The Drake Maye Discussion Thread

[1960Pats]

Drake Maye makes a nice long distance connection to Boutte in training camp.



The throw was clean and showed off his arm talent. But were those little foot movements before the throw necessary or is that something he should look to clean up for a faster release?

They used to call that happy feet.

 

[PP2]

Even those that are advocating that he sit for a while would love to see him start earlier if he earns it in practice, or even the preseason. I am more concerned if he takes some time and he does not start at any point this season the backlash will make it difficult starting season two. When it comes to QBs drafting, developing and retaining is not straightforward.

I would be very happy if he didn't start at all this year. He grew up in an Air Raid system and is used to being in the gun and now he's tasked with learning the West Coast offense. You just don't do that in just a few months (and this is in part why he is reverting to bad footwork, bad habits). And add to this: the offense is learning a new system for the fourth year in a row and this time it's a completely different system, the OL has hit the reset button yet again, and I could go on and on.

Like it or not, the team is going to have a very ****ty start this year.

I personally find it hilarious the amount of praises being heaped on Brissett, about how he's excelling in TC. Yeah, he's excelling in practice, but in an actual game when passing windows shrink to 1/3 or 1/4 their sizes is when everyone is going to suddenly remember who he really is. He hit his ceiling a long time ago and it is a pretty low one.

 

[sb1]

I would be very happy if he didn't start at all this year. He grew up in an Air Raid system and is used to being in the gun and now he's tasked with learning the West Coast offense. You just don't do that in just a few months (and this is in part why he is reverting to bad footwork, bad habits). And add to this: the offense is learning a new system for the fourth year in a row and this time it's a completely different system, the OL has hit the reset button yet again, and I could go on and on.

Like it or not, the team is going to have a very ****ty start this year.

I personally find it hilarious the amount of praises being heaped on Brissett, about how he's excelling in TC. Yeah, he's excelling in practice, but in an actual game when passing windows shrink to 1/3 or 1/4 their sizes is when everyone is going to suddenly remember who he really is. He hit his ceiling a long time ago and it is a pretty low one.

The GDT reactions when Brissett throws short of the sticks on 3rd and long when he had a man open downfield that Brady could hit in his sleep. That's what he did with the Colts all the time. There's a reason why he's a journeyman backup and not a permanent starter.

 

[PatsFan2]

The GDT reactions when Brissett throws short of the sticks on 3rd and long when he had a man open downfield that Brady could hit in his sleep. That's what he did with the Colts all the time. There's a reason why he's a journeyman backup and not a permanent starter.

GEt ready for the Biscuit moral victories.

 

[sb1]

GEt ready for the Biscuit moral victories.

Don't get me wrong if we need a bridge QB I'm glad it's him and he'll be good for Maye. Everywhere he's been he's been talked about as a great teammate.

 

[Jim Beankie]

Yeah, and you were laughing too when folks said the same thing about the actual Mac Jones, refusing to accept what our eyes were telling us (that he was playing the QB position tremendously poorly). You liked Mac, you rooted for him, you wanted him to succeed, and (despite all the evidence indicating otherwise) you continued to insist he was a nonissue and playing fine (which was obviously not the case). Mac Jones is no longer on the team.

Drake Maye - who folks understandably are rooting hard for - is not looking great (albeit in his rookie season, very early in TC) and you're sarcastically dismissing the same type of reporting indicating that the QB position isn't being played well. You keep on whistling (er, laughing) past the graveyard, I guess.

Man that Holley take was brutal - "Ghost of Mac Jones [circa Dallas game]" - "The times where I was counting in my head - You gotta get rid of it, you gotta get rid of it. He's holding on to the ball. When he should've been getting rid of the ball, at times he was running with the football... He was making easy passes look difficult."

