Project 2027

[203Pat]

If we don't sign 70 free agents next year then that season is a wash too. A man can dream I guess.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

1.) Return of Gonzalez/Judon.

2.) Return of mediocre QB play which is an upgrade over Jones/Zappe.

3.) Eventual return of Bourne.

4.) Minus loss of Barmore.

5.) Year 2 leap for guys like Gonzo, White, Sow, Pop, Baringer, and maybe Ryland.

6.) AVP as an OC....got to be better than BoB/Patrica/Judge the last two years.

That is 5 things.....

1. Yes the return of Gonzo and Judon is welcomed. Which players are you assuming will be injured this year (there are always injuries) that you are comparing to the return of Gonzo and Judon? Or are you not addind a "Minus loss of 2 or 3 key players to injury" to your list?
6. AVP is not a better OC than O'Brien. Not close. In Cleveland AVP was not even calling offensive plays because the HC did not trust him.

You said that is 5 things, but in your post did not list 5 things. Your post listed 5 positive things and one negative thing. 5 -1 = 4.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

If we don't sign 70 free agents next year then that season is a wash too. A man can dream I guess.

The issue is that signing a whole bunch of FAs at once usually does not work. It is better to add a few FAs per year and integrate them into the team. The team facing a bunch of rookies and FAs unfamiliar with the plays and system all at once does not usually work out.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

You want them to contend. That’s what they’d ultimately be contending for.

You keep repeating they’re not using resources and calling Kraft cheap, yet you won’t tell us who you believe they should have signed, or how they might have swayed them into coming here.

Is it with the annual value, guaranteeing most of or all of the deal? Paying that player at the top of the position even if they’re not worth it? How should they have swayed that player? You don’t have to be right, but getting some sort of an opinion makes it a discussion we can at least have with more context.

Otherwise, it’s basically a “Kraft is cheap” thread without any real substance to understand where you believe they missed out on or whoever you believe out of that group of 70 names they should have spent the money on.

You seem to only look at WRs and Offensive Tackles. I agree the FAs at WR and Tackle were limited.

There were a lot of good 2024 FAs on the defensive side of the ball. We need a CB opposite Gonzo, a FS, and DT opposite Barmore. We could have signed those players. If we had signed defensive FAs, we would not have to consider drafting the same defensive positions in 2025, and could concetrate mostly on the offensive side of the ball again in the 2025 draft.

Rolling over $40M+ in cap space into 2025 leads to lots of FA signings next year? Taking in large slugs of FAs and a new rookie class all at once has not worked well in many cases. We used to say the JETS won the SB again in March. It is much better to slowly add a few FAs every year and continually integrate them into the offense/defense.

We were a 4 win team. We have a lot of needs outside of WR, OT and QB. If RK is not cheap, why do you think the Pats ignored lots of holes outside of WR, OT, and QB and still have $40M+ in cap space plus gigantic cap space in 2025 and 2026?

 

[Ring 6]

You listed 70 players. You won’t tell us who you would have liked to have seen them sign. Meaning you don’t feel strongly enough about anyone in particular who you feel would have made an impact. If you don’t love any of them in particular, why should the team?

And yes, I’d love them to contend. But I’m going into this expecting growth and a competitive season, I don’t expect them to be in the AFC Championship game or playing next February. I’ll judge the wins and losses based on how they play, and I’ll temper my expectations from there.

All 70 of them would have made the team better. Pick whatever 40 million worth you want and I guarantee we have a better team. We are so bad any of them would have been worthwhile. We aren’t talking about a piece here or there we are talking about overhauling a weak roster. Just reread the post about the play we s Tennessee spent less than 40 mill. They would make us a much better team in many areas.
You can’t be telling me you think this team is so talented that th we ever no players who would have improved it.
I would be fine with growth, but they chose to not use their resources to grow.

 

[Ring 6]

The issue is that signing a whole bunch of FAs at once usually does not work. It is better to add a few FAs per year and integrate them into the team. The team facing a bunch of rookies and FAs unfamiliar with the plays and system all at once does not usually work out.

