Kony Ealy - bold prediction, won't make roster

[Ring 6]

Ok, so Bill Belichick and I are stupid and you are the smart one. That idiot Belichick seems to agree with me about how DEs are used in Carolina, but he should have consulted you. Maybe Ealy would be a starter right now. From Belichick earlier in the week:

You are kidding right?
How many times do you think a patriot DE, particularly one who, as bb says, plays inside as well as outside drops into coverage?
Because he has to do it a few times is not him "agreeing with you" about your incorrect comments.


[quite]Bill Belichick on Kony Ealy: He’s building his versatility

Clearly, Belichick doesn't know what he is talking about.[/quote]
No. You don't.

You brought up Sheard because you don't know what you are talking about. Sheard in his first three years was used very similarly as he was here.

What in the world are you taking about?
When he got there it was LeBeaus system. You do understand that is nothing like ours right?
Then ray Horton. Then Pettine.
He was not in any way in a system like ours.



[quite] Ealy comes from a completely different system and used very differently. [/quote]
You just admitted you do not know how Carolina uses their dl

Anderson is a good comparison because he came from a different system where like Ealy seemed to have more of a pass rush role than anything else.

Ealy played all downs and all situations. You are wrong. Amazing that you admit you don't know them keep acting like you are right.

I didn't expect you to understand my point about expectations of Ealy.

No one could.

I don't care about his playing time.

You care about who is credited with a start though?
His playing time DIRECTLY refutes your claim he was a situational pass rusher.
Hell he played more snaps last year than Hightower did.


[qiure]The fact that he was traded for so little shows what Carolina thought of the guy and his playing time.[/quote]
You said it shows what bb expects. Agree that was wrong?

Ealy was an under performer who has legitimate talent. The expectations for him when the Pats traded for him should have been relatively low. They were for me.

You don't matter. The patriots could have kept the #2 if their expectations were low.

They Pats took a low risk flyer on a the guy in hopes he can live up to his potential. If he turns into a very good situational pass rusher like Anderson was, the Pats won the trade. Anything more is bonus.

No they traded away their highest pick in the draft.
It's.clear you just need want to ramble and not listen so I'm done. Me and the board do not need stubborn go nowhere discussions.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Wise is taking Ealy to the woodshed so far in camp.

 

[Rob0729]

You are kidding right?
How many times do you think a patriot DE, particularly one who, as bb says, plays inside as well as outside drops into coverage?
Because he has to do it a few times is not him "agreeing with you" about your incorrect comments.

Bill Belichick on Kony Ealy: He’s building his versatility

Clearly, Belichick doesn't know what he is talking about.

No. You don't.


What in the world are you taking about?
When he got there it was LeBeaus system. You do understand that is nothing like ours right?
Then ray Horton. Then Pettine.
He was not in any way in a system like ours.

Ealy comes from a completely different system and used very differently.

You just admitted you do not know how Carolina uses their dl



Ealy played all downs and all situations. You are wrong. Amazing that you admit you don't know them keep acting like you are right.


No one could.



You care about who is credited with a start though?
His playing time DIRECTLY refutes your claim he was a situational pass rusher.
Hell he played more snaps last year than Hightower did.


[qiure]The fact that he was traded for so little shows what Carolina thought of the guy and his playing time.

You said it shows what bb expects. Agree that was wrong?



You don't matter. The patriots could have kept the #2 if their expectations were low.



No they traded away their highest pick in the draft.
It's.clear you just need want to ramble and not listen so I'm done. Me and the board do not need stubborn go nowhere discussions.[/QUOTE]

Ummm.... Your first comment clearly shows you don't know what you are talking about. Belichick has DEs shifting inside and dropping into coverage quite a bit. It isn't an occasional thing. It happens every game and happens multiple times every game.

Ealy played in all situations in Carolina, but not in the situations he has to do in New England. You still don't understand that not all DEs are used the same in every system. Their roles can vary greatly.

And Sheard was used very similarly in Cleveland before Pettine. He was used for his versatility. It was easier for him to make the transition. Pettine runs the same system that Rex Ryan runs and the OLB was asked to mostly pin his ears back and rush the passer on passing downs. That wasn't Sheard's forte.

Again, you are counting snaps and I am looking at his role in the defense. What transfers from what he did in Carolina is his pass rush role.

They traded their top pick in the draft to get a Ealy and a pick eight spots later in the draft. You totally misrepresent what the Pats traded. They traded down eight spots for Ealy. They didn't trade a second rounder for Ealy.

Good decision to be done. You should have quit about six posts ago.