Mac was definitely way more pro ready, apparently, but his mental ceiling was like those bridges on Storrow where trucks get opened up like a can of sardines. I'm more hopeful that long term, Maye's got it upstairs. There was that one vid, though, where he held on to the ball for almost 3.5 seconds before throwing, and a DL was gonna strip sack and pancake him if it were a real game. Putting him out there before he's ready would be like a Momma bird tossing her baby out the nest before it's ready to fly. That being said, I defer to the coaches to make the right decision on when he gets to start.

Greg Bedard: Yeah. You can’t even compare where Mac Jones was and where Drake Maye is. I mean, it was. I think it was one of the first red zone periods of camp when they were in pads and Mac just knew what he was going to see after the snap, and I don’t know how much of that was McDaniels or what have you, but compared to Cam, I mean, who look, we all love Cam Newton, but diagnosing defenses, making checks at the line in a Patriots style offense was not his forte. Mac Jones came from that offense in Alabama and as soon as that happened, I turned to Chris Gasper and I was like, “it’s over. He’s going to be the starter”. And this was like, the first day of pads. Drake Maye, it’s not even close to that. He’s closer to where Cam Newton was at that point then where Mac Jones was.

 

[sb1]

Man that Holley take was brutal - "Ghost of Mac Jones [circa Dallas game]" - "The times where I was counting in my head - You gotta get rid of it, you gotta get rid of it. He's holding on to the ball. When he should've been getting rid of the ball, at times he was running with the football... He was making easy passes look difficult."

Mac was definitely way more pro ready, apparently, but his mental ceiling was like those bridges on Storrow where trucks get opened up like a can of sardines. I'm more hopeful that long term, Maye's got it upstairs. There was that one vid, though, where he held on to the ball for almost 3.5 seconds before throwing, and a DL was gonna strip sack and pancake him if it were a real game. Putting him out there before he's ready would be like a Momma bird tossing her baby out the nest before it's ready to fly. That being said, I defer to the coaches to make the right decision on when he gets to start.

Greg Bedard: Yeah. You can’t even compare where Mac Jones was and where Drake Maye is. I mean, it was. I think it was one of the first red zone periods of camp when they were in pads and Mac just knew what he was going to see after the snap, and I don’t know how much of that was McDaniels or what have you, but compared to Cam, I mean, who look, we all love Cam Newton, but diagnosing defenses, making checks at the line in a Patriots style offense was not his forte. Mac Jones came from that offense in Alabama and as soon as that happened, I turned to Chris Gasper and I was like, “it’s over. He’s going to be the starter”. And this was like, the first day of pads. Drake Maye, it’s not even close to that. He’s closer to where Cam Newton was at that point then where Mac Jones was.

Yeah. The kid is raw, we all know that. Trying to get him to tap into all that talent is what it's all about. Jones was already supposed to be pro ready. High floor (which we found out was in the basement), low ceiling.

If the media is complaining about Maye holding the ball too long they're really going to be triggered at the Jacoby Brissett experience.

 

[lancerman]

How does he benefit from sitting? He needs to be on the field developing. This year is already hopeless next year probably is too. Let’s get 34 games of nfl football under his belt so he is as good as he can be by 2026. Every game he sits on the bench just pushes back his development.

How did Tom Brady benefit from sitting? Aaron Rodgers? Patrick Mahomes?

 

[Ring 6]

How did Tom Brady benefit from sitting? Aaron Rodgers? Patrick Mahomes?

They would have benefitted more from playing. Tom Brady would have been a better QB in September of 2001 if he had 18 games of experience (plus over a year practicing with the 1s) than he was from not having played.

 

[lancerman]

They would have benefitted more from playing. Tom Brady would have been a better QB in September of 2001 if he had 18 games of experience (plus over a year practicing with the 1s) than he was from not having played.

Yeah I'm sure you know better than the coaches who developed them lol. Weird, the best QB of all time, the best QB drafted since him, and the current best QB drafted since all sat and had their fundamentals developed without being on the field and came in much more ready on day 1.

You have literally nothing to base your point on besides some alternative universe unprovable reasoning. You couldn't have given them better entrances to the league and somehow you think those teams all got it wrong.

