OT: Official 2021 Tompa Bay Gronkaneers Thread

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I know it's a hush reality but the evidence is pretty overwhelming now that the dynastic run was primarily Brady. And without Brady Bill is not even average. I mean last night giving up 7 TDs in a row and no punts with the defense that quit, pretty much underscores that fact.

I thought Bill’s legacy would be secure no matter what, but last night’s game will be remembered for a long time as a symbol of the post-Brady Patriots. To me personally, it changes very little because I always thought the QBs reign supremely, so a team with an average-ish rookie QB getting smoked by a team with Josh Allen playing at a supreme level shouldn’t be a surprise. But I do think those who still believed in some 50/50 player-coach split with those two, are going to be coming around this offseason.

 

[Lagaffe_07]

It’s extraordinary when it works Bill gets all the credit but when it fails everyone blame everyone else but him. completely ignoring the fact that he controls everything and nobody moves a finger in this organization without his approval.

now it’s the fault of every coordinator and we don’t have enough talent. Bill is the #1 reason we don’t have enough talent

 

[Tottie]

BB has done an great job in his tenure here, this year included. If he believes he's more important than the players then he's a fool, but I don't think he believes that. BUF and CIN are doing good things in the playoffs, I wonder WHY. Same reason we did for 20 years.

 

[Tunescribe]

At some point you're going to need to face the reality that it wasn't Bill the HC that made the team great it was Tom the QB. I wish that wasn't true but it obviously was. Right now Bill's record for both regular season and the playoffs is below .500 without Tom.

Meanwhile, the coaching trio that everyone on Pats fans has ridiculed has won a SB ring and may be on their way to another with Tom.

IOW, it's about the players not the coaches and that's as plain to see as it gets.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on what comprises "reality" here. I feel neither could've sustained 20 years of success without the other, that the BB vs. Tom debate inherently is a nonstarter and there is no objective measure to validate that argument post-split, this being a TEAM game with myriad variables. (Also important to consider is BB's dual role as GM throughout.) I'm not emotionally invested, as you've admitted to being, in proving one or the other "greater," "less than," or exclusively blameworthy for Tom leaving New England. Tom Brady unquestionably was and continues to be the GOAT and ideally, should have spent his full career in a Patriots uniform. But I understand why he didn't and while it might not have been a full two-way street, he was complicit in how things played out.

 

[Tottie]

The team is like a car and the coaching are the wheels. They are important obviously and need to be reliable but can be replaced easily enough. There are no magic wheels that make the car fly. The players are the rest of the car and the QB is the engine/driver.

 

[amfootball]

I thought Bill’s legacy would be secure no matter what, but last night’s game will be remembered for a long time as a symbol of the post-Brady Patriots. To me personally, it changes very little because I always thought the QBs reign supremely, so a team with an average-ish rookie QB getting smoked by a team with Josh Allen playing at a supreme level shouldn’t be a surprise. But I do think those who still believed in some 50/50 player-coach split with those two, are going to be coming around this offseason.

The issue for Bill and his legacy is he let Brady walk as a free agent. We know it's more complicated than that and there were a lot of factors at play but it's pretty much been universally confirmed that Bill did not want him pass to age 42. And really the worst thing could have happened which is Brady goes on to have two championship level type seasons winning the super bowl last year and being tied for the best record in the League this year with the Packers. Now that gets juxtaposed unfairly in a way to our current rebuild which has us at 17 -17 and of course 0-1 in the playoffs with an embarrassing loss that set all types of NFL records.

Bill's legacy will always be tied to Brady and there's really no way for him to get out from under that. It's like an anvil on his shoulders at this point. And what's worse is right now this Bill's team is a wagon. I mean this was technically a down season for them compared to last year and look where they are in the divisional round playing their best football. Meanwhile, Brady is in a division that literally has three teams that are rebuilding. It's really quite surreal when you think about it how it's all unfolded these past couple of seasons.

 

[VectorPrime]

I think the Bills are gonna beat the Chiefs.

 

[Tottie]

I think the Bills are gonna beat the Chiefs.