 

[mgteich]

They traded down eight spots for Ealy. They didn't trade a second rounder for Ealy.

We traded trade value equal to a late 4th for Ealy. This seems a very reasonable price for a DE who played more than any of CAR's other DE's.

As with almost all DL's (and OLB's), Patricia is testing him in many different roles. Folks seem to think that he should be expected to excel at these roles after a few practices. It could take half a season before he is really productive.

Also, as is the case every year, folks don't seem to think that experience counts for much. Folks are quick to say that an UDFA is a lock, and at the same time think that Ealy is unlikely to make the team. This could happen, but Patricia would need to see a lot more data before he concludes that a healthy experienced player who played more reps than any DE for CAR is not good enough to be #14 in our defensive front seven.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Or Grissom. All of the above, including the rookies, appear to be ahead of Ealy right now.

Ealy does not play Ninks role in the defense.

 

[RobertWeathers]

It seems somewhat unlikely to me that any ONE player "takes over Nink's role", at least not by Week-1. It seems more likely to me that, at first, two or more players may each take a piece of Nink's role and that the distribution will vary from opponent-to-opponent for awhile, perhaps even all season.

Exactly. Nink is tough to replace but it's not like he was Lawrence Taylor.

It's driving me nuts people are viewing Ealy a 1:1 replacement and he's not. Nink was a LB who had DE responsibility. Ealy is a pure DE who has moved inside sometimes.

While Ealy's performance and buy -in to the Patriots Way are question marks, not being Ninks replacement is not.

 

[Rob0729]

We traded trade value equal to a late 4th for Ealy. This seems a very reasonable price for a DE who played more than any of CAR's other DE's.

As with almost all DL's (and OLB's), Patricia is testing him in many different roles. Folks seem to think that he should be expected to excel at these roles after a few practices. It could take half a season before he is really productive.

Also, as is the case every year, folks don't seem to think that experience counts for much. Folks are quick to say that an UDFA is a lock, and at the same time think that Ealy is unlikely to make the team. This could happen, but Patricia would need to see a lot more data before he concludes that a healthy experienced player who played more reps than any DE for CAR is not good enough to be #14 in our defensive front seven.

Yeah, a late 4th value is what you give up for a guy with the experience and potential Ealy has, but hasn't lived up to that potential. A late 4th is the type of pick Belichick would give up for a flyer.

Ring 6 was making it like it was the same thing as the second rounder the Cards gave up for Chandler Jones.

 

[Rob0729]

Exactly. Nink is tough to replace but it's not like he was Lawrence Taylor.

It's driving me nuts people are viewing Ealy a 1:1 replacement and he's not. Nink was a LB who had DE responsibility. Ealy is a pure DE who has moved inside sometimes.

While Ealy's performance and buy -in to the Patriots Way are question marks, not being Ninks replacement is not.

The sad thing is if Nink didn't retire, Ealy is exactly where people would expect him to be - being a back up for the starting DEs and the first guy off the bench. I think that is what Belichick envisioned him as when he traded for him. Granted with Nink's age, I think he expected him to be in heavy rotation.

People just now assume that Nink retired that he should become Nink 2.0 or something.

 

[RayClay]

Since there is so much negativity from this thread about Ealy and his production thus far in camp, I thought I would post the positive:



Now I don't put much weight on either the negative or the positive at this point, but I figured I would give some balance.

I wanna believe!

 

[maineman209]

Exactly. Nink is tough to replace but it's not like he was Lawrence Taylor.

It's driving me nuts people are viewing Ealy a 1:1 replacement and he's not. Nink was a LB who had DE responsibility. Ealy is a pure DE who has moved inside sometimes.

While Ealy's performance and buy -in to the Patriots Way are question marks, not being Ninks replacement is not.

Well, Nink was a DE until he attempted to convert to OLB the first time in 2008, when DC Paul Pasqualoni (at Parcells' direction) converted the Fins to the 3-4. It didn't work out, obviously.

Once Nink was promoted from premier special-teamer to the defense full time in 2010, he pretty much was a 1:1 replcement for Vrabel as a 3-4 OLB who dropped down to the line at times. That was Nink's second season with the Pats, and 2010 also more or less marks the beginning of the Pats' transition from the 3-4 to the 4-3 based hybrid they now run. As the defense transitioned over the next couple seasons, so did Nink's role - eventually back to 4-3 DE.