But they had 55 mill to spend and spent 12.
If you told me they signed 5-7 players, uses 25-30 mill on them and carried the rest over to next year, I’d see a plan. The only plan I see now is keeping the 4 win team intact cost all the money Kraft was willing to spend so we are carrying forward all of it.

 

[Ring 6]

Where was Judon and Gonzalez? Marcus Jones too?

A 4 - 13 team improves through the NFL draft because they select early.

But, you choose to throw the entire 2024 draft out.

Injuries happen and they will this year too. We didn’t have enough players to overcome those injuries and we didn’t add anything so the injuries that are bound to happen will be just as devastating. The first devastating one already happened.

You don’t improve by drafting higher if you bench your first round pick.
First rounder and 3rd rounder sitting on the bench, doesn’t move y or close to better teams

Every team has a draft. This one also has 40,000,000 in cap space because it isn’t paying enough good players. They are choosing to go without good players instead of spending to get them.

 

[Sciz]

I’m excited to see who gets to be this year’s DJ Fluker and La’el Collins. The Patriots showed interest in both players last season, people posted about how stupid it was to not sign them both immediately, and then neither one played in an NFL game all season long.

Free agency is complicated, especially for older players who may have to disclose their nagging injuries that are ready to give out for good on any given play or who would have to accept the first 50% pay cut of their career. There are nowhere near as many absolutes as a lot of people are trying to claim in here.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Nice to see you have some nuance. I’m sorry for treating you as a blowhard last season. This franchise is not headed in the right direction. But we’ll see on Sundays.

I just call it as I see it. As much as I disagreed with a lot of Bill's moves mostly during the late 2nd Dynasty/post Brady, he was done dirty. Yes, the team was on the decline, but Bob had a 20+ year vacation of dominance with Bill, yet cans his ass for a few bad seasons? Even I thought that was crossing the line.

While the rumors were swirling of Bill's fate, I warned posters this was a "buyer beware" situation. There are a lot of hypocrites on this forum and the media that wanted Bill, Mayo, the entire coaching staff and front office gone during 2023 season. But all of the sudden, they were excited when Mayo was named HC, Wolf the GM and Covington DC, etc.? What? In fact, I haven't seen the media complain about really anything they've done. It's very strange. The moves they've made this off-season in FA were very anti-Bill and it's clear why Bill did what he did during his tenure.

Bob's worst nightmare is Mayo looking incompetent and/or Bill returns coaching a team within the division Tuna style or goes to a contender and is very competitive. I wanted Bill to take the Cowboys job and hope he returns for one last go at it.

 

[JohnJH]

Last 3 years were a clown show too lol
Can't get any worse

With respect, I've been a fan of this team long enough to have seen worse. And, as a general rule of thumb regarding all things in life: Things can always get worse.

 

[UGAPatsfan]

Bill had to go…it had gotten to the point where he seemed to be going through the motions, couldn’t field an offense to save his life, and couldn’t be bothered to entertain anyone challenging him building the team.

I hated what Kraft did on the Dynasty, as Bill still won 6 SB’s and didn’t deserve that hatchet job…but it was time.

The real issue I have is the hiring of Mayo.

I think that decision will turn out to be an absolutely catastrophic mistake. Dude couldn’t even handle a simple “get up and snap it” situation last game with Wilcox’ catch/incompletion.

He’s WAY over his head.

Add to that the handling of Maye and the O-line so far and it just doesn’t feel the team is in steady hands at all.

And Vrabel being there for the hiring just makes it SO dysfunctional. If a young, defensive guy who wasn’t Bill was the play…Vrabes was a superior choice.

I hope I’m dead wrong…but my gut says Mayo gets fired after two years of awful and Pats have to rebuild AGAIN.

 

[Ring 6]

You can’t be serious…?

Why not? Everyone on that list would make this team better. Thats the entire point. Other teams have better players (and coaches) than we do. There are a ton of players in this league that are better than the ones we have.

Do this. Take a player that is the NFL average for his position. At what position(s) would we not have room and playing time for him?
Now do that with an NFL average starting player.

