PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

On to 2017 . premature/overdue . thread

Status
Not open for further replies.
Harmon wants to stay. He stays.
Branch wants to stay. He stays. (Loyalty)
Franchise Hightower
Pay Butler
Upgrade/replace Ryan
Keep Chung.

Doing all that doesn't put a very big dent in 70mm.

If no big upgrade, keep Blount. He's serviceable for what he does.
Floyd on a prove it deal since he wants to stay.

Upgrade Ryan how? Ryan played almost 90% of all our snaps. Would you use our #1 pick in a DE or CB, would you upgrade Sheard or Ryan? I can't see any pick after that as a sure upgrade over him and FA wise there is none in Ryan's level.
Chung is not a FA untill 2019
Pay HT. Because 1.a He deserves; 1.b They can. If gonna tag one of them is going to be Butler. His tag is 3.6m / HT is 14m+.
 
The only position it might worth taking an OL early is LT to be groomed behind Solder. And that only if someone falls into your lap like Brown did on DL.

If they end up trading Jimmy, the kid from Wisconsin could be an option
 
If they end up trading Jimmy, the kid from Wisconsin could be an option

I am in the boat that wants that pick traded down into multiple additional picks if it is high enough to warrant that. If you look at highly drafted OL, then for every Tyron Smith you get a couple of Fishers, Joeckels or Robinsons.
 
I am in the boat that wants that pick traded down into multiple additional picks if it is high enough to warrant that. If you look at highly drafted OL, then for every Tyron Smith you get a couple of Fishers, Joeckels or Robinsons.

That's why you have to hit the draft pick. The lower in the draft you go the more likely you are not to get a good player. They shouldn't take a lineman just for the sake of taking one, I just hope wherever they pick there is one worth taking
 
That's why you have to hit the draft pick. The lower in the draft you go the more likely you are not to get a good player. They shouldn't take a lineman just for the sake of taking one, I just hope wherever they pick there is one worth taking

I think you are confusing things. The way to hit on draft picks is to have many of them not to draft high. Every player comes with a risk attached even first/second overall choices like Fisher or Joeckel that appeared to be safe and sure elite players throughout the process.

Apart from maybe the upper 10-12 picks of the first round there is not much difference between players selected in the ~ top 100. Which is why I'd rather trade down than spend all those gained draft resources on one (potentially blue chip) player.
 
I think you are confusing things. The way to hit on draft picks is to have many of them not to draft high. Every player comes with a risk attached even first/second overall choices like Fisher or Joeckel that appeared to be safe and sure elite players throughout the process.

Apart from maybe the upper 10-12 picks of the first round there is not much difference between players selected in the ~ top 100. Which is why I'd rather trade down than spend all those gained draft resources on one (potentially blue chip) player.

no one really knows how any of the players feel. You can definitely get good players in the other rounds too. But they shouldn't just trade down for the sake of getting more picks. I think they'll only do that if they feel like there is nobody worth taking.
 
The biggest ? is TE position.

1. Gronk would be the first player in NFL history to come back from 3rd back surgery. Even before this injury he played about 5 games reasonably healthy/ no preseason. He says he's ready to return but Id be more curious what Pats FO thinks of his situation.

2. Bennett wants his last big contract. He played through nagging injuries most of the season. He