What is Wrong with Brady? The Debate Continues...

[MainePatsFan26]

The moment the article blames Brady for the Buffalo game 1 pick, it becomes useless.

If we're talking about the Gronk jump ball, it really was a crapshoot play that didn't fall Brady's way. That one wasn't one of the head scratchers. The one that is the worst would be the pick versus Pittsburgh. Let's hope Brady can have a flawless game against the Jets to help give him further personal momentum as we likely face the Chiefs in New England (if we get the #1).

 

[supafly]

The moment the article blames Brady for the Buffalo game 1 pick, it becomes useless.

Looks like he was held on the play, for sure.

 

[RayClay]

I root for the Patriots. Was that unclear?

You said Brady was a liability. Seems pretty unclear you're doing anything but trolling.

 

[RayClay]

I don’t know about anyone being a *****, but it is probably worth noting that this is the first time since 2002 where Brady has thrown INTs in 5 straight games.

Since we were discussing it, I figured that I’d list some of the reasons why this may be happening. Both articles that I’ve cited are worth a read, in my opinion.

Do you think Edelman, Mitchell and Hogan have anything to do with it?

 

[supafly]

Do you think Edelman, Mitchell and Hogan have anything to do with it?

And, the other side of the coin:

Why Tom Brady's MVP-Caliber 2017 Season May Be the Most Impressive Ever - Bleacher Report Why Tom Brady's MVP-Caliber 2017 Season May Be the Most Impressive Ever — Bleacher Report

Yep, which is why I included the second article, as previously stated. As a matter of fact, I think both articles suggest how this is an issue.

 

[Deus Irae]

Looks like he was held on the play, for sure.

Yeah.

If you look at the picks, you have to acknowledge that one INT was basically a punt (which the article does note, and which would only excuse the INT if Brady really was viewing the throw as a punt/"Why not" sort of toss), one of the INTs might have been on the receiver (the pick on the throw to Britt, and the article also notes that) and one INT was clearly the result of a blatant penalty that was not called.

That doesn't mean that Brady has 0 percent blame in any, or all, of the picks, because you can almost always slice up 100% into tiny chunks. But it does mean that the INT picture is not as straightforward as some would have us believe. And, as I've noted a couple of times on the board, that Buffalo pick changes the direction of the story, if you lay the blame on the officials, where it belongs. Without it being laid on Brady, we're basically just saying "Annual crap came came against Miami, as it often does, but Brady's been fine outside of that".

Sorry if I made it seem that I was gunning at you. That Buffalo non-call just frosts me. It cost the team an INT, made a game needlessly more dramatic, and cost Gronk a game, yet the officials get to skate on it in article after article.

 

[Off The Grid]

I really like when I sit down to take a poop, and that first wipe has nothing there. A clean poop! It feels like a victory of sorts. Perhaps life has started to make me really appreciate the little things, or maybe I am overcome by Christmas mirth.

I hope I added something of value to this thread.

Ah, yes: The Immaculate Defecation. It does sort'f make you feel like "Everything's gonna be all right", doesn't it? It is gonna be...a merry Christmas.

 

[supafly]

If you look at the picks, you have to acknowledge that one INT was basically a punt (which the article does note, and which would only excuse the INT if Brady really was viewing the throw as a punt/"Why not" sort of toss), one of the INTs might have been on the receiver (the pick on the throw to Britt, and the article also notes that) and one INT was clearly the result of a blatant penalty that was not called.

That doesn't mean that Brady has 0 percent blame in any, or all, of the picks, because you can almost always slice up 100% into tiny chunks. But it does mean that the INT picture is not as straightforward as some would have us believe. And, as I've noted a couple of times on the board, that Buffalo pick changes the direction of the story, if you lay the blame on the officials, where it belongs. Without it being laid on Brady, we're basically just saying "Annual crap came came against Miami, as it often does, but Brady's been fine outside of that".

I can respect the debate that there may be some additional variables such as key injuries, new receiving options, and even some inconsistencies on the OL which have led Brady to make a couple/few poor decisions that are a bit uncharacteristic for what we’ve grown to expect. I think it’s at least reasonable to discuss, at least on some level, as long as people don’t take it too far.

I also didn’t want it to appear as though I was overstating or parroting that opinion, which is why I tried to make sure that I included the entire picture by providing a second link which shows what a good job he’s doing under certain circumstances.