 

[Thelonious]

A team this bad needs to draft, develop, and evaluate, and should only VERY reluctantly part with any draft picks. All this twaddle about drafting this that or other "proven" WR as our knight in shining armor has been foolish, childish impatience.

A team in this state also needs an expert, imaginative, and at times aggressive GM, and a HC and other coaches who can "draft, develop. and evaluate." At this point, I think it is fair to wonder if we have any of those in place. We've already got cheerleaders, so there is no need for a HC whose talents run thataway.

 

[Real fan 02]

I think that group is good enough to maintain continuity, but I have no doubt there will be a game where Belichick’s absence will hurt. Add me to the list of people wondering just how big of a loss that’s going to be and whether or not Bill’s impact on Mayo at least minimizes it as much as can be expected.

I know it sounds funny to say, But I also worry about what happens beyond this year if they have a good season and any of the guys on the staff get poached. That’s been an issue in the past and they definitely don’t have the ability at this point to handle that, which is something they’ll need to do a better job of preparing for compared to what we saw previously.

I agree Ian. I believe that just like brady is..Bill will certainly be missed in certain coaching aspects. His 50 years of knowledge is just irreplaceable. But as I stated what's hampered us is offensive football. Without adequate QB play winning isn't possible in today's NFL.

I mentioned that a formula we could use is the 2017 jags. They were similar to us.. good but not elite players on offense, a stout running game, and a good defense. They came here and brung it to us in the AFCCG. We have many similarities to that team. The NE media has been so down on this team and unfairly in a lot of aspects.

 

[Triumph]

Injuries happen and they will this year too. We didn’t have enough players to overcome those injuries and we didn’t add anything so the injuries that are bound to happen will be just as devastating. The first devastating one already happened.

The 2023 Pats did not have Judon and Gonzalez for 13 games. M Jones was out 15 games.

They are back for 2024 and thats an improvement.

You don’t improve by drafting higher if you bench your first round pick.
First rounder and 3rd rounder sitting on the bench, doesn’t move y or close to better teams

Maye will play soon enough.

Every team has a draft. This one also has 40,000,000 in cap space because it isn’t paying enough good players. They are choosing to go without good players instead of spending to get them.

Who are these good players?

Ayuk? Spend a 2nd and 3rd so SF can draft a WR in 2025 and have him 4 years on a rookie deal? NO The Pats need to be drafting good WRs instead of chasing them with money.

 

[maust]

With respect, I've been a fan of this team long enough to have seen worse. And, as a general rule of thumb regarding all things in life: Things can always get worse.

Yep and often times they do. Remember when we thought it couldn't get more embarrassing than the Sullivans? Then Kiam showed up and had Billy hold his beer. It can always get worse

It's easy to be a fan when your team can fall out of bed to double digit wins or one of the GOAT HC's is here to give you hope he will 'scheme it up.' It can also be interesting and entertaining experiencing your team building itself into something worth cheering for. The part of fandom that let's you really appreciate the top is having lived through the lows.

That's part of the reason some of us will forever be so attached to ol' Pat Patriot. The way this team took me down and brought me up, I'll give up on it when they nail the lid down on my coffin

 

[Ring 6]

The 2023 Pats did not have Judon and Gonzalez for 13 games. M Jones was out 15 games.

They are back for 2024 and thats an improvement.

Maye will play soon enough.


Who are these good players?

Ayuk? Spend a 2nd and 3rd so SF can draft a WR in 2025 and have him 4 years on a rookie deal? NO The Pats need to be drafting good WRs instead of chasing them with money.

Now Judon and Barmore for zero games.

 

[Triumph]

Now Judon and Barmore for zero games.

This is not a playoff team.

Year 1 in a 3 year rebuild. I like to call it The 2027 project.

 

[Ring 6]

This is not a playoff team.

Year 1 in a 3 year rebuild. I like to call it The 2027 project.

The point is it didn’t have to be this way.

 

[Triumph]

The point is it didn’t have to be this way.

Yes it did.