 

[jeremy2020]

Yeah I'm sure you know better than the coaches who developed them lol. Weird, the best QB of all time, the best QB drafted since him, and the current best QB drafted since all sat and had their fundamentals developed without being on the field and came in much more ready on day 1.

You have literally nothing to base your point on besides some alternative universe unprovable reasoning. You couldn't have given them better entrances to the league and somehow you think those teams all got it wrong.

I don't agree with the guy you're responding to, but there's a lot of evidence that 'sitting a QB' isn't the right answer for everybody either. Like 40 years of it from when sitting QBs was the normal practice.

Like most things, different people perform better in different circumstances. You have to hope the people developing know which track to take.

 

[Ring 6]

Yeah I'm sure you know better than the coaches who developed them lol. Weird, the best QB of all time, the best QB drafted since him, and the current best QB drafted since all sat and had their fundamentals developed without being on the field and came in much more ready on day 1.

You have literally nothing to base your point on besides some alternative universe unprovable reasoning. You couldn't have given them better entrances to the league and somehow you think those teams all got it wrong.

I’m not saying I know better than the coaches who developed them. Why would you put words in my mouth in order to argue something I didn’t say?
I’m saying Brady couldn’t beat our Bledsoe as a rookie and shouldn’t have played. But if he had he would have been further ahead than he was.
Mahomes didn’t play because they had a viable playoff qb. But if he had played he would have been further ahead than he was at the start of year 2.
It’s really not complicated. If you do something you get better at doing it.
They didn’t “develop their fundamentals” on the sidelines on Sunday. They would have developed them faster or more thoroughly if they were okaying rather than watching in addition to ratifying with the 1s and running the offense rather than the scout team.

So your argument is that Brady improved more by not playing than he would if he played? You are taking his ability and co-opting it to say he was only good because he sat out. I’m saying once he got on the field he improved dramatically. Both of those players and most all other great QBs improved while playing a hell of a lot more than you think they did while sitting.

Of course the improvement they made while sitting is all in your mind and you have no way of knowing they wouldn’t have been just as good from day 1.

 

[Ring 6]

I don't agree with the guy you're responding to, but there's a lot of evidence that 'sitting a QB' isn't the right answer for everybody either. Like 40 years of it from when sitting QBs was the normal practice.

Like most things, different people perform better in different circumstances. You have to hope the people developing know which track to take.

The question isn’t really whether sitting or playing the guy is “the best move” it’s whether sitting or playing the first year makes the qb better in year 2.
Maye might not be ready and might suck in year 1 but he should still play FOR THIS TEAM IN THIS SITUATION because this team isn’t winning this year.

It’s about Sept of 25 at this point, and I don’t see how anyone could argue that Maye will be farther ahead in Sept of 25 by sitting on the bench than he will by playing, learning, struggling, overcoming, having successes, having failures, adapting to the game at this level, reading a defense and making decisions where to throw 500 times, etc etc.

Anything you think he gains by not playing he gains in addition to playing.
But if anyone has an explanation for what he would learn on the scout team and bench that he wouldn’t learn playing let me know. And if the answer is “he won’t have pressure”, sorry dealing with pressure is the primary thing a qb needs to learn.

 

[btdrnks]

I’m not saying I know better than the coaches who developed them. Why would you put words in my mouth in order to argue something I didn’t say?
I’m saying Brady couldn’t beat our Bledsoe as a rookie and shouldn’t have played. But if he had he would have been further ahead than he was.
Mahomes didn’t play because they had a viable playoff qb. But if he had played he would have been further ahead than he was at the start of year 2.
It’s really not complicated. If you do something you get better at doing it.
They didn’t “develop their fundamentals” on the sidelines on Sunday. They would have developed them faster or more thoroughly if they were okaying rather than watching in addition to ratifying with the 1s and running the offense rather than the scout team.

