Pats Interested In Mike Wallace (per Miami Herald's Armando Salguero)

[manxman2601]

I'm going to sound like a stuck record here, but why sign Mike Wallace at$12m per when you can draft a "Mike Wallace clone" in Markus Wheaton.

@jon__anderson Markus Wheaton is a Mike Wallace clone. Robert Woods under rated. Not a fan of Justin Hunter. Do like Steadman Bailey.

https://twitter.com/robstaton/status/302239379278155776

and:

“Speed, speed, speed,” Scout Inc.’s Kevin Weidl said of Wheaton’s game. “He’s a guy that can stretch the field vertically or can create after the catch.”
Wiedl said that Wheaton reminds him of current Pittsburgh Steelers wide receiver Mike Wallace, who established himself as one of the NFL’s top deep threats just a season ago.

Oregon State WR Markus Wheaton Drawing Comparisons To Mike Wallace - FanSided - Sports News - An Independent Sports Network

This was the immense speed that Wheaton showed so often, posing a plethora of problems for defensive coordinators and leading to comparisons to Mike Wallace. Although he is viewed in the same light as Wallace, he possesses better hands than Wallace does. He’s a natural pass catcher, keeping the football away from his body by extending his arms, opposed to trapping the football with his upper body when it comes in. He also shows good concentration and extension when hauling in the football over his shoulder.

The Making Of Markus - Evaluations - Rotoworld.com

etc etc. Google Markus Wheaton, Mike Wallace and the engine lights up with comparisons. And often you'll find him compared favourably to Wallace. $12m a year or a 2nd round pick? I know which I think is the better value.

 

[Kontradiction]

A Mike Wallace type is not what this offense needs. Nor do I believe he'd thrive in a complicated offense like this one. I have to believe the Pats are "expressing interest" in order to drive the price up for the Dolphins.

 

[JoeSixPat]

I'm going to sound like a stuck record here, but why sign Mike Wallace at$12m per when you can draft a "Mike Wallace clone" in Markus Wheaton.

By clone you mean "identical except he has never played a down in the NFL"?

There's a ton of "clones" of every player in the NFL in the draft. Most don't pan out.

If you want a proven NFL commodity, you typically have to get it in free agency or via trade - and that typically costs a lot of money.

 

[manxman2601]

By clone you mean "identical except he has never played a down in the NFL"?

There's a ton of "clones" of every player in the NFL in the draft. Most don't pan out.

If you want a proven NFL commodity, you typically have to get it in free agency or via trade - and that typically costs a lot of money.

Seriously? Do you not think that's taken as read? Clearly I'm talking about skillsets and athletic abilities.

 

[kudzif]

I agree. I don't get this infatuation with a deep threat. The argument is that this offense stall when they get into the playoffs with a very good defense, but do people forget when the Pats had a deep threat in Moss this offense stalled too?

Wallace seems to be an one trick pony. He is perfect for the Steelers where a big armed Roethlisberger can run around in the backfield until Wallace gets open back field because he is mobile and so hard to bring down. The Steelers play a lot of school yard football.

In the Pats' offense, he will be required to run routes and make presnap adjustments. It is unknown if he can do it. He hasn't shown the ability to be a good route runner thus far.

The offense in 2007 stalled in the superbowl because the o line completely disintergrated and remember that team had no running game. If we combine our running game, Gronk and Hernandez with a big play component(eg Wallace) our offense will be built to succeed in the playoffs. The Wes offense is fools gold.

 

[ausbacker]

The offense in 2007 stalled in the superbowl because the o line completely disintergrated and remember that team had no running game. If we combine our running game, Gronk and Hernandez with a big play component(eg Wallace) our offense will be built to succeed in the playoffs. The Wes offense is fools gold.

Codswallop. Welker is being unfairly maligned for the faults of others.

 

[Brady2Moss]

Herp derp, I wonder why that's the case.

Pretty funny that you're pointing out how good of shape the Pats are in in the same post where you're trashing on the philosophy that got them into such a good position in the first place.

Good news, though! Your philosophy on team-building has been enacted several times in the recent NFL past, so we don't have to engage in a purely theoretical debate here. Just go and check out how the Eagles, Redskins, Jets and Bears have been doing lately.

You're a moron, they're in good shape because of the fact that Brady restructured his deal not because of Bill's bargain shopping that has resulted in tons of dead cap the last few years. Good news we'll go 12-4 and lose in the AFCCG again or earlier if Brady begins to decline and not play like Super Man in the regular season!

