Post Game Thread Dolphins @ Pats

[AtomicDawg]

I have seen now several references about an injury or concussion for Gilmore around this thread but there is literally nothing from beat writers, him and Harmon seemed to be in good spirits on the sideline and Gilmore even gave an interview in the locker room.

Am I missing something ?

Yeah I'm not sure where these posts are coming from either. This is basically what he said about that INT.

 

[FCB02062]

Welker blew his knee out in Houston
Edelman blew his knee out in Detroit

Someone corrected me, yes ww on grass but JE was turf - my point is turf is worse that real grass... How many knees blew out at old grass foxboro And Gillette (post the old AstroTurf field) before the turf monster was installed?

 

[Ring 6]

Someone corrected me, yes ww on grass but JE was turf - my point is turf is worse that real grass... How many knees blew out at old grass foxboro And Gillette (post the old AstroTurf field) before the turf monster was installed?

You blamed Edelman’s injury on Gillette.
You quoted an article about SPRAINS that said within it THE STUDIES ARE CONTRADICTORY

 

[FCB02062]

You blamed Edelman’s injury on Gillette.
You quoted an article about SPRAINS that said within it THE STUDIES ARE CONTRADICTORY

I did not "blame" Edelman's injury on Gillette - I indicted ALL turf...as for the study, you are reading selectively

So answer the question, how many knees blew out at Foxboro and Gillette when they had grass?

 

[Deus Irae]

The difference to other places is that the turf was replaced twice since last year and the NFLPA and players continued to complain about it even afterwards. Not saying that the turf is the cause for anything but there has been an extraordinary amount of criticism it received so far.

I have no problem with asking "was it the turf....?". I have a problem blaming the turf without having any evidence, which is what that poster was doing. Note the difference between that poster's position and this article.

When looking at the playing surface, artificial turf fields like FieldTurf had a rate of 0.053 injuries per team games, compared to 0.050 injuries per team game on natural grass. Those injury rates were not statistically significant.

Statistics on ACL injuries in NFL players | Dr. David Geier - Sports Medicine Simplified
https://www.drdavidgeier.com/acl-injuries-nfl/
Now, is one many's study definitive? No, but at least he's looking at data instead of anecdotes.

 

[Angelpats]

I have no problem with asking "was it the turf....?". I have a problem blaming the turf without having any evidence, which is what that poster was doing.

Shouldn't be too hard to find out if someone wanted too. See how many teams have the same turf and compare injuries with other turfs. I don't think it's the turf, yesterday was an anomaly in regards to the injuries. I don't recall as many injuries in previous games.

 

[PatsBoy12]

So am I the only one who feels that every single player who landed a hit on Brady put a little extra sauce on the hit?

 

[RayClay]

Yeah I'm not sure where these posts are coming from either. This is basically what he said about that INT.

It's in Harmon's contract. He gets all game capping interceptions.

 

[Oswlek]

I know that Miami is garbage but at the end of the day they are also a professional team filled with pretty impressive athletes so on some level I feel like we are not giving enough credit to our coaching staff and team to so utterly dominate another AFCE team. With that said I dont get what stretch was supposed to be a D- to be honest.

I mean do you expect every drive and every decision to be 100% for it to be an A ?

No, but I expect not to have a bad enough stretch that a terrible Miami team is driving to go into halftime only down 21-17 after NE had the ball and a 14-0 lead in the second quarter.

Do you always challenge off the cuff remarks about clearly subpar play?

 

[Kdo5]

As an aside I thought Bill was out of line in his little scolding of Gruegian in the presser. It was a totally reasonable question, no need to be a douche about it. I love the guy but the attitude he has to some legitimate beat writers isnt a good look.

 

[PScottman]

I did not "blame" Edelman's injury on Gillette - I indicted ALL turf

As usual a very demonstrative and definitive claim of absolutes on your part puts you squarely in the crosshairs for criticism.

The NFL’s ACL issue: Experts debate contributing factors

There is no increased ACL epidemic in NFL, but also no way to ensure decrease

The contributing factors to ACL tears are legion, and while turf is one of them everything from cleat type, to athlete build, to preseason regimen are also in the mix. Placing the blame on one thing (Mr Gorbachev, tear down that turf!) is shortsighted. You have no basis to claim it was the turf versus the cleat versus the hard cut without proper warm up and stretching.

The ONLY solution to non-contact injuries is to not play the games. Anything else may reduce risk, but isn't going to eliminate it. Injuries are part of the game regardless of playing surface.

 

[captain stone]

Shouldn't be too hard to find out if someone wanted too. See how many teams have the same turf and compare injuries with other turfs. I don't think it's the turf, yesterday was an anomaly in regards to the injuries. I don't recall as many injuries in previous games.

That's because the two previous games were played on grass.

Then the Pats return to Foxborough…and the injuries return.

The Ebner injury was a classic, textbook Phony Turf Injury, exactly the same as Edelman's in Detroit.

Stokoe yacks it up about player safety, yet most of his bosses' stadia are installed with dangerous playing surfaces. What a feckin joke.

