The Official B!tch about the secondary/pass coverage thread

[ATippett56]

However i would like to point out that The Patriots secondary once consisted of the likes of Ja'Rod Cherry, Otis Smith, Randall Gay, Tyrone Poole, Hank Poteat, Troy Brown etc and were highly successful. I dont think its talent, it's coaching/scheme.

Unfortunately, you failed to mention the New England Patriots starting safeties during the 2003-2004 NFL Seasons were Rodney Harrison and Eugene Wilson.

 

[Deus Irae]

No, the point is why should I look to collect information for you that you were unable to absorb the first time.

And since you haven't completed your assignment, I'll have to give you a zero. Your punishment will be not to post for five seconds.

I'm fully capable of absorbing information. You've just not supplied it. The failure to supply it began with your first post in the thread:

When there is no penalty for failure, failure proliferates.

Fire Josh Boyer.

And has continued in that vein ever since:

New England Patriots Forums - PatsFans.com Patriots Fan Messageboard

Not a single one of those (currently 18) posts has any concrete evidence or evidence-based reasoning for what you're seeking.

 

[QB12]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

This was brought this up on the radio as well. The guys on WEEI and The hub think that these DB coaches are actually making these players worse. They brought up Mccourty and Chung and how they were better in their rookie season than they are now. Is is something to think about.

So true. Sad but true.

 

[KoolAid]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

WOW! That really is a very unimpressive list of football programs that this Joker has been involved with. Is he really the best that BB can get here??? I know nothing about the guy, but the secondary seems to be going backwards, which I didn't think was even possible.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

This thread should be merged with the secondary thread.

 

[aluminum seats]

I'm fully capable of absorbing information. You've just not supplied it. The failure to supply it began with your first post in the thread:



And has continued in that vein ever since:

New England Patriots Forums - PatsFans.com Patriots Fan Messageboard

Not a single one of those (currently 18) posts has any concrete evidence or evidence-based reasoning for what you're seeking.

Again, we wait for you to complete your assignment. It's becoming increasingly clear that you simply don't have any reasoning behind your (currently 18,000) posts on the subject.

 

[aluminum seats]

Unfortunately, you failed to mention the New England Patriots starting safeties during the 2003-2004 NFL Seasons were Rodney Harrison and Eugene Wilson.

Right--Eugene Wilson, who was so promising until the Pats coaching destroyed him.

 

[BadMoFo]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

I think firing Boyer is just a start. I'm ready to cut Chung, and move McCourty to safety full-time. And for ****'s sake, let's see what Dowling can do out there.

 

[Deus Irae]

Again, we wait for you to complete your assignment. It's becoming increasingly clear that you simply don't have any reasoning behind your (currently 18,000) posts on the subject.

I've already noted my reasoning, and the post count thing isn't helping your case any, particularly given that you've got more posts in this thread than I do.

Look, I'm sorry that you don't have any rational justification for your position. I really am. It would be great if we could identify the exact problem and fix it as easily as just hiring one coach.

Unfortunately, nothing you've offered demonstrates that to be the case.

 

[ATippett56]

However i would like to point out that The Patriots secondary once consisted of the likes of Ja'Rod Cherry, Otis Smith, Randall Gay, Tyrone Poole, Hank Poteat, Troy Brown etc and were highly successful. I dont think its talent, it's coaching/scheme.

You also failed to mentioned during the 2003-2004 NFL Seasons, the New England Patriots defense employed more than one defensive player who could rush the passer:

Vrabel
McGinest
Colvin
Seymour
Warren
Green

 

[BradyFTW!]

Right--Eugene Wilson, who was so promising until the Pats coaching destroyed him.

By Pats coaching, you mean injuries?

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

I think firing Boyer is just a start. I'm ready to cut Chung, and move McCourty to safety full-time. And for ****'s sake, let's see what Dowling can do out there.

What we know about Dowling:

Between preseason and today, he's been passed by the following players on the depth chart:

1) Arrington
2) Moore
3) Dennard

Based on that, I'm going to go ahead and assume that we wouldn't like the result if we saw what he can do out there.

 

[ATippett56]

Right--Eugene Wilson, who was so promising until the Pats coaching destroyed him.

Eugene Wilson was never the same player after he broke his arm in the Super Bowl against the Philadelphia Eagles.

 

[ATippett56]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

What we know about Dowling:

Between preseason and today, he's been passed by the following players on the depth chart:

1) Arrington
2) Moore
3) Dennard

Based on that, I'm going to go ahead and assume that we wouldn't like the result if we saw what he can do out there.

Dowling may never reach his potential in the NFL after last season's hip surgery.

 

[aluminum seats]

I've already noted my reasoning, and the post count thing isn't helping your case any, particularly given that you've got more posts in this thread than I do.

Look, I'm sorry that you don't have any rational justification for your position. I really am. It would be great if we could identify the exact problem and fix it as easily as just hiring one coach.

Unfortunately, nothing you've offered demonstrates that to be the case.

Again.....

Lay out an actual, well-reasoned case why the ongoing suckiness of the secondary is not a result of the coaching. Include in your presentation specific details as to why several Pats' players in the secondary (such as, but not limited to, Eugene Wilson, Devin McCourty) began their Patriots careers with noticeable success before regressing. Also, detail what actions and/or characteristics of the current secondary coach are helping the Patriots be a better team.

Until you do that, I'm afraid we'll have to assume that you're just--what was that phrase again?--talking out of your ass.

 

[PatsFan2]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

What we know about Dowling:

Between preseason and today, he's been passed by the following players on the depth chart:

1) Arrington
2) Moore
3) Dennard

Based on that, I'm going to go ahead and assume that we wouldn't like the result if we saw what he can do out there.

BFTW could you please put Dennard's name first from now on...everytime i see Arrington's name i feel numb.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

Dowling may never reach his potential in the NFL after last season's hip surgery.

That would be my guess. Hip injuries are no joke; anytime that I hear a player has even a 'minor' one, I start worrying. Fingers crossed for Gronk.

 

[rojo8401]

Ellis Hobbs, Asante Samuel, Eugene Wilson, Randall Gay, Darius Butler, Brandon Meriweather, James Sanders, Terrence Wheatley all went on to play for other teams with mostly good results.

The Pats can't draft receivers but they do ok with their DBs. The regression appears to be a scheme/coaching issue to me. I could be wrong but the evidence points this way.

NITPICKER NOTES: 1. Hobbs retired due to injury 2. Butler is playing for the Colts as their nickel (albeit due to injuries) 3. Wheatley is a bum (although still employed in the NFL).

 

[BadMoFo]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

What we know about Dowling:

Between preseason and today, he's been passed by the following players on the depth chart:

1) Arrington
2) Moore
3) Dennard

Based on that, I'm going to go ahead and assume that we wouldn't like the result if we saw what he can do out there.

I don't know how it can get any worse.

 

[JMarr]

Re: Fire the DB coach:

Spending so many high draft picks on busts at CB for so long has hurt us more than anything the last few years. Not sure whose fault that is.

And if you choose to draft only ONE safety over a four year period prior to 2012, that guy better damn well pan out, especially if you're prone to releasing your two long-time starting safeties on the eve of the 2011 season. You cant predict injuries, but the Chung pick is looking pretty horrible right now.