order because you have a great season the choices are tough. Hard to pick up top players in the draft if you are picking last.

You can still pick up some good talent. There have been numerous examples over the years where they missed on a player in the second round or later when there was still a player on the board that actually ended up being a quality starter in the league. But I'm also talking about the horrific luck with injuries to our top overall picks in the last five years as well.

 

[goheels22002]

to me, it's the most challenging regular season game for the pats this year

as it stands, now the toughest road opponent will be the steelers in december

combine that with the heat and humidity, getting through it with low relative injury was the priority. they got pushed around but were still in it until the brady fumble.......

I am not at all rattled about what happened yesterday. That is the 2nd best team in the AFC IMHO. They played great. I think the Pats beat them at home.

Here's what I saw:

1) Jacksonville's O-Line is huge and aggressive. They dominated the 1st half. The Pats adjusted and did a better job in the second half.

2) Blake Bortles is a very good QB. He was lights out yesterday the same way he was against the Steelers in the AFC Divisional Round last year.

2A) Bortles is comfortable with the hurry-up offense and gave the Pats defense a bitter taste of their own medicine.

3) Right Tackle is a big problem for the Patriots. Waddle is not the answer. Jax was overloading on Waddle all day and made Brady pay.

4) Eric Rowe needs to get his head out of his ass. He's better than what we saw yesterday. Once they spotted that he couldn't cover in the first 5-8 yards, the Jax receivers did double moves or screens and Bortles didn't hesitate at all to throw at whomever Rowe was "covering." That can be fixed.

5. The drive to make it 21-3 at the end of the 1st half was the killer. If the Pats could have gotten a stop and kept it 14-3, the second half is different (the Pats won the 2nd half 17-10.)

 

[Observer]

Good fumble recovery, you're absolutely correct. I misspoke, I meant 'illegal procedure'! But I think you get the gist of my thoughts.

Did you just discover fonts or something?

 

[PatriotsNumero1Fan]

If your serious, I agree but when you are on the low rung of picking order because you have a great season the choices are tough. Hard to pick up top players in the draft if you are picking last.

That’s the biggest load of crock i ever seen. You can get decent players in the second and onward that can do a decent job. Right now I don’t even know if this defense’s average against the contenders.

 

[goheels22002]

I am sorry, I didn't base my position about Miami on the Pats loss instead I watched both Miami's wins. They have improved IMO.

Fess up. Did you really watch the 7 hour - 10 minute game between the Titans and the Dolphins.? That game was nothing to judge how good Miami will be this year.

 

[catent]

I'd like to know what people would like McDaniels to have done differently in that game given the handicap the team has at the WR position coupled with the fact that they were playing the best defense in football on the road. Can we get specifics?

I can't remember the specific drive but I believe they were down 14-0, moved the ball down the field, were in a great position to score after a 15 yard penalty and threw two poorly executed plays towards Dorsett.

They got the ball down the field by taking advantage of White and their WRs in space over the middle. I'd have liked for them to have stuck with that schematic in the red area.

 

[catent]

I don’t think it’s reasonable to say over the last few years their approach to big games mentally is bad when they are 9-2 in the playoffs the last 4 years.

Fair enough, but have you not noticed that against more aggressive, intense teams, they often start slow and take the first punch rather than giving it?

Atlanta
Philadelphia
Baltimore
Jacksonville x2

Yes, they won 3/5 of those matchups but better starts to those games could've made their life much easier.

 

[catent]

It's only Week 2. Relax. This team doesn't have any tendencies yet. They lost to a tough defense on the road in sweltering heat conditions mostly without two of their best defenders. It's not emblematic of their season or their team as a whole.

I did not claim that this one game would be representative of their entire season. I agree with your sentiments.

 

[Kontradiction]

I can't remember the specific drive but I believe they were down 14-0, moved the ball down the field, were in a great position to score after a 15 yard penalty and threw two poorly executed plays towards Dorsett.

They got the ball down the field by taking advantage of White and their WRs in space over the middle. I'd have liked for them to have stuck with that schematic in the red area.

The problem with that is that the field shrinks in that area. Those routes that were there before were no longer there with the shorter field.

 

[catent]

The problem with that is that the field shrinks in that area. Those routes that were there before were no longer there with the shorter field.

No doubt, but they left Gronk in to block on those plays iirc, making me think they were specifically designed to isolate Dorsett in space; perhaps a good idea poorly executed.

Or maybe they could've split Gronk out wide to potentially create space and room for others to operate.

