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Cap And Contract Planning

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Nicely played, I am of two minds (at least two maybe more). There is the fan boy in me that says "Give me, Give me, Give me" and the other side tries to wonder "What will BB do?"

A lot can change in the next couple of years, injuries, rapid increase or decrease in a players production. Also the Brady WOW will be further along the curve.

Looking at the list of players there are a lot of players that I would sign if the money was right but not too many that would warrant a franchise tag. Also there are two drafts and two free agency classes to look at.

I have become conditioned by the Patriots but for now I don't see anyone who is irreplaceable among the future free agents.

I think replacing Solder or McCourty would be very hard. Don't forget we had th3 17th overall pick when we got Solder (so we'd probably need a serious level of draft investment to replace him) and safeties that can play single high effectively are very hard to find. I wouldn't bet on being able to replace either within a two year window.
 
I think replacing Solder or McCourty would be very hard. Don't forget we had th3 17th overall pick when we got Solder (so we'd probably need a serious level of draft investment to replace him) and safeties that can play single high effectively are very hard to find. I wouldn't bet on being able to replace either within a two year window.

Also it's important to keep in mind how long and hard it was to get a FS who was worth a damn. McCourty could be one of the better ones in the AFC. I would do whatever it takes to not let him go.
 
I think that you underestimate the depth of the issues in 2015. For example, we will have to sign a full set of running backs.

I expect that the team will take care of business in 2014, but almost all of the focus will be on extensions.

2014
Kicking the can on CB for another year is possible. But it would seem that at least one defensive back should be signed long-term, hopefully two.

I don't accept the idea that it is OK to keep losing starting quality linemen. We have gone from 7 starting quality linemen (some would ay 8) in 2012 to only 6 this year. Most would keep Connolly OR Wendell. After all, a rookie can pick up the slack. Wendell will go to the open market. My strong preference is that he be the next to be extended. IMHO, one of the strengths of the patriots is the OL, and its consistency. I would want to keep all six starters.
We use 6 starters. Solder has been a TE. And, of course, injuries happen.

So for me, I look forward to another extension in the next few weeks; of Wendell. Also, Edelman may be willing to sign a long-term deal.

Not to belittle the importance of resigning the OL we develope but I think Svitek would argue with your point regarding the number of starting quality OL (I know he has been hurt but he protected Matt Ryan's blind side pretty well a year or two ago and he won his roster spot here).
 
Svitek hasn't been healthy. But, yes, we do have 7 this year. As of now, we have two injured. We have always considered it important to heve even another ready to go (as mcDonald last year).
In any case, this underlines the importance of having 6-7.





Not to belittle the importance of resigning the OL we develope but I think Svitek would argue with your point regarding the number of starting quality OL (I know he has been hurt but he protected Matt Ryan's blind side pretty well a year or two ago and he won his roster spot here).
 
Based on the premise that the team makes "either/or" decisions well ahead of time, then it will be interesting to see how hard they try to sign Talib. I don't think they'll give big contracts to both Talib and McCourty.

If I read Miguel's summary of the Ninkovich deal, it wasn't all that front loaded and I think took up less than $1 million in additional cap space this year, leaving us with nearly $7 million in cap space currently.

I can't help but wonder if they want to make another restructuring move in the current season. Although I'd like to see Talib signed, at this point he's willing to gamble and test the market, so maybe McCourty and then see what Talib's market value is.
 
No team does as good a job at planning than does the patriots. The patriots try to re-sign free agents the year before they become free agents. The team tries to avoid free agent crises as mcuh as possible. Also, the patriots plan cap cost well into the future, using both rookies and long-term contract structure to manage the cap.

Most here go crazy when folks even discuss future caps. Well, we were correct to suggest that the team was choosing between hernandez and Welker a year before Welker became a free agent. Other choices have been made week ahead (e,g, Wilfork over Seymour).

SIGNINGS IN PREPARATION
The signing of NINKOVICH was awesome. One can only hope for a couple of more such contracts.

SIGNIFICANT 2014 FREE AGENTS
We have a full roster signed for 2014 (including 6 PS types). We now have only 5 players who need to be re-signed or replaced. Obviously, there are many positions where we can hope for upgrades. Also, some think that Connolly and Gregory are ripe for replacement because of their $3M salaries. Since these players are starters, this assessment seems a bit premature.