The non-call in the Bills game frosts me too, man. No doubt. I do think there may be some pains involved, whether that’s growing pains or injury pains or a bit of both. As you note, the one real bad game was without Gronkowski, so that should be taken into account. I thought that even the first (more negative) article ended on a positive note though, with the blogger expecting a return to excellence, rather than some of these other mediots who are taking this opportunity to try and push him off of some made up cliff.

 

[Deus Irae]

I can respect the debate that there may be some additional variables such as key injuries, new receiving options, and even some inconsistencies on the OL which have led Brady to make a couple/few poor decisions that are a bit uncharacteristic for what we’ve grown to expect. I think it’s at least reasonable to discuss, at least on some level, as long as people don’t take it too far.

I also didn’t want it to appear as though I was overstating or parroting that opinion, which is why I tried to make sure that I included the entire picture by providing a second link which shows what a good job he’s doing under certain circumstances.

The non-call in the Bills game frosts me too, man. No doubt. I do think there may be some pains involved, whether that’s growing pains or injury pains or a bit of both. As you note, the one real bad game was without Gronkowski, so that should be taken into account. I thought that even the first (more negative) article ended on a positive note though, with the blogger expecting a return to excellence, rather than some of these other mediots who are taking this opportunity to try and push him off of some made up cliff.

Just to add to that, Tom is at 8 INTs for the season, which is not a bad number, and he's still 3rd in the league for the lowest INT percentage. Post-2009, his INTs per year have totaled 4,12,8,11,9,7,2 and 8 (1 game still left to possibly add to this last number). Additionally, if you look a the heavier INT seasons there, you see

2017 - Has thrown at least 1 pick in 5 games of a 5 game stretch
2015 - Threw at least 1 pick in 4 games of a 5 game stretch
2014 - Threw at least 1 pick in 6 games of a 7 game stretch
2013 - Threw at least 1 pick in 5 games of a 6 game stretch
2012 - Threw 5 picks in a 4 game stretch
2011 - Threw 10 picks in an 8 game stretch, and threw at least one pick in 5 of those 8 games

So what we're seeing isn't really all the unusual. It's just at the high end of the occasional Brady INT bunch, in the sense of there being no clean game in among the INT games.*



*I note, again, that the stat looks worse because of that non-call against Buffalo.

 

[luuked]

Please don’t take my word for it. Just watch the tape. The tape does not lie. His ball, since the chargers game, when I think he first hurt his archillies, has lost some zip.

It has nothing to do with age or diminished skills, it is all about not being able to push off and step into his throws properly due to the injury.

Can you post an example ? I can make the gifs if you give me the exact plays that make you feel that.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

I've edited this post to reflect the thoughtful commentary on here that has called me out for suggesting Brady has room for improvement -- because even the GOAT can be even greater. The picks place the Patriots in a difficult position and Brady would be the first to tell you that, as they're on to the Jets, he will be reviewing his picks rather than watching his td throw to Gronk while salivating.

Long story short, what has been wrong with Brady compared to his usual self? He has been missing open receivers, has been throwing picks, etc. I'd say it is about the pass rush of the opposition, but even when the pressure isn't there he has been playing like the boogeyman is about to get him. In year's past, he's been hit more often but hasn't played like this for this number of games.

So, is this him fighting an injury? A disruption to his training regimen? A psychic disturbance from beyond the grave or Peyton with a voodoo doll? Marriage trouble? The beginning of the dive off the cliff (aka "This is 40, Part II")?

Today, Brady was a liability. The team would have beat the Bills 36-9 if you take away the pick 6. It was a close 16-16 game that could have been 20-16 Bills if they hadn't lost that touchdown before the half. Brady had some good throws, but as many iffy ones and the running game bailed them out. And that pick 6 will cost them a game in the playoffs if Brady doesn't clean a few aspects of his game up. Just saying.

Agree with much of what you said. Brady is very inconsistent right now and making very poor choices at times. The Bills game would have been a very different animal if the league doesn't take away that legit TD catch by Benjamin before halftime. I can see the Ravens coming in here and beating the Patriots. The Steelers have the talent, not sure about their psychological state right now. If the Patriots played in the vastly superior NFC they would not make the Super Bowl d/t their QB play and their mediocre defense.
Belichick has to be sick watching Jimmy G, he had the heir apparent at QB here and gave him away for nothing.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

Eye test, baby.