 

[Deus Irae]

If your serious, I agree but when you are on the low rung of picking order because you have a great season the choices are tough. Hard to pick up top players in the draft if you are picking last.

Why do people here consistently fall back to this narrative? It's simply not true. Let's start with the basic truth: Assigned draft position only prevents a team from signing players available to other teams in the first round. In other words, the Super Bowl winner has access to all but 31 potential draftees. Now, having gotten that out of the way, let's just look at options regarding the first player the Patriots have drafted in recent years:

• 2013: Jamie Collins. If that pick's not good enough for you, just realize this. With the Hernandez situation having gone down, the Patriots could have chosen Travis Kelce as his replacement, because he went 11 picks after Collins.
  
• 2014: Dominique Easley. Stephon Tuitt was available (I was clamoring for him). Even before Tuitt, Joel Bitonio was available if the team wanted to go OL. And there were quarterbacks and other successful players taken right in that area, as well
  
• 2015: Malcom Brown. Landon Collins was the very next pick. Collins is not a DL, but we're told that it's not about need, after all
  
• 2016: Cyrus Jones. Vonn Bell was the very next pick. James Bradberry was the pick after that.
• 2017: Derek Rivers. Kareem Hunt went 3 picks later (right after the Patriots drafted Antonio Garcia). Shaquill Griffin went 7 picks later
• 2018: Wynn was injured, so pointing out anything here wouldn't be appropriate, IMO

The players have been there. The team's just missed.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

Why do people here consistently fall back to this narrative? It's simply not true. Let's start with the basic truth: Assigned draft position only prevents a team from signing players available to other teams in the first round. In other words, the Super Bowl winner has access to all but 31 potential draftees. Now, having gotten that out of the way, let's just look at options regarding the first player the Patriots have drafted in recent years:

• 2013: Jamie Collins. If that pick's not good enough for you, just realize this. With the Hernandez situation having gone down, the Patriots could have chosen Travis Kelce as his replacement, because he went 11 picks after Collins.
  
• 2014: Dominique Easley. Stephon Tuitt was available (I was clamoring for him). Even before Tuitt, Joel Bitonio was available if the team wanted to go OL. And there were quarterbacks and other successful players taken right in that area, as well
  
• 2015: Malcom Brown. Landon Collins was the very next pick. Collins is not a DL, but we're told that it's not about need, after all
  
• 2016: Cyrus Jones. Vonn Bell was the very next pick. James Bradberry was the pick after that.
• 2017: Derek Rivers. Kareem Hunt went 3 picks later (right after the Patriots drafted Antonio Garcia). Shaquill Griffin went 7 picks later
• 2018: Wynn was injured, so pointing out anything here wouldn't be appropriate, IMO

The players have been there. The team's just missed.

Bingo. Bad drafting since 2014.

 

[Kontradiction]

No doubt, but they left Gronk in to block on those plays iirc, making me think they were specifically designed to isolate Dorsett in space; perhaps a good idea poorly executed.

They needed the help in pass protection. They might have been more comfortable with doing that had Cannon been healthy.

 

[Deus Irae]

Bingo. Bad drafting since 2014.

That's kind of unfair, too, though. As is often the case with this team once we get past Brady/BB, things are more nuanced than binary. It's not just a generic "bad drafting since 2014" situation, as the team's hit on players during that stretch. Here are some players who were taken after the first choice, and who were worth drafting even if only as backups.

2014: JAG, White and Fleming
2015: Flowers, Mason, Cardona
2016: Thuney, Brissett, Mitchell (until his knees fell off), E. Roberts, Karras
2017: Wise

It's not the overall drafting, necessarily. It's the missing on the theoretically surer picks with supposedly higher ceilings, and missing on positions that are usually more heavily drafted at the top. And it's also the missing picks (no 1st in 2016, no 1st or 2nd in 2017).

 

[NG Pats Fan]

That's kind of unfair, too, though. It's not just a generic "bad drafting since 2014" situation, as the team's hit on players during that stretch. Here are some players who were taken after the first choice, and who were worth drafting even if only as backups.

2014: JAG, White and Fleming
2015: Flowers, Mason, Cardona
2016: Thuney, Brissett, Mitchell (until his knees fell off), E. Roberts, Karras
2017: Wise

It's not the overall drafting, necessarily. It's the missing on the theoretically surer picks with supposedly higher ceilings, and missing on positions that are usually more heavily drafted at the top.

That entire group is underwhelming except for JAG...who doesn’t count since we traded him away and got nothing impressive in return. Half the guys you listed are no longer on the team or not impactful

Look at 2016 draft...4 of the first 5 draft picks are no longer on the team!