While Ealy has been a "pure" 4-3 DE so far in the NFL with the Panthers, I don't know yet if that will be his ultimate role with the Pats. At least BB seems intent for the moment on expanding Ealy's range and skill set. And, although Ealy is closer to Wise in size than he is to Nink (or Flowers), he posted some LB-like agility numbers at the Combine (4.45 shuttle, 6.83 3-cone).

His pre-draft reviews rated him as "a raw, athletic talent" - and he still is, really. Whether that's his own fault for a lack of good work ethic, or the fault of the Carolina coaches for not knowing how to school him, remains to be seen.

Ealy is definitely NOT any 1:1 Nink replacement (Flowers and Rivers may actually be closer), but there's still a chance that he might eventually take SOME of Nink's role in certain situations - IF Belichick and the coaching staff can succeed in developing him where others have apparently failed.

 

[Deus Irae]

I see Ealy's agent has gotten himself a Patsfans.com account...

 

[Bruins29]

. Me and the board do not need stubborn go nowhere discussions.

First, it's "the board and I"

Second, you have been here 2 months. You don't get to speak for the "board."

 

[farn]

First, it's "the board and I"

Second, you have been here 2 months. You don't get to speak for the "board."

Oh snap. (That is all)

 

[Rob0729]

First, it's "the board and I"

Second, you have been here 2 months. You don't get to speak for the "board."

LOL! Besides aren't message board intended for stubborn, go nowhere discussions? Without those types of discussions, half the message boards on the Internet would be ghost towns or shut down.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Well, Nink was a DE until he attempted to convert to OLB the first time in 2008, when DC Paul Pasqualoni (at Parcells' direction) converted the Fins to the 3-4. It didn't work out, obviously.

Once Nink was promoted from premier special-teamer to the defense full time in 2010, he pretty much was a 1:1 replcement for Vrabel as a 3-4 OLB who dropped down to the line at times. That was Nink's second season with the Pats, and 2010 also more or less marks the beginning of the Pats' transition from the 3-4 to the 4-3 based hybrid they now run. As the defense transitioned over the next couple seasons, so did Nink's role - eventually back to 4-3 DE.

While Ealy has been a "pure" 4-3 DE so far in the NFL with the Panthers, I don't know yet if that will be his ultimate role with the Pats. At least BB seems intent for the moment on expanding Ealy's range and skill set. And, although Ealy is closer to Wise in size than he is to Nink (or Flowers), he posted some LB-like agility numbers at the Combine (4.45 shuttle, 6.83 3-cone).

His pre-draft reviews rated him as "a raw, athletic talent" - and he still is, really. Whether that's his own fault for a lack of good work ethic, or the fault of the Carolina coaches for not knowing how to school him, remains to be seen.

Ealy is definitely NOT any 1:1 Nink replacement (Flowers and Rivers may actually be closer), but there's still a chance that he might eventually take SOME of Nink's role in certain situations - IF Belichick and the coaching staff can succeed in developing him where others have apparently failed.

Excellent post. That pretty much sums up the complexity Nink handled in his time here.

 

[Brady_Moss]

Patriots will trade for a player from a team they will have a scrimmage with this preseason

 

[TheFlyingWedge]

I agree with almost everything you said except that I think he will make the roster but get cut before week 6.

 

[Rob0729]

I think this article from Jeff Howe pretty much sums up how I have always felt about this move. Talks about how he was a talented, very inconsistent player in Carolina who is capable of making big plays but also disappearing for long stretches. That is what he has shown thus far in camp.

I think people are expecting to much of this guy. I always saw him more of a situational pass rusher who might grow into a bigger role like Mark Anderson was a few years back.

I think too many people had dreams of this guy being the guy from the Super Bowl a few seasons back. He was never that guy. He is wildly inconsistent and capable of being an impact guy at times but never pulled it all together. The Pats took a flyer on him (trading the equivalent of a late 4th rounder and paying him $900k if he makes the roster). I truly don't think the Pats ever thought he was definitely going to be a starter, but thought there might be a chance of it.

Patriots notebook: Kony Ealy looks to leave inconsistency issues behind in Carolina

BTW, the way Deatrich Wise is supposedly playing, Ealy might not be the opening day starter even if he was living up to the expectations of many in this thread.

 

[Uptown]

Patriots will trade for a player from a team they will have a scrimmage with this preseason

Hopefully that player is either Whitney Mercilus or Benardrick McKinney

 

[maineman209]

BTW, the way Deatrich Wise is supposedly playing, Ealy might not be the opening day starter even if he was living up to the expectations of many in this thread.

The significance of a player being on the field for the first snap of the season, and the significance of how many first snaps he's on the field for over the course of a season is way overblown.