 

[supafly]

Codswallop. Welker is being unfairly maligned for the faults of others.

Absolutely, no doubt. Welker is still what makes this offense tick.

And I'm stealing the word "codswallop" by the way

 

[Brady2Moss]

Incarcerated Bob is rarely right Did you just start following football this season, or do you just choose to ignore his track record when it suits you?

You caught me I just started watching football and am clueless. Bob's been right plenty of times.

 

[Brady2Moss]

That's an indictment on you if you believe the Patriots have been doing the same thing every year. I don't recall a tight end centric or hurry up offense of this magnitude before the Patriots acquired the players to do so.

Oh wait the tight ends operate in the middle of the field like every other weapon on this team... Oh wait a hurry up offense is useless if you hurry up to punt because you can't keep converting 3rd downs or stall in the red zone multiple times.

I don't care about Wallace if he's going to make 12-15 million, but he's worth offering money to instead of just going for bargains and hoping they give you 1 year of elite play only to cut them in July.

 

[kudzif]

Show me the Lombardis since 04. Enjoy the Kool Aid.

I agree with you Brady2Moss. Many fans think we are still like the superbowl patriots that could not be questioned.The fact that we are approaching a decade since we last won a superbowl is simply bypassed by many fans :business as usual (ie Wes offense) is not going to win a Lombardy trophy.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Seriously? Do you not think that's taken as read? Clearly I'm talking about skillsets and athletic abilities.

Well, when someone asks "why" someone would opt for a proven veteran over one of hundreds of annual rookies, all with skillsets and athletic abilities who fail to make it in the NFL, I'd say it is not taken as read, wouldn't you?

 

[Deus Irae]

Lmao you don't even read my posts you just try to degrade my intelligence. First of all Welker isn't the problem if you live in a vacuum like you seem to do. The problem is paying him 10 million a year to keep doing what he does which is make our offense easy to stop in the playoffs. Welker can go on catching 70 yards a game in the playoffs with minimal touchdowns and make it harder for us to score in chunks since he can't do crap beyond 10 yards. If you paid 10 million dollars to an outside threat or even a slot guy that can break a 10 yard route into a long touchdown like Cruz the offense is way better suited to win.

This is another example of what I meant regarding your posts. Rather than waste too much time following this up, since you've illustrated my point perfectly, let me just note a couple of quick, obvious items:

1.) I've been on this team about the WR position since before you even joined the board (going back to the beginning of the Aiken era and before), and I've been talking about the middle deep threat since the moment Moss was traded away, so you're barking up the wrong tree with that nonsense.

2.) While Welker was helping his team get to the AFCCG for the 3rd time in 4 healthy playoff runs, Victor Cruz was at home watching the playoffs. Perhaps "better suited to win" means something different from what you think it does.

3.) The money number is meaningless. Whether Welker is paid $10 million, $8 million or $6 million, he's still going to be a better deal than any other WR currently on the market this year or on it at any time since the season ended, and that includes Bowe who's no longer available. And Cruz, a lesser player, is also a RFA, not a UFA.

4.) The notion of a scoring problem is moronic, given that Welker's been part of 2 of the NFL's 3 highest scoring offenses. Welker has a role, and he fills that role better than anyone in the history of the game has ever done. The offensive problems in the playoffs have mostly been a failure at the other offensive spots, including QB. Welker had 131 and 117 yards receiving in the two 2011 playoff games, and he scored the team's only TD in the loss. He also had 11 catches for 102 yards in the 2007 SB. You seem unable to grasp that part of the equation.



The rest of your post was just more of the same type of stuff.

 

[Brady2Moss]

I agree with you Brady2Moss. Many fans think we are still like the superbowl patriots that could not be questioned.The fact that we are approaching a decade since we last won a superbowl is simply bypassed by many fans :business as usual (ie Wes offense) is not going to win a Lombardy trophy.

You should align yourself with the smarter posters on this board that believe we shouldn't spend money on receivers and corners, despite the fact we can't draft them for crap.

Here's a sad truth guys if you can't draft a certain position you have to pay the piper in free agency to get better or continue rolling out scrubs and burning multiple draft picks on that position. Or you can bring in a band of scrubs every year and cut them all. Remember that AMAZING receiver depth we had last off season oh ya they all got cut or went on IR and we were left with Lloyd and Welker and no one to attack the outside again.