Talib
Spikes
Wendell
Edelman
Blount

====================
AND THEN THE DELUGE!
The 2014 offseason will be looking toward 2015 (with hopes of extensions) as much as worrying about the five.

A BAKER'S DOZEN
OL: Solder, Cannon, Connolly
QB: Mallett
RB: Vereen, Ridley, Bolden
DL: Wilfork, Kelly
S: McCourty, Gregory
ST: Gostkowski, Slater

There is time and there will be planning. However, do understand that any analysis of the future cap must understand that there will be a huge amount of work to do with these 13 players/positions. Hoping for $7M of cap increases is but a minor factor. Obviously, Brady's contract did a lot to help the future situation.

They franchised Welker, then he signed at Denver for almost the same amount. There's no way we "traded" signing Welker for Hernandez. WW got the big franchise and his agent soured the deal. Without Hernandez, WW wouldn't have been worth more, wouldn't have been younger and wouldn't have had a different agent, therefore the same market contract.

It's instructive that WW was still sniffing around after he got his huge offer from Denver, but the team had moved on to Amendola.

Business.
 
One has to wonder if Decker would be interested in joining the Patriots and reuniting with McDaniels? I'd be happy to give him "Welker's money" if that's agreeable.
 
Generally I think the internet is stupid but you're one of the few people who, by saying something like this, would make me question myself.

Is it really supposed to be 'waist side' instead of the more common 'way side' sorta like how it is supposed to be 'champing at the bit' instead of chomping at the bit?

I am humbled that you'd even consider that I could possibly be correct, so thank you for the thought. I'm not sure if I was just being stupid or the Firefox auto-correct jumped in, but I'm going to chalk it up to being a complete moron.

I think supa is another victim of spellcheck autocomplete. It transforms so many posts.

I'm hoping that it was an auto-correct situation. Either that or a moment of sheer stupidity at 2 am

Jeez---talk about feeling embarrassed.
 
One has to wonder if Decker would be interested in joining the Patriots and reuniting with McDaniels? I'd be happy to give him "Welker's money" if that's agreeable.

I mean--you have my permission if that's what it takes

I wonder if they gave "Welker's money" to either Aaron Hernandez or Danny Amendola though. We'll have to see how it all shakes out.
 
I think that you underestimate the depth of the issues in 2015. For example, we will have to sign a full set of running backs.

I expect that the team will take care of business in 2014, but almost all of the focus will be on extensions.

2014
Kicking the can on CB for another year is possible. But it would seem that at least one defensive back should be signed long-term, hopefully two.

I don't accept the idea that it is OK to keep losing starting quality linemen. We have gone from 7 starting quality linemen (some would ay 8) in 2012 to only 6 this year. Most would keep Connolly OR Wendell. After all, a rookie can pick up the slack. Wendell will go to the open market. My strong preference is that he be the next to be extended. IMHO, one of the strengths of the patriots is the OL, and its consistency. I would want to keep all six starters.
We use 6 starters. Solder has been a TE. And, of course, injuries happen.

So for me, I look forward to another extension in the next few weeks; of Wendell. Also, Edelman may be willing to sign a long-term deal.

I agree with you that 2015 will be a challenging year, and also that the team will likely be trying to get some of these issues worked out ahead of time. My feeling is that the 2 most important signings will be McCourty and Solder, but Solder's 5th yr option would likely be kicked in thus pushing him off another year to 2016.

That would mean that the TWO most important guys can both be erased from 2015 if we come to an extension with McCourty prior to Feb.2015. I would also imagine an extension coming for Wilfork too. That would then erase the top 3 players. Things become a lot different when you take those 3 away, and even if they only resign just one of DMcC/Wilfork that will make things a lot different.

Once you erase those players and then attempt to cross off some fraction of players who will walk/not be retained, the list becomes less intimidating, although still quite a challenge when compared to most years. As always, there will be players who we'd like to keep that will have to be let go, just like any other year.

