Spikes looks disinterested & in a funk

[jmt57]

What Does The Future Hold For Patriots Linebacker Brandon Spikes? | NEPatriotsDraft.com | Matthew Jones

The most logical factors contributing to Spikes’ low visibility on the field thus far in 2013 are a pair of philosophical or schematic decisions made by New England’s coaching staff, namely to transition to more four-man fronts, a move which began back in 2011, and an emphasis on sub packages which feature five defensive backs (Aqib Talib at left cornerback, Steve Gregory at strong safety, Devin McCourty at free safety, Kyle Arrington in the slot, and Alfonzo Dennard at right cornerback.)

With four defensive linemen and five defensive backs, it logically follows that only two linebackers can be on the field at any given time, which, thus far, have almost always been weakside linebacker Jerod Mayo and strongside linebacker Dont’a Hightower, the two being more athletic and consequently more successful in coverage than Spikes, the most one-dimensional of the three as a player whose excellent run defense is his calling card as a pro.

Based on how rare it has been to see Spikes on the field, and based on the underlying thought processes behind that scarcity, there is a distinct possibility that New England is preparing for life without Spikes, as the 26 year-old linebacker is currently in the final season of his rookie contract and the team already has a few different contingency plans in place in the event that he signs elsewhere this coming offseason for not only a more lucrative contract but also for a more substantial role than the Patriots are willing to give him. In particular, three possibilities seem to make the most sense at this time, which will be detailed further below. ...

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[ATippett56]

Dont?a Hightower Has Shown Improvement in Pass Coverage This Season As Patriots Switch Up Coverage Scheme | New England Patriots | NESN.com

 

[Nunchucks]

Patriots are facing mostly 3 receiver sets and are playong mostly nickel defense. Has nothing to do with philosophy, more to do with playing pass defense.

 

[50-yard-line]

Maybe when they go into a sub-package, they could put Spikes on the DL. he seems like a force in the trenches.

 

[PatsBoy12]

He was balling some type of injury against the Bills, according to a Mike Reiss tweet. But as someone else mentioned, NE has been in sub a majority of the time and that hurts Spikes.

 

[Yehoodi]

Oh boy one slow and disinterested poster sticking up for another. 500+ posts in eight years, your worse than he is...Anyways it was a joke Son... a JOKE I SAY.

so was my post there sparky . . . as for posting I am not sure what that has to do with ones ability to post or add to a forum . . . there are some yahoos out in the internet netherworld (this is joke btw) who seem to think that since they post a lot makes them better or somehow smarter . . . not really sure how the connection there is made, but some try . . .

you and I of coarse both know and fully understand that one's knowledge and ability to provide insight is not based on how much time they spend on a sports fan forum . . . just jesting you know . . .

I for one spend most of my time on another teams forum and frankly don't have the time to come here, but do enjoy myself when here and only have enough time to pick and choose my topics . . . I found the spikes topic interesting and read it . . .

 

[supafly]

But as someone else mentioned, NE has been in sub a majority of the time and that hurts Spikes.

Not meaning this to come out sarcastically, but it's more of Spikes' lack of speed and talent in coverage that "hurts" in subpackages; not the fact that we've played more subs than base, as that's been going on for at least a year/year and a half now.

We're both in agreement, so it's just a matter of semantics, but there are other LB's who are in subs that can get the job done. It's the player "hurting" the team, not the team or scheme hurting the player.

 

[VrabelJr]

Maybe when they go into a sub-package, they could put Spikes on the DL. he seems like a force in the trenches.

Da fuq.... Spikes is a force against Guards because he has 5-7 yards to get up to speed. Turn that 5-7 yards into 3 feet and we'll see how much of a force he is.

 

[reflexblue]

so was my post there sparky . . . as for posting I am not sure what that has to do with ones ability to post or add to a forum . . . there are some yahoos out in the internet netherworld (this is joke btw) who seem to think that since they post a lot makes them better or somehow smarter . . . not really sure how the connection there is made, but some try . . .

you and I of coarse both know and fully understand that one's knowledge and ability to provide insight is not based on how much time they spend on a sports fan forum . . . just jesting you know . . .

I for one spend most of my time on another teams forum and frankly don't have the time to come here, but do enjoy myself when here and only have enough time to pick and choose my topics . . . I found the spikes topic interesting and read it . . .