 

[supafly]

You're a moron, they're in good shape because of the fact that Brady restructured his deal not because of Bill's bargain shopping that has resulted in tons of dead cap the last few years. Good news we'll go 12-4 and lose in the AFCCG again or earlier if Brady begins to decline and not play like Super Man in the regular season!

They're in "good shape" because of the methodical moves and patterns that Belichick and Kraft have followed over the years, not because of one deal that was extended. That's ridiculous.

The dead cap hits of the past couple years were actually a tendency to step away from those patterns and take some risks, which could/could not have paid off. Fortuntately for us, they were in such good shape that those deap cap hits didn't even come that close to hampering them in neither a current nor future stance.

 

[JoeSixPat]

They didn't. They gave him the lowest tender, only gives them the right to match any offer.

Danario Alexander - San Diego Chargers - 2013 Player Profile - Rotoworld.com

He's a beast. The obvious question is how long will his knee last. The Bolts will likely match a 1 year offer and he will unlikely get more that that duration.

Yeah, I'd take a flyer on him too. A multi-year non-guaranteed offer could do the trick, low risk high reward... Though I have to think other teams might do the same.

Still, this guy would really benefit from a stable team situation.

 

[Brady2Moss]

This is another example of what I meant regarding your posts. Rather than waste too much time following this up, since you've illustrated my point perfectly, let me just note a couple of quick, obvious items:

1.) I've been on this team about the WR position since before you even joined the board, and I've been talking about the middle deep threat since the moment Moss was traded away, so you're barking up the wrong tree with that nonsense.

2.) While Welker was helping his team get to the AFCCG for the 3rd time in 4 healthy playoff runs, Victor Cruz was at home watching the playoffs. Perhaps "better suited to win" means something different from what you think it does.

3.) The money number is meaningless. Whether Welker is paid $10 million, $8 million or $6 million, he's still going to be a better deal than any other currently on the market this year or on it at any time since the season ended, and that includes Bowe who's no longer available.

4.) The notion of a scoring problem is moronic, given that Welker's been part of 2 of the NFL's 3 highest scoring offenses. Welker has a role, and he fills that role better than anyone in the history of the game has ever done. The problems in the playoffs have mostly been a failure at the other offensive spots, including QB. You seem unable to grasp that part of the equation.

The rest of your post was just more of the same type of stuff.

Again all you do is act like you have some amazing point that I can't think, saying it 100 times doesn't make it true. Cruz isn't responsible for Eli Manning sucking it up this year again you live in a vacuum time to get out and consider the other things going on.

You're point about the highest scoring offenses makes me literally laugh out loud because all of those offenses were flaming turds when they faced a good defense. Not held down by a touchdown from their normal average, usually they scored half of their AMAZING HIGHEST SCORING OFFENSE OUTPUT!

It is the biggest joke to say the regular season production means everything is ok when the playoff results have shown that their offensive performance in the regular season doesn't happen in the playoffs.

 

[Sciz]

Bob's been right plenty of times.

If I made as many guesses as he did, I would be too.

 

[ausbacker]

Absolutely, no doubt. Welker is still what makes this offense tick.

And I'm stealing the word "codswallop" by the way

Be my guest supa. It's not like I haven't lifted some of your opinions anyway.

Oh wait the tight ends operate in the middle of the field like every other weapon on this team... Oh wait a hurry up offense is useless if you hurry up to punt because you can't keep converting 3rd downs or stall in the red zone multiple times.

I don't care about Wallace if he's going to make 12-15 million, but he's worth offering money to instead of just going for bargains and hoping they give you 1 year of elite play only to cut them in July.

You're going to have to explain to me why it's Wes Welker's fault that he excels in a position that the Patriots like to throw at? How is it Welker's fault that the Patriots like to attempt so called high percentage throws across the middle? I'd like an outside receiving threat. I really don't care how that player is acquired, but I sure as hell am not going to blame Wes Welker for the faults of others.

 

[Brady2Moss]

They're in "good shape" because of the methodical moves and patterns that Belichick and Kraft have followed over the years, not because of one deal that was extended. That's ridiculous.

The dead cap hits of the past couple years were actually a tendency to step away from those patterns and take some risks, which could/could not have paid off. Fortuntately for us, they were in such good shape that those deap cap hits didn't even come that close to hampering them in neither a current nor future stance.

That's fine they manage the cap well, but it hasn't worked the last 8 years to bring them another championship, Brady's time is ending time to go all out and get a stacked team for his last few years. They come close every year, but decidedly every year they don't finish the job. There's a reason for that beyond luck.