As far as needing to retain a "full set of RB's," along with your concerns about the offensive line, keep in mind that we'll have the next 2 years of the draft to bring in some new talent too. The position of RB would actually fall relatively lower on my "worry" list, since they have been rather effective with less talent. If just one of Ridley/Vereen can be retained, they'll certainly be in an okay position (IMO). I certainly agree with you that they'll need to keep one of Wendell/Connelly, possibly even both if they can get Connelly to a restructuring of sorts--which is definitely a possibility. I think that the trenches of OL/DL will be a focus in the next 2 drafts, which should help to continue to move in the right direction.

I still am not nearly concerned about 2014, especially with the low amount of players "needed" to be retained and the current 7-8 million in available cap space that will likely be carried over. The lessened concern of 2014 jumps up to quite a challenge for 2015, so the two years likely even themselves out a bit in my opinion. Either way, Belichick does a pretty good job of looking towards the future so we'll have to put our trust in his hands. I don't see much reason in worrying too much about it though, as they may be able to address the 2015 FA challenge by taking things in a more conservative way for 2014.

I wouldn't mind seeing another draft strategy much similar to the one we used this past April where they traded down/out of the first round. That may allow them to continue to acquire some extra picks in the all-important rounds of #2 and #3. It could be argued that the strategy has helped them to rebuild on the fly in certain areas in the past 4-5 yrs, outside of the obvious struggles of the early 2009 class.
 
I mean--you have my permission if that's what it takes

I wonder if they gave "Welker's money" to either Aaron Hernandez or Danny Amendola though. We'll have to see how it all shakes out.
I hope he becomes disillusioned with the Broncos plans and decides to jump ship to the good side of the force supa. Three shifty white guys playing WR with Gronk would send equal opportunity advocates into a hilarious tirade.
 
I'd love to see us sign Decker and Emmanuel Sanders
 
Yes, it seems likely that we will trade down next year. We are likely to need to draft a couple of running backs if no one is extended before next years draft. After all, we are unlikely to go into the season with the entire running back corps playing in their contract year.


I agree with you that 2015 will be a challenging year, and also that the team will likely be trying to get some of these issues worked out ahead of time. My feeling is that the 2 most important signings will be McCourty and Solder, but Solder's 5th yr option would likely be kicked in thus pushing him off another year to 2016.

That would mean that the TWO most important guys can both be erased from 2015 if we come to an extension with McCourty prior to Feb.2015. I would also imagine an extension coming for Wilfork too. That would then erase the top 3 players. Things become a lot different when you take those 3 away, and even if they only resign just one of DMcC/Wilfork that will make things a lot different.

Once you erase those players and then attempt to cross off some fraction of players who will walk/not be retained, the list becomes less intimidating, although still quite a challenge when compared to most years. As always, there will be players who we'd like to keep that will have to be let go, just like any other year.

As far as needing to retain a "full set of RB's," along with your concerns about the offensive line, keep in mind that we'll have the next 2 years of the draft to bring in some new talent too. The position of RB would actually fall relatively lower on my "worry" list, since they have been rather effective with less talent. If just one of Ridley/Vereen can be retained, they'll certainly be in an okay position (IMO). I certainly agree with you that they'll need to keep one of Wendell/Connelly, possibly even both if they can get Connelly to a restructuring of sorts--which is definitely a possibility. I think that the trenches of OL/DL will be a focus in the next 2 drafts, which should help to continue to move in the right direction.

I still am not nearly concerned about 2014, especially with the low amount of players "needed" to be retained and the current 7-8 million in available cap space that will likely be carried over. The lessened concern of 2014 jumps up to quite a challenge for 2015, so the two years likely even themselves out a bit in my opinion. Either way, Belichick does a pretty good job of looking towards the future so we'll have to put our trust in his hands. I don't see much reason in worrying too much about it though, as they may be able to address the 2015 FA challenge by taking things in a more conservative way for 2014.

I wouldn't mind seeing another draft strategy much similar to the one we used this past April where they traded down/out of the first round. That may allow them to continue to acquire some extra picks in the all-important rounds of #2 and #3. It could be argued that the strategy has helped them to rebuild on the fly in certain areas in the past 4-5 yrs, outside of the obvious struggles of the early 2009 class.
 
Generally I think the internet is stupid but you're one of the few people who, by saying something like this, would make me question myself.