So your argument is that Brady improved more by not playing than he would if he played? You are taking his ability and co-opting it to say he was only good because he sat out. I’m saying once he got on the field he improved dramatically. Both of those players and most all other great QBs improved while playing a hell of a lot more than you think they did while sitting.

Of course the improvement they made while sitting is all in your mind and you have no way of knowing they wouldn’t have been just as good from day 1.

The problem with this is if they ARENT ready and get destroyed day one. Loss of confidence is the death of many careers.

 

[Ring 6]

The problem with this is if they ARENT ready and get destroyed day one. Loss of confidence is the death of many careers.

I disagree. Good QBs aren’t going to chunk because things are tough. Manning threw 27 ints. I guarantee that made him a better qb.
Many QBs play as rookies. The ones who went on to fail failed because they weren’t good but because they lost confidence.
I can’t think of any examples of a guy who played early and failed who who have been good if he sat out.

 

[btdrnks]

I disagree. Good QBs aren’t going to chunk because things are tough. Manning threw 27 ints. I guarantee that made him a better qb.
Many QBs play as rookies. The ones who went on to fail failed because they weren’t good but because they lost confidence.
I can’t think of any examples of a guy who played early and failed who who have been good if he sat out.

I disagree too. You are looking at these guys in a vacuum. Some of the guys that succeeded after sitting out may not have if they were thrown to the wolves. Some guys that failed after being thrown to the wolves, might have succeeded after sitting out. You also have to factor into the team scenario. The Coordinator, Scheme, OL and WR/TE make a big difference. The pats arent set up for a young qb to succeed at the moment.

 

[Ring 6]

I disagree too. You are looking at these guys in a vacuum. Some of the guys that succeeded after sitting out may not have if they were thrown to the wolves. Some guys that failed after being thrown to the wolves, might have succeeded after sitting out. You also have to factor into the team scenario. The Coordinator, Scheme, OL and WR/TE make a big difference. The pats arent set up for a young qb to succeed at the moment.

Well you are looking at them in a vacuum as well.

My point is very simply this. The best way for a football player to develop into a better football player is by playing football.

That guy playing certainly may not be best for the team that year, but it is best for his development.

The OC absolutely has a huge impact on the development of the QB but that isn’t aided by having him not take reps with the 1s and playing.

The talent surrounding him will impact his success but not his development. Every team that ever existed requires QBs to deal with issues created by the play of the people acting them. Whether that occurs 8 times a game or 30, being in the field and dealing with it is how you learn to deal with it and improve.

I don’t care about this year, we aren’t winning this year. I care about where the QBOTF is by the end of this year more than the number of wins. And there is no way you will ever convince me that how much he will progress from today to the end of the season isn’t exactly correlated to how many reps he takes with the 1s and his many snaps he plays.


Every snap someone else takes with the ones and every down he sits out is a missed opportunity for him to learn, improve and progress. And that is the #1 goal this year.

 

[Brotherblues]

Concerns about starting Maye week 1

A) we have a "versatile" o-line with too many unsettled starting positions,
B) the young WRs are new to both the NFL and the AVP offense, it'll take a while before they're running the right routes decisively and reliably

Not saying everything has to be perfect before they put Maye in, but both our pass catching and blocking groups have little to no history together in their current configuration.

So I'm all for the initial plan to be for him to sit a few games at least. Doesn't mean the plan should be rigid. Gotta adapt when reality demands it. No fan will dislike it if Maye forces his way to the field sooner rather than later.

 

[KCSVEN]

Release time as fast as Tom Brady and ball speed and release much faster than Mac Jones, it's not a myth, it's just Drake Maye. OMG, I just put Tom Brady and Mac Jones in the same sentence! Seems blasphemous! Long Windup? Who? Brady or Maye?

 

[sportnik]

From what I saw at camp yesterday, Maye looks good to go. But if the Pats were smart, they’d sit him for a few weeks to assess the OL. If the OL is not a complete ****show, they should put the kid in at the beginning of October.