Don't think the Steelers can do it?

 

[Lagaffe_07]

I think the Bills are gonna beat the Chiefs.

It would be great if the Bucs can reach the SB, play the Bills. Brady destroying the Bills one more time would be gold

 

[VectorPrime]

It would be great if the Bucs can reach the SB, play the Bills. Brady destroying the Bills one more time would be gold

This is now my ideal scenario.

 

[Tottie]

Anything can happen but this year with the injuries and likely 1-3 guys going out each game because they are playing hurt, it's going to be hard to get to the SB. Dallas, GB and LA are healthy. Philly is healthy but they shouldn't factor in anything even if they upset TB somehow. Can you imagine DAL and BUF? Jerry Jones on TV for a week straight!

 

[Guts]

I made the mistake of listening to the radio this morning and I couldn't believe what I heard.

The topic was Brady and his line of apparel. The host was making the claim that nobody likes Brady and won't buy his stuff because of the costs but that Jordan's sneaker deal with Nike was "cool."

Apparently the host doesn't realize that Brady's popular with just about every player he ever played with, maybe with the exception of N'Keal Harry who Brady yelled at. The host also doesn't realize that Nike uses sweat shops in poor countries to make sneakers for pennies and then charges outrageous prices. There's nothing cool about that.

I think people love Tom a lot he's the most popular player in the league. He led the league with jersey sales again this season. However his clothing brand sucks lol Very generic and super pricey

 

[Guts]

We'll just have to agree to disagree on what comprises "reality" here. I feel neither could've sustained 20 years of success without the other, that the BB vs. Tom debate inherently is a nonstarter and there is no objective measure to validate that argument post-split, this being a TEAM game with myriad variables. (Also important to consider is BB's dual role as GM throughout.) I'm not emotionally invested, as you've admitted to being, in proving one or the other "greater," "less than," or exclusively blameworthy for Tom leaving New England. Tom Brady unquestionably was and continues to be the GOAT and ideally, should have spent his full career in a Patriots uniform. But I understand why he didn't and while it might not have been a full two-way street, he was complicit in how things played out.

Yup. Both parties were it was a mutual split. No need to bash either side. It was a historic ugly game yesterday, but there's a lot of good things to takeaway from the season too.

 

[Guts]

It would be great if the Bucs can reach the SB, play the Bills. Brady destroying the Bills one more time would be gold

Thats the last team the Bills would want to see in the Superbowl if they can get past the Queens.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Don't think the Steelers can do it?

Old Yeller comes to mind for this one.

 

[RicoG]

now it’s the fault of every coordinator and we don’t have enough talent. Bill is the #1 reason we don’t have enough talent

BB overall has been great except he has stunk as a talent evaluator on the offensive skill position side for about 5, 6, 7 years.

Now Mac I think will be OK for the next 4 years on a rookie contract. His level seems to be at the Dalton scale similar to Alex Smith or Tannehill level. A competent game manager where you can use the 20-30 million saved from not paying an elite QB to surround him with better talent.

 

[Pats1971]

Yup. Both parties were it was a mutual split. No need to bash either side. It was a historic ugly game yesterday, but there's a lot of good things to takeaway from the season too.

Im not bashing either side. I am not saying Evil Bill made it so he could not pay Brady, but his decisions lead to that, and again there was some reason Brady got upset and wanted to leave and I dont think it was about money. Something happened and we might not ever know.

 

[Tottie]

Starting CB SMB is out. Although he stinks, he's better than the guy who's going to step in.

 

[Tunescribe]

 

[VectorPrime]

Anything can happen but this year with the injuries and likely 1-3 guys going out each game because they are playing hurt, it's going to be hard to get to the SB. Dallas, GB and LA are healthy. Philly is healthy but they shouldn't factor in anything even if they upset TB somehow. Can you imagine DAL and BUF? Jerry Jones on TV for a week straight!

Dallas and Rams both lost their #2 receiver. Rams are missing both safeties as well. Cardinals can’t keep Hopkins on the field. Packers are healthy yes. No one else is.