What is Joe Milton worth?

[Lansdowne]

Should the patriots have considered an open competition in TC as a way to get Maye to earn the starting job.
Just asking not advocating for the idea

I guess it depends on whether you believe Maye hasn’t already shown enough to earn his spot as the current starting QB, or if you believe Milton, who has never been higher than 3rd on the depth chart and was a gameday inactive for all but one game, has shown enough to bypass a veteran like Dobbs and go straight to challenging Maye for his job.

 

[SammyBlueCat]

What a thread!

 

[n1997y]

I guess it depends on whether you believe Maye hasn’t already shown enough to earn his spot as the current starting QB, or if you believe Milton, who has never been higher than 3rd on the depth chart and was a gameday inactive for all but one game, has shown enough to bypass a veteran like Dobbs and go straight to challenging Maye for his job.

Every player needs to earn their job every day.

If Maye earned the job last year then coasted over the offseason and this year came in fat and lazy he should lose the job. If he worked hard and came in sharp but somebody else came in sharper he should lose the job.

You wouldn’t cut a WR slack if he had a subpar season last year after earning his job before getting hurt the year before. Why is QB exempt from having to earn his keep every day?

Doesn’t matter if it’s Dobbs or Milton, if Maye isn’t the best QB on the roster he shouldn’t be the starter. Bledsoe learned that lesson, and look where it took us.

 

[n1997y]

Should the patriots have considered an open competition in TC as a way to get Maye to earn the starting job.
Just asking not advocating for the idea

Only if they were sure Maye would clearly win it. Or if they were committed to respecting the outcome even if he did not.

Sounds like Milton’s agent pushed them for it, so they had to consider it even if their consideration ended with a bus ticket for Milton.

That doesn’t invalidate or conflict with my opinion in the first paragraph…

 

[Lansdowne]

Every player needs to earn their job every day.

If Maye earned the job last year then coasted over the offseason and this year came in fat and lazy he should lose the job. If he worked hard and came in sharp but somebody else came in sharper he should lose the job.

You wouldn’t cut a WR slack if he had a subpar season last year after earning his job before getting hurt the year before. Why is QB exempt from having to earn his keep every day?

Doesn’t matter if it’s Dobbs or Milton, if Maye isn’t the best QB on the roster he shouldn’t be the starter. Bledsoe learned that lesson, and look where it took us.

I don’t necessarily disagree with your points: every player should take their job seriously and practice and prepare as if their roster spot is on the line, because it is.

With that being said, what you’ve presented is an oversimplification of how things work in the NFL, and is not based in reality. Patrick Mahomes is not going to get benched if Gardner Minshew or Bailey Zappe look better than him in training camp. For a closer comparison to Maye, at the Commanders’ Jayden Daniels. If he comes into training camp flat, and Sam Hartman looks sharper than him (as unlikely as that is), Daniels is not losing his starting job to Hartman going into Week 1. Quarterback is the most important position in football and arguably the most difficult in professional sports to master. It requires a lot of patience and development. They’ve waited a long time to get a QB as good as Daniels so they’re not going to mess with his development by putting him on thin ice. But Daniels is also highly unlikely to slack off and compromise his spot.

If Daniels looks bad to begin the season he will be given a chance to correct it because the team has invested a lot in him. If he plays poorly for most of the season then the team may bench him for whoever the backup is unless the season is already lost at that point.

Regarding Bledsoe, he was replaced due to injury, and Brady’s performance subbing in for him was so good that he was undeniable. The difference is Brady earned his place on the depth chart as the next in line, beating out the veteran Damon Huard, a guy who had previous starting experience. And when Brady’s turn came he made the most of it.

Maye earned and kept his starting job at UNC as a sophomore. He earned his status as a top NFL prospect and got drafted 3rd overall in an impressive draft class. He earned his spot as the starter by outplaying everyone, including Milton, in training camp last year. Mayo himself admitted Maye looked the best, but he still sat for Brissett to begin the year only because of the state of the offensive line. Meanwhile Milton wasn’t good enough to beat out Brissett (or Maye) for the backup role all season. Brady couldn’t get the backup role his rookie season either, but you know what he did? He battled for it the next offseason. He didn’t ask to challenge Bledsoe for his job, he was too busy focusing on earning his roster spot and challenging Huard for the backup role. Work hard enough and everything will take care of itself.

The reality of it is the 3rd overall pick is going to get more opportunity to provide return on investment than the guy that was taken 190 picks after him. Maye is the made man and he’s going to get multiple years to prove himself as the long term guy. Milton was never getting that opportunity here with Maye around. Maybe he’ll have that opportunity now with a much older Dak Prescott in Dallas.

