Who streched the field in 03 and 04?

[The Brandon Five]

He showed up on Monday, you need to watch the game without your anti-Moss bias. Even Curran claims that he ran all out on every last play. Mike Nolan limited him to 1 catch in Denver last year as well. You can take away ANY one player if you want (except QB really).

There was one play when he definitely did not run all-out. I think it was a screen. He barely tried to sell the route he ran and stopped to block too soon (giving away the play). Then, he completely muffed the block. The play got blown up in the backfield.

 

[Synovia]

Revis. Monday, they showed a play where Vontae Davis was about 20-30 yards back and Moss just zoomed past him, even though the ball was never thrown to him. His speed is there, for you to suggest otherwise indicates you haven't paid attention to it..

Part of the reason Moss was targeted so infrequently that game is that targeting him has been downright dangerous for most of the season.

He's had 22 balls thrown to him. He's caught 9, 2 have been picked off. Thats just not good at all, especially when everyone else on the team is catching the ball at a 75% plus rate.

 

[JoeShmoe]

Why this assumption that Tate cant 'stretch the field'?

The kid is blazing fast, you send on him a deep out, he takes a defender or two with him. If he's going deep with single coverage then once or twice you take your chances

I'll lay money Brady hits Tate with a deep ball in the next two games

 

[atomdomb]

They had a better defense that year, and better coaches.

He asked who stretched the field clearly meaning offensive players and you answered defense and coaches. Poignant.

 

[emoney_33]

There was one play when he definitely did not run all-out. I think it was a screen. He barely tried to sell the route he ran and stopped to block too soon (giving away the play). Then, he completely muffed the block. The play got blown up in the backfield.

He's never been accused of being a great blocker, were you expecting that to change?

 

[The Brandon Five]

He's never been accused of being a great blocker, were you expecting that to change?

Just saying that he definitely wasn't hustling on that one.

 

[emoney_33]

Part of the reason Moss was targeted so infrequently that game is that targeting him has been downright dangerous for most of the season.

He's had 22 balls thrown to him. He's caught 9, 2 have been picked off. Thats just not good at all, especially when everyone else on the team is catching the ball at a 75% plus rate.

I suppose we can ignore context. The first INT was a bad decision, bad throw or misread by one or both of them. Whatever that happens with everyone including Welker. The 2nd INT was a horrendous throw that Moss came very close to freakishly bailing Brady out on. The drops have definitely been worrying but benefit of the doubt comes into play when you look at his career of sure handedness.

Part of the reason Moss has been targetted so infrequently is because, IMO BB has decided to put more value on long drives and unpredictability than quick strikes, at the very least for 2010. Moss was a good soldier ON THE FIELD, but apparently his emotions got the best of him OFF THE FIELD. Combining the shift in strategy, Moss' understandable worry about his future, and a whole host of other factors I'm sure led to the trade. People are too quick to simplify things IMO.

 

[FCB02062]

In 2003 it was Christian Fauria's world, everyone else was just living in it and in 2004 they had someone named Jed Weaver who put the fear of eternal damnation into opposing defenses....how soon we forget....

 

[Synovia]

I suppose we can ignore context. The first INT was a bad decision, bad throw or misread by one or both of them. Whatever that happens with everyone including Welker. The 2nd INT was a horrendous throw that Moss came very close to freakishly bailing Brady out on. The drops have definitely been worrying but benefit of the doubt comes into play when you look at his career of sure handedness.

The context doesn't matter. Whether the issue is Moss or Brady doesn't matter. What matters is that those long throws to Moss no longer seem to be viable. It doesn't matter whether or not the issue is that Brady isn't accurate enough, or that Moss isn't going up as high as he used to or whatever.

The results are just too risky, and if you can't throw to Moss deep, hes not the threat he once was.

As to it happening to everyone, Everyone on the team is catching 75+% of the balls thrown to them. Moss was catching 41%. So it seems to be affecting no one nearly as much as Moss.

 

[DaBruinz]

They had a better defense that year, and better coaches.

A better defense has nothing to do with who stretched the field back in 2003 and 2004.

Thank u very much.They had better coaches.

They had better coordinators then, I agree. But that still has nothing to do with who stretched the field.

The MVP of Super Bowl XXXIX.

Branch shouldn't have been the MVP of SB 39. It should have gone to either Brady or Harrison. Most intelligent fans said as much when it was announced.

Deion Branch was a significantly more credible deep threat than anyone the Pats have right now. They also had Charlie Weis behind the curtain, which is a not-insignificant matter. That doesn't even mention the difference in defenses.