There there, it will be ok. no need to explain.

 

[supafly]

Da fuq.... Spikes is a force against Guards because he has 5-7 yards to get up to speed. Turn that 5-7 yards into 3 feet and we'll see how much of a force he is.

That would be my concern as well.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

spikes hates football

 

[RayClay]

What Does The Future Hold For Patriots Linebacker Brandon Spikes? | NEPatriotsDraft.com | Matthew Jones

The most logical factors contributing to Spikes’ low visibility on the field thus far in 2013 are a pair of philosophical or schematic decisions made by New England’s coaching staff, namely to transition to more four-man fronts, a move which began back in 2011, and an emphasis on sub packages which feature five defensive backs (Aqib Talib at left cornerback, Steve Gregory at strong safety, Devin McCourty at free safety, Kyle Arrington in the slot, and Alfonzo Dennard at right cornerback.)

With four defensive linemen and five defensive backs, it logically follows that only two linebackers can be on the field at any given time, which, thus far, have almost always been weakside linebacker Jerod Mayo and strongside linebacker Dont’a Hightower, the two being more athletic and consequently more successful in coverage than Spikes, the most one-dimensional of the three as a player whose excellent run defense is his calling card as a pro.

Based on how rare it has been to see Spikes on the field, and based on the underlying thought processes behind that scarcity, there is a distinct possibility that New England is preparing for life without Spikes, as the 26 year-old linebacker is currently in the final season of his rookie contract and the team already has a few different contingency plans in place in the event that he signs elsewhere this coming offseason for not only a more lucrative contract but also for a more substantial role than the Patriots are willing to give him. In particular, three possibilities seem to make the most sense at this time, which will be detailed further below. ...

​

My thoughts too. It sucks because i love the aggression and instincts of spikes, but the three LBs in the base seem to be way too big/slow compared to mist 4-3s I've seen (no expert here of course) and in sub packages, Spikes is the odd man out.

Collins with Hightower in the middle is a whole new defense coverage wise. Unless this prediction doesn't happen for some reason, I'm going to hate watching Spikes thumping people for someone else, but you never know.

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: Spikes looks disinterested & in a funk

My thoughts too. It sucks because i love the aggression and instincts of spikes, but the three LBs in the base seem to be way too big/slow compared to mist 4-3s I've seen (no expert here of course) and in sub packages, Spikes is the odd man out.

Collins with Hightower in the middle is a whole new defense coverage wise. Unless this prediction doesn't happen for some reason, I'm going to hate watching Spikes thumping people for someone else, but you never know.

If we don't resign Spikes I don't think it will be Hightower at MLB, the way the scheme is setup the primary play makers are the Will LB which is Mayo being the primary tackler, and the Sam LB which is Hightower being a dual threat as a pass rusher and a tackler. The Mike which is Spikes just needs to be solid against the run, putting Hightower in that role would be a waste in my opinion.

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: Spikes looks disinterested & in a funk

He was balling some type of injury against the Bills, according to a Mike Reiss tweet. But as someone else mentioned, NE has been in sub a majority of the time and that hurts Spikes.

I think he had the flu, I think its important to remember the 2 games we played were separated by 3 days so any illness to a player like Spikes or Wilfork was likely to impact both games.

 

[RayClay]

If we don't resign Spikes I don't think it will be Hightower at MLB, the way the scheme is setup the primary play makers are the Will LB which is Mayo being the primary tackler, and the Sam LB which is Hightower being a dual threat as a pass rusher and a tackler. The Mike which is Spikes just needs to be solid against the run, putting Hightower in that role would be a waste in my opinion.

Why did they draft Collins then?

 

[supafly]

Why did they draft Collins then?

This would be my question on the discussion too.

Hightower will almost certainly get the MLB role in my opinion, as he would still be the weakest in coverage by far with Collins and Mayo in there too. His run stuffing wouldn't be quite as good as Spikes, but he's the player who would most mirror the abilities and weaknesses of Spikes in my opinion.

Collins was drafted as a contingency plan for Spikes' departure, and the hope of course is that he can use his athleticism to progress into a good cover LB. Mayo is definitely much better than Hightower in that aspect too. Hightower, while better than Spikes--is still the weakest link out of the 3 should Spikes end up leaving.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

My thoughts too. It sucks because i love the aggression and instincts of spikes, but the three LBs in the base seem to be way too big/slow compared to mist 4-3s I've seen (no expert here of course) and in sub packages, Spikes is the odd man out.

