Patriots Only Used 2TE Offense for 18% of Snaps This Season

[TinhWoodhead]

higher % than chance of beating the bills

 

[‘Mondre]

There’s something we don’t know about him. I’m confident he’ll have a serviceable 2022.

 

[TomPatriot]

Jonnu just didn't look like a fit all year. Every time he got the ball it seemed like it had to be a schemed up play designed for him and not any part of the natural flow of the offense. He ended up as a very expensive blocker most of the time he was on the field.

I don’t buy that the offense couldn’t get the ball to him. I don’t know .0001% of what Josh knows, but I can think of ten Patriot plays that would get him the ball in space. That’s on Josh, but it is really out of character for Josh to ignore an obvious resource. Jonnu wasn’t even used the way Art Smith used him in Tennessee.

I think it’s Jonnu’s early drops that led to his non-use, but that’s just a guess.

 

[Triumph]

Shameful. Maybe time for a new offense. Can't keep bringing folks in that "don't get it". The dude can play. Get him the ball.

Brady is running the NE offense in Tampa and winning.

This team does some strange things. Why sign Smith to all that money and barely use him?

 

[RobertWeathers]

Brady is running the NE offense in Tampa and winning.

This team does some strange things. Why sign Smith to all that money and barely use him?

They projected he could pick up the system quickly and he hasn't. Couple that with the fact he was never a highly productive player to begin with. It's not like the guy went from being a 60/800 guy to now.

 

[captain stone]

...It wouldn't matter as much except 5+ different crappy expensive contracts on the team will mess up keeping JC Jackson which would be disastrous

Yep, same as losing Thuney the year before.

 

[captain stone]

I don’t buy that the offense couldn’t get the ball to him. I don’t know .0001% of what Josh knows, but I can think of ten Patriot plays that would get him the ball in space. That’s on Josh, but it is really out of character for Josh to ignore an obvious resource. Jonnu wasn’t even used the way Art Smith used him in Tennessee.

I think it’s Jonnu’s early drops that led to his non-use, but that’s just a guess.

Yeah I also think that the disaster vs the Saints absolutely began to lead to his non-use... And while I believed that he should've been benched for the TB game as a result, what Bill & Skippy did with him was even worse.

 

[Ring 6]

Fix the Front 7, and call it more aggressive like Flores did in '19 IMHO.
Make the QB have to make quicker decisions, that way the DBS don't need to tight cover as long, this year was PAINFUL when Judon was hurt.
Other than that 1 year, Gilmore was a VG Corner, 2020 he was back to mediocre without that pressure he had the year b4(before he got hurt).

Pittsburgh's Defense this year is a decent example IMO.
As were the Giants front 4 in the SB's we lost(Sorry- it's painful).it was the front 4 that destroyed the Pats OL (Neal being hurt certainly didn't help).
There are different ways to do it, lockdown corners creating problems, or the front 7 creating rushed decisions/throws.
They let Allen sit back there worried about him running, and he's too smart(with a rocket arm-not a good option).

I still don't know why they didn't have Judon and crew putting PRESSURE, with Collins spying him... although I think Judon was hurting at the end of the season.

These are just MY thoughts from watching the games.

Flores wasn’t here in 19.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

I don’t buy that the offense couldn’t get the ball to him. I don’t know .0001% of what Josh knows, but I can think of ten Patriot plays that would get him the ball in space. That’s on Josh, but it is really out of character for Josh to ignore an obvious resource. Jonnu wasn’t even used the way Art Smith used him in Tennessee.

I think it’s Jonnu’s early drops that led to his non-use, but that’s just a guess.

Is it out of character ? This offense just left its best OLineman Onwenu on the bench for the last 9 games.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Flores wasn’t here in 19.

Yes he left after the best Superbowl defensive points given up in history.

 

[Nehalem]

That was Bill O'Brien who installed the 2TE offense. The momen O'Brien left McD quickly abandoned 2TE's. Easily verifiable when one checks the 2013-2020 season game logs. Even with Bennett here it was almost always just him (Gronk hurt) or Gronk doing things.

Something might have happened in between the 2012->2013 season off the field that had an impact on 2TE sets.

As for 2016. Brady-Gronk-Bennett basically only played 5 games together.

In those 5 games Gronk had 529 yards and Bennett had 225. Over 16 games that works out to 1693 yards for Gronk and 720 yards for Bennett. Note that Bennett actually ended up with 701 yards for the season, so he actually average MORE yards when playing with Gronk.

 

[Ring 6]

Yes he left after the best Superbowl defensive points given up in history.

And the 2019 defense allowed fewer points than the 2018.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

Something might have happened in between the 2012->2013 season off the field that had an impact on 2TE sets.

As for 2016. Brady-Gronk-Bennett basically only played 5 games together.

In those 5 games Gronk had 529 yards and Bennett had 225. Over 16 games that works out to 1693 yards for Gronk and 720 yards for Bennett. Note that Bennett actually ended up with 701 yards for the season, so he actually average MORE yards when playing with Gronk.

Yes. But even in 2012, if you remember Hernandez was being used differently from his better 2011 year, he was being put in weird spots like HBack.

 

[amfootball]

Yes. But even in 2012, if you remember Hernandez was being used differently from his better 2011 year, he was being put in weird spots like HBack.

The Niners use Samuel just like we used AH.

 

[Ring 6]

The Niners use Samuel just like we used AH.

Not even close.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

The Niners use Samuel just like we used AH.

2011 was probably the peak of the Pats 2TE offense. Brady had a great year too.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

2 hours of film of specifically Hernandez + Gronk being used correctly in 2TE Offense in 2011 by Bill O'Brien:

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

This was his worst year blocking. Easily his worst year run blocking and not much better in pass pro. The past 2-3 years he was actually above average.

I doubt he was much worse blocking this season than he had been any other season.... Never was the reason that the Titties had him on the field either.

Just had time to look. PFF isn't really good for anything nowadays but snaps by position is useful for sure. They had him graded out as his lowest year for blocking since he was a rookie fwiw.

And also this was his lowest year by snaps I believe. They decreased across the board - inline by about 150, slot 50 ...

People don't want to hear it but his blocking was a big reason for that. And ultimately why his #'s decreased imo. That and you're probably not targeting Smith over KB who had a better rapport with Mac.

It's frustrating he had such a poor year but this wasn't Gronk or Kittle in their prime. Smith went from the perfect situation in Tennessee. Lots of PA with less mouths to feed. To a different team with a rookie QB. I think easy just blaming Josh but a little digging and you see why things went the way they did.

 

[captain stone]

And the 2019 defense allowed fewer points than the 2018.

Still taking the 2018 defense.

 

[captain stone]

2 hours of film of specifically Hernandez + Gronk being used correctly in 2TE Offense in 2011 by Bill O'Brien:

To be fair to Skippy, BOB had better personnel across the board...