Exactly!! The eye test tells you Brady is very inconsistent not only with his accuracy but with his decision making. Guys are open, he's either not seeing them or he's waiting too long to pull the trigger. The same pompom crowd will throw stats at you and tell you how wonderful that mediocre Patriot defense is too.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Exactly!! The eye test tells you Brady is very inconsistent not only with his accuracy but with his decision making. Guys are open, he's either not seeing them or he's waiting too long to pull the trigger. The same pompom crowd will throw stats at you and tell you how wonderful that mediocre Patriot defense is too.

I thought you gave up on them after the KC game in 2014?

And you wanted Belichick to trade Brady then.


Matter of fact I’m certain of it.

 

[PP2]

Please don’t take my word for it. Just watch the tape. The tape does not lie. His ball, since the chargers game, when I think he first hurt his archillies, has lost some zip.

It has nothing to do with age or diminished skills, it is all about not being able to push off and step into his throws properly due to the injury.

I expect we will run the ball a good bit against the jets and keep brady’s throws to a minimum if possible. The goal being to have the archillies healed as much as possible for the 1st playoff game,

If he wasn't stepping into his throws, the ball would be sailing high consistently. It isn't quite doing that.

But I think the achilles injury may be more of factor in his accuracy than is being let on.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

I thought you gave up on them after the KC game in 2014?

And you wanted Belichick to trade Brady then.


Matter of fact I’m certain of it.

You're not certain of anything.

 

[Huckleberry1]

You're not certain of anything.

Yes I am. I actually have a thread from the week after the KC loss open in another window, it’s called, in all caps, BELICHICK IS TO BLAME,” and you are right in the middle of it saying you agree with the OP 100%, and talking about the decline of Brady’s abilities. There’s plenty more comedy gold there that we can get to but you are lying your ass off if you deny it.

 

[Huckleberry1]

The post KC 2014 threads are on the 470 pages for anyone who wants to go see the sh.t that many of the same people were talking about Brady, Belichick, and the Patriots. Same garbage, same posters, new day. The only difference is that was coming off a really bad loss, whereas this garbage is coming as Brady is locking up the MVP and the Patriots the #1 seed overall.

It never ceases to amaze me at the sh.t that is spewed by the same people season after season after season. They don’t even need to write new posts as they are just regurgitating the same posts about how much Brady, Belichick, and that year’s team sucks.


FTR there are also levelheaded poster’s like Supafly, luuked, mgteich and others who bring reason to those threads, but the majority of it is pure spew.

The threads were locked long ago, which has always prevented me from quoting and bumping them, but they are easily found, just go to the 470 area of pages, first week of October 2014.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Doesn’t matter to me. I’d like to meet them all and break the ice. I have people on ignore that I would like to have a beer with to get to know them better.

To be a bit more clear, I’ve worked with plenty of people who I had tension with but when having a drink (social experience) I’ve realized they were damn good people and I would help them as viceversa

That's great!

 

[Ring 6]

The post KC 2014 threads are on the 470 pages for anyone who wants to go see the sh.t that many of the same people were talking about Brady, Belichick, and the Patriots. Same garbage, same posters, new day. The only difference is that was coming off a really bad loss, whereas this garbage is coming as Brady is locking up the MVP and the Patriots the #1 seed overall.

It never ceases to amaze me at the sh.t that is spewed by the same people season after season after season. They don’t even need to write new posts as they are just regurgitating the same posts about how much Brady, Belichick, and that year’s team sucks.


FTR there are also levelheaded poster’s like Supafly, luuked, mgteich and others who bring reason to those threads, but the majority of it is pure spew.

The threads were locked long ago, which has always prevented me from quoting and bumping them, but they are easily found, just go to the 470 area of pages, first week of October 2014.

Of course that was after a bad loss not after winning 10 out of 11. (By an average of 11 ppg btw). Today’s idiots are bigger idiots.

 

[luuked]

The threads were locked long ago, which has always prevented me from quoting and bumping them, but they are easily found, just go to the 470 area of pages, first week of October 2014.

Wish we had some kind of "Hall of Fame/Infamy" subforum where the mods could move some of the more notorious threads.

I dont care ! I cant stand it.