Collins with Hightower in the middle is a whole new defense coverage wise. Unless this prediction doesn't happen for some reason, I'm going to hate watching Spikes thumping people for someone else, but you never know.

Well said. Last year the aggression of Spikes seemed to (sometimes) help set a defensive tone. I loved seeing that too. But the numbers and skill sets of the LB group appear to put Spikes in a potentially tenuous position.

The Patriots finally have, at least what appears to be, a satisfactory secondary (not a perfect coverage unit, but finally not conspicuously porous). But even with a satisfactory secondary there remains the shorter/mid field stuff that the LB group will frequently be responsible for. And that stuff has been a payday for opposing QBs.

So, ultimately, how many run stopping but not fast enough to be effective in coverage LB's can a team afford to have in its base 4-3? I'm certainly no expert either but it seems the answer excludes............especially if Collins can show something in the opportunities he gets/his game progresses.
I'd assume Spikes will squarely become a sub used for infrequent specific situations. If that is the case then Spikes, for better or worse, will be playing out his final games with the Patriots. Hey, maybe we can hope for this to give him additional motivation. He'll want to maximize his value for his upcoming free agency by making opposing offenses feel his presence even more (whenever he does see the field).

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: Spikes looks disinterested & in a funk

Why did they draft Collins then?

To replace Ninkovich as the DE/OLB since he is entering free agency as well.

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: Spikes looks disinterested & in a funk

This would be my question on the discussion too.

Hightower will almost certainly get the MLB role in my opinion, as he would still be the weakest in coverage by far with Collins and Mayo in there too. His run stuffing wouldn't be quite as good as Spikes, but he's the player who would most mirror the abilities and weaknesses of Spikes in my opinion.

Collins was drafted as a contingency plan for Spikes' departure, and the hope of course is that he can use his athleticism to progress into a good cover LB. Mayo is definitely much better than Hightower in that aspect too. Hightower, while better than Spikes--is still the weakest link out of the 3 should Spikes end up leaving.

I see Collins as a contingency plan for Ninkovich, I think a player like Beauharnais would be more likely to be replacing Spikes in a role as a run stuffing early down MLB.

 

[BritPat]

18 months ago I couldn't have imagined this defense without Spikes, he'd become vital to it. Now, I don't see how he stays beyond the end of the season.

We have a really good set of LB's that are versatile and can play both run and pass - with that in mind Spikes' skillset, though elite, is outdated in today's NFL.

Mayo is one of the best LB's in the league, Hightower embodies all the qualities of the modern NFL defender, Ninkovich is one of the most under-rated players in the league and one of the most versatile, Fletcher is a solid backup and key ST's player, whilst Collin's abilities again seem to be in rushing the passer/coverage. That's without mentioning Beauharnais and White who are in their first year with us.

Like others I see Hightower eventually making the transition to MLB if we stay with the 4-3, but I'm not sure that happens. Over the next year or two there are a lot of kids coming out of College who have played or have the skillset to play in the 3-4.

Not to buff my own ego, but 18 months before it happened I suggested that we were looking to move to the 4-3 as it was becoming difficult to find players capable of playing in the 3-4. When we drafted Tyrone McKenzie and brought in Nink I was absolutely certain we were trying to find a WLB/Coverage LB and an athletic SLB/speed End. The signing of Derrick Burgess (*shudder*) confirmed it. Yet we stuck with the 3-4 when the personnel didn't match.

Looking at this current crop, I see four players capable of playing OLB in the 3-4 - Jones is BB's perfect body-type, Ninkovich is proven at the position, Hightower is Vrabel-esque and is sorely under-rated rushing the passer, and the real X-Factor is Collins, who if he were in Pittsburgh would be the heir-apparent to James Harrison. And I think that's what we might be looking at - an aggressive, super-athletic 3-4.

With that in mind, I'd let Spikes walk, go DE/DE in rounds 1 and 2 (Hageman/Hart) or DE/DT (Hageman/Ferguson), and then watch us go. If you want a replacement for Spikes, Shayne Skov is your guy. In fact there's about 5 players on that Stanford D I'd take.