Is it really supposed to be 'waist side' instead of the more common 'way side' sorta like how it is supposed to be 'champing at the bit' instead of chomping at the bit?

I place these kinds of posts by the waste side.
 
I think replacing Solder or McCourty would be very hard. Don't forget we had th3 17th overall pick when we got Solder (so we'd probably need a serious level of draft investment to replace him) and safeties that can play single high effectively are very hard to find. I wouldn't bet on being able to replace either within a two year window.

It is a good point but I view Solder as a solid or above average LT but not a Joe Thomas type. He is an extreme value right now but is he worth true LT money?
» Over the Cap- Top NFL Contracts: Left Tackle

Like I said, I am cynical and try to evaluate things in the same context as the Patriots. Is it worth it to pay Solder $10,000,0000 per year or should they slide Vollmer over?

McCourty is growing on me, he offers above average Safety play with some position flexibility. Safeties are pretty cheap these days so this would make sense.
» Over the Cap- Top NFL Contracts: Safety
 
So for me, I look forward to another extension in the next few weeks; of Wendell. Also, Edelman may be willing to sign a long-term deal.

Wendell? Although he's a tough, smart kid, he's undersized and the league is catching on that he can be consistently pancaked - - just look at the end of last year and the first 3 games this year. Resign Wendell ONLY if he'll sign for vet minimum.

Edelman is currently a steal, deserves a raise and hopefully he can be signed for something reasonable - - if not, they'll have to agree to let him test the waters again.
 
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I mean--you have my permission if that's what it takes

I wonder if they gave "Welker's money" to either Aaron Hernandez or Danny Amendola though. We'll have to see how it all shakes out.

They gave Welker's money to both guys. One of them might be a mass murderer and the other guy's groin has become disattached. As for Decker, I would love to see him in New England. I just have to wonder what his asking price will be. Because of Welker and Thomas drawing most of the double teams, Decker will probably be in line to have a pretty successful season this year.
 
As has been the case for years, many posters underestimate the value of Wendell. He was rated as one of the best centers in the league last year.

If he is not extended, you all will get your way and Wendell will be starting for someone else. He is a reasonable NFL starter.

Perhaps, we should cut Connolly to save some money as use a couple of draft picks for offensive linemen, expecting them to produce in their first year (along with our 2 running backs).

Or just perhaps we should continue the patriot idea of having one of the best offensive line in the NFL.


Wendell? Although he's a tough, smart kid, he's undersized and the league is catching on that he can be consistently pancaked - - just look at the end of last year and the first 3 games this year. Resign Wendell ONLY if he'll sign for vet minimum.

Edelman is currently a steal, deserves a raise and hopefully he can be signed for something reasonable - - if not, they'll have to agree to let him test the waters again.
 
As has been the case for years, many posters underestimate the value of Wendell. He was rated as one of the best centers in the league last year.

If he is not extended, you all will get your way and Wendell will be starting for someone else. He is a reasonable NFL starter.

Perhaps, we should cut Connolly to save some money as use a couple of draft picks for offensive linemen, expecting them to produce in their first year (along with our 2 running backs).

Or just perhaps we should continue the patriot idea of having one of the best offensive line in the NFL.

Really? I would agree that he was better than serviceable the first 75% of last year. Since November 2012, howvever, into this year - - Brady sacks/pressures have come from right up the middle - - and so have the RB stuffs.

Once again, I'm NOT saying cut the guy. But he should not be signed for anything that would hurt our cap - - he should be vet minimum or slightly above. No other team is going to get into a bidding war for him.

In the meantime, do you have a link to those ratings of him being one of the best centers in the league last year?
 
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Really? I would agree that he was better than serviceable the first 75% of last year. Since November 2012, howvever, into this year - - Brady sacks/pressures have come from right up the middle - - and so have the RB stuffs.

Do you have a link to those ratings of him being one of the best centers in the league last year?

FWIW, both Wendell and Connolly had very poor games this weekend. I think this board overrates Wendell, for whatever reason. This OL was at it's best when Waters was playing RG and Connolly was at C during the 2011 season. I would very much like to see Connolly back at C with Cannon playing RG. IMO, they should let Wendell back up Connolly, who can easily transition to both guard spots if Cannon has to move back out to RT in case of injury to Vollmer.
 
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