But again, did Maye not show enough last year to confidently declare him the Patriots starter going forward, and did Milton show enough last year to feel confidently in starting him over Maye? I believe Maye proved his case much, much more than Milton, but YMMV.

 

[n1997y]

I don’t necessarily disagree with your points: every player should take their job seriously and practice and prepare as if their roster spot is on the line, because it is.

With that being said, what you’ve presented is an oversimplification of how things work in the NFL, and is not based in reality. Patrick Mahomes is not going to get benched if Gardner Minshew or Bailey Zappe look better than him in training camp. For a closer comparison to Maye, at the Commanders’ Jayden Daniels. If he comes into training camp flat, and Sam Hartman looks sharper than him (as unlikely as that is), Daniels is not losing his starting job to Hartman going into Week 1. Quarterback is the most important position in football and arguably the most difficult in professional sports to master. It requires a lot of patience and development. They’ve waited a long time to get a QB as good as Daniels so they’re not going to mess with his development by putting him on thin ice. But Daniels is also highly unlikely to slack off and compromise his spot.

If Daniels looks bad to begin the season he will be given a chance to correct it because the team has invested a lot in him. If he plays poorly for most of the season then the team may bench him for whoever the backup is unless the season is already lost at that point.

Regarding Bledsoe, he was replaced due to injury, and Brady’s performance subbing in for him was so good that he was undeniable. The difference is Brady earned his place on the depth chart as the next in line, beating out the veteran Damon Huard, a guy who had previous starting experience. And when Brady’s turn came he made the most of it.

Maye earned and kept his starting job at UNC as a sophomore. He earned his status as a top NFL prospect and got drafted 3rd overall in an impressive draft class. He earned his spot as the starter by outplaying everyone, including Milton, in training camp last year. Mayo himself admitted Maye looked the best, but he still sat for Brissett to begin the year only because of the state of the offensive line. Meanwhile Milton wasn’t good enough to beat out Brissett (or Maye) for the backup role all season. Brady couldn’t get the backup role his rookie season either, but you know what he did? He battled for it the next offseason. He didn’t ask to challenge Bledsoe for his job, he was too busy focusing on earning his roster spot and challenging Huard for the backup role. Work hard enough and everything will take care of itself.

The reality of it is the 3rd overall pick is going to get more opportunity to provide return on investment than the guy that was taken 190 picks after him. Maye is the made man and he’s going to get multiple years to prove himself as the long term guy. Milton was never getting that opportunity here with Maye around. Maybe he’ll have that opportunity now with a much older Dak Prescott in Dallas.

But again, did Maye not show enough last year to confidently declare him the Patriots starter going forward, and did Milton show enough last year to feel confidently in starting him over Maye? I believe Maye proved his case much, much more than Milton, but YMMV.

Thanks for the long and thoughtful reply. I know there’s a lot of nuance not easily captured in internet chats, like the flexibility and opportunity to fix performance problems that is earned by previous performance, for example.

I can see, in fact I agree with, Vrabel’s disinclination to open the can of worms a QB competition would cause. I can also see Milton feeling Maye hasn’t entrenched himself beyond such a challenge.

And that brings me to my answer to your final question. I don’t think Milton showed enough to confidently start him over Maye AT THIS POINT IN TIME. Not sure how that would look after an open competition in camp. Because I’m borderline on whether Maye showed enough to confidently declare him starter going forward. He showed two serious flaws: INTs and not sliding when he should.

I think he showed enough to get the chance to fix those. But I’d like to have an understudy waiting in the wings, who is a prospective starter not just a fill in. Dobbs is the latter. Milton would be the former. But the dynamics make it untenable to keep him.

 

[farn]

This is a funny thread.

 

[Sorrynotsorry]

Prescott will get hurt. Milton will start.

Time will tell.

 

[TinhWoodhead]

i plead the 5th

 

[Triumph]

Prescott will get hurt. Milton will start.

Time will tell.

With a better OL and WRs in Dallas.

Plus, Milton is fleet of foot himself and that type of QB excels today. I wish we had seen more of Milton in live action to get a better sense of his potential.

 

[sb1]

He showed two serious flaws: INTs and not sliding when he should.

Not too worried about ints, rookies are gonna rookie. Strip sacks and head injuries are my primary concerns about Maye. Hopefully some much better coaching will fix the former and we'll see about the latter. I don't want him to be Tua'ed or Luck'ed out of the league.