Why was Branch a "more credible deep threat"? Because you say so? Or because the Pats had to leave RANDY in that position and not use other people because of Randy's ego? Tate and Hernandez both have shown they have the speed to run the intermediate routes (11-20 yards). People seem to forget that Branch and Givens got a lot of their yardage after the catch, ala Wes.

The defense doesn't have a damn thing to do with the players on offense being able to run deep routes. It's absolute foolishness for people to even bring it up. It's pure spin on your part.

It's funny to hear Deion Branch called a "deep threat" by people, especially when he was never anything of the sort during his tenure with the Pats.

 

[emoney_33]

Or because the Pats had to leave RANDY in that position and not use other people because of Randy's ego?

Some of you are absolutely delusional! Did you really just accuse BB of putting Moss as a deep threat to appease Randy's ego? As opposed to I dunno him being the best deep threat to ever play the game.

GET A CLUE

 

[emoney_33]

The context doesn't matter. Whether the issue is Moss or Brady doesn't matter. What matters is that those long throws to Moss no longer seem to be viable. It doesn't matter whether or not the issue is that Brady isn't accurate enough, or that Moss isn't going up as high as he used to or whatever.

Of course context matters, what the hell? "no longer viable", are you serious? You are usually good with your logic so I don't know what to make of this but welcome to tiny sample sizes :/. Seriously, Brady made 1 terrible throw and 1 questionable decision in 1 game and all of a sudden Moss is not a viable option anymore. What the hell....

long drives > quick strikes when trying to teach a defense on the sidelines. A defense whose growth will determine how far this team goes in 2010.

The results are just too risky, and if you can't throw to Moss deep, hes not the threat he once was.

As to it happening to everyone, Everyone on the team is catching 75+% of the balls thrown to them. Moss was catching 41%. So it seems to be affecting no one nearly as much as Moss.

So in 3 games it was 7/12 and in 1 game it was 2/10. I know you aren't intentionally misrepresenting the numbers right?

 

[Simkin]

A better defense has nothing to do with who stretched the field back in 2003 and 2004.



They had better coordinators then, I agree. But that still has nothing to do with who stretched the field.



Branch shouldn't have been the MVP of SB 39. It should have gone to either Brady or Harrison. Most intelligent fans said as much when it was announced.



Why was Branch a "more credible deep threat"? Because you say so? Or because the Pats had to leave RANDY in that position and not use other people because of Randy's ego? Tate and Hernandez both have shown they have the speed to run the intermediate routes (11-20 yards). People seem to forget that Branch and Givens got a lot of their yardage after the catch, ala Wes.

The defense doesn't have a damn thing to do with the players on offense being able to run deep routes. It's absolute foolishness for people to even bring it up. It's pure spin on your part.

It's funny to hear Deion Branch called a "deep threat" by people, especially when he was never anything of the sort during his tenure with the Pats.

Its even more laughable call Brandon Tate a deep Threat when he avg 12 ypc and his long catch was 29 yards

 

[DaBruinz]

Some of you are absolutely delusional! Did you really just accuse BB of putting Moss as a deep threat to appease Randy's ego? As opposed to I dunno him being the best deep threat to ever play the game.

GET A CLUE

That's funny coming from someone who clearly didn't understand what was said.

I said: "Or because the Pats had to leave RANDY in that position and not use other people because of Randy's ego? "

That means they didn't use other people there to appease Randy. And just because Randy's entire career makes him the best deep threat to ever play doesn't mean that Randy is the best deep threat playing today.

You seriously need to get off your knees in regards to Randy Moss.

 

[emoney_33]

That's funny coming from someone who clearly didn't understand what was said.

I said: "Or because the Pats had to leave RANDY in that position and not use other people because of Randy's ego? "

That means they didn't use other people there to appease Randy. And just because Randy's entire career makes him the best deep threat to ever play doesn't mean that Randy is the best deep threat playing today.

You seriously need to get off your knees in regards to Randy Moss.

So repeat what you said which is exactly what I accused you of saying and then tell me to get off my knees.

It's pretty disrespectful and entirely against everything BB stands for to accuse him of NOT doing what is best for the team to appease any one single player. It's obviously not the case but for some reason some people hate Moss so much that they just create fictional stories in their mind.

I guess when Moss is catching TDs in Minnesota the excuse will be "oh he's trying again all of a sudden, yea that's it".

 

[DaBruinz]

Its even more laughable call Brandon Tate a deep Threat when he avg 12 ypc and his long catch was 29 yards

Another person who can't read. I said that Tate has the speed to run the intermediate routes (11-20) yards.

Also, since Tate was 3rd behind Moss and Welker, He's not run many (if any) GO, Post or Flag routes.