 

[Uptown]

 

[TommyD4207]

Yeah I'm not sure where these posts are coming from either. This is basically what he said about that INT.

Gilmore knows Harmon is the human victory cigar.

 

[Rusty Coupe]

Good column about the many mistakes the Dolphins defense made.

Beyond that, Burke, the first-year Miami defensive coordinator, is from Hudson, Massachusetts. He coached at Harvard and Boston College and had 20 friends and family in the stands for Sunday’s game.

So Burke wanted his unit to be on its game against New England. And the week of good practices and good results on multiple written tests players took suggested that would happen.

Then game day arrived, and the Patriots ran 67 offensive plays.

So the Dolphins screwed up on about one-third of their defensive plays Sunday. The week before against Tampa Bay, the Dolphins had five mental errors.

This game it was different players taking turns making mistakes. And it wasn’t just different players but the busts came on different situations and calls. So coaches couldn’t bench somebody for screwing up repeatedly. And they couldn’t stop using one particular call that no one was executing.

Dolphins’ defensive meeting outlines mental mistakes against New England. And there were lots/ Miami Herald

 

[Uptown]

Pats Pulpit on Twitter

"In the last two weeks, the Patriots blitzed Dolphins quarterback Matt Moore and the Raiders’ Derek Carr a combined 36 times," observed @ezlazar in his breakdown of the #Patriots' pass rush.“

 

[K. Dog]

Shouldn't be too hard to find out if someone wanted too. See how many teams have the same turf and compare injuries with other turfs. I don't think it's the turf, yesterday was an anomaly in regards to the injuries. I don't recall as many injuries in previous games.

What I'm perplexed by is the original motivation for switching the kind of field the Patriots play on. Given that:

1. The Patriots have had success using the old field
2. The exact causes of knee injuries are not well understood but are plausibly related to the type of surface

Given 1 and 2, there is no reason to switch surfaces. There is an unknown risk, and the old surface seemed to work well for the Patriots, who had been the most successful team in football for some time. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

 

[supafly]

What I'm perplexed by is the original motivation for switching the kind of field the Patriots play on. Given that:

1. The Patriots have had success using the old field
2. The exact causes of knee injuries are not well understood but are plausibly related to the type of surface

Given 1 and 2, there is no reason to switch surfaces. There is an unknown risk, and the old surface seemed to work well for the Patriots, who had been the most successful team in football for some time. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it".

Obviously, there was something they wanted to improve upon. My guess is that it corresponded with the added speed/shiftiness as the offense emerged and became the focal point of the squad, but that’s just a guess.

 

[K. Dog]

In my opinion, despite the score, the Dolphins game made me profoundly concerned for the future of the season. The Patriots won mainly because the Dolphins were unbelievably bad on defense. Constant missed coverages, and throw in some turnovers.

The Patriots cannot win against reasonable competition if they play like this.

Brady was continually hit. I do not believe the laws of physics and biology allow a 40-year old body to take that kind of abuse late in the season. I strongly advocated for Brady to rest 4-6 games. At this rate, he's just not going to be near the top of his game once playoffs come around.

Belichick knows more about football than I do, but on this point he's just being stubborn. He's not adapting to this unprecedented situation: a QB this old and this great. Belichick should do everything he can to protect the QB, particularly resting him and not playing him full games. Insane to allow Brady to play Q4 and Belichick's explanation ("any comeback is possible") makes no sense. Honestly I think Belichick's success is working against him here: he's been so successful that nobody has the guts or prestige to stand up to him when he is clearly wrong, as here.

More and more injuries. I don't know what the cause of all these injuries is - didn't they switch back the field? - but whatever it is, if this keeps up, it's 2015.

Multiple mental mistakes, particularly the missed snap and the interception. The interception bothers me more, it's not something to allow. Brady already has way more ints/game than last year.

I already said injuries but the OL injuries are the most concerning.

The good news is that against awful offenses the defense is good. But the OL issues, and Brady's age, and Belichick's refusal to rest Brady for a few games, make me pessimistic. What the Patriots should have done is (a) not switch the turf in their old field; (b) keep Garoppolo this season; (c) rest Brady 4 games at least.

 

[K. Dog]

In my opinion, despite the score, the Dolphins game made me profoundly concerned for the future of the season. The Patriots won mainly because the Dolphins were unbelievably bad on defense. Constant missed coverages, and throw in some turnovers.

The Patriots cannot win against reasonable competition if they play like this.

Brady was continually hit. I do not believe the laws of physics and biology allow a 40-year old body to take that kind of abuse late in the season. I strongly advocated for Brady to rest 4-6 games. At this rate, he's just not going to be near the top of his game once playoffs come around.

I don't know why Belichick didn't rest Brady for the first 4-6 games of the season. I don't know why every time I raised the possibility I got called a troll. I don't know why an obviously superb backup QB who would have been perfect for the role as second QB was traded. But Belichick's insistence on not resting Brady sharply decreased the probability of the Patriots reaching the SB.