Why do people like yourself insist on purposely mis-representing others? All it does is show your own ignorance.

 

[DaBruinz]

So repeat what you said which is exactly what I accused you of saying and then tell me to get off my knees.

First off, your comprehension is pitiful because what I said is NOT what you claimed I said.

It's pretty disrespectful and entirely against everything BB stands for to accuse him of NOT doing what is best for the team to appease any one single player. It's obviously not the case but for some reason some people hate Moss so much that they just create fictional stories in their mind.

I didn't accuse BB of not doing what was best for the team. People like yourself are the ones doing that by complaining about this trade and acting like Moss guaranteed this team anything.

There is no fictional story in my mind. I am going by the truth. Moss has always had an ego. I don't hate Randy and nothing in what I posted said otherwise. That is you making sh!t up. Plain and simple.

I guess when Moss is catching TDs in Minnesota the excuse will be "oh he's trying again all of a sudden, yea that's it".

It's amazing how people like you who have this insane love for players insist that others are haters just because someone doesn't hold Moss as God's Gift to a football team.

I've never said I hated Moss nor implied such.
I've said that there are others on this team who can run the intermediate routes (11-20 yards).
There are plenty of other weapons on this team.

Like I said, get off your knees from in front of Randy and realize that he's gone and there is not a damn thing you can do about it.

 

[The Brandon Five]

Branch shouldn't have been the MVP of SB 39. It should have gone to either Brady or Harrison. Most intelligent fans said as much when it was announced.

Proof positive that he couldn't stretch the field!

Any idea where the picture I posted came from?

Why was Branch a "more credible deep threat"? Because you say so? Or because the Pats had to leave RANDY in that position and not use other people because of Randy's ego? Tate and Hernandez both have shown they have the speed to run the intermediate routes (11-20 yards). People seem to forget that Branch and Givens got a lot of their yardage after the catch, ala Wes.

Wes Patriot Career YAC numbers: 5.7, 6.8, 5.9, 5.4
Wes Patriot Career Y/Rec.: 10.5, 10.5, 11.0, 8.3

Branch Patriot YAC numbers: 4.4, 4.4, 4.1, 3.1
Branch Patriot Y/Rec: 11.4, 14.1, 13.0, 12.8

Wes gets significantly more yards after the catch than Branch while gaining fewer yards per reception. But sure, they are the same kind of receiver.

Are these the kind of facts that you are lecturing the rest of us to familiarize ourselves with?

 

[ALP]

Proof positive that he couldn't stretch the field!

Any idea where the picture I posted came from?



Wes Patriot Career YAC numbers: 5.7, 6.8, 5.9, 5.4
Wes Patriot Career Y/Rec.: 10.5, 10.5, 11.0, 8.3

Branch Patriot YAC numbers: 4.4, 4.4, 4.1, 3.1
Branch Patriot Y/Rec: 11.4, 14.1, 13.0, 12.8

Wes gets significantly more yards after the catch than Branch while gaining fewer yards per reception. But sure, they are the same kind of receiver.

Are these the kind of facts that you are lecturing the rest of us to familiarize ourselves with?

great, now compare moss to those two, and im 95% sure branch and wes will look a heck of a lot more like each other than branch will look like moss

 

[emoney_33]

I didn't accuse BB of not doing what was best for the team. People like yourself are the ones doing that by complaining about this trade and acting like Moss guaranteed this team anything.

I am not complaining about the trade.

There is no fictional story in my mind. I am going by the truth. Moss has always had an ego. I don't hate Randy and nothing in what I posted said otherwise. That is you making sh!t up. Plain and simple.

Right, you know the truth.

It's amazing how people like you who have this insane love for players insist that others are haters just because someone doesn't hold Moss as God's Gift to a football team.

I don't have any 'love' for any entertainer or person I do not know on a personal level.

I've never said I hated Moss nor implied such.
I've said that there are others on this team who can run the intermediate routes (11-20 yards).
There are plenty of other weapons on this team.

And others have BEEN running intermediate routes for the 4 games Randy was here. Maybe I still misunderstand your point, but it seemed to me that you claimed that BB was not allowing others to run deep routes because it would hurt Moss' ego.

Like I said, get off your knees from in front of Randy and realize that he's gone and there is not a damn thing you can do about it.

Get off your knees in front of BB and stop thinking that every single thing he does is this amazing move that you should worship and that every player he doesn't sign is the devil. I repeat, I do NOT mind the move and trust BB had enough information that this trade is at the bare minimum "understandable" if not "correct". It's the lunatics who think Moss was detrimental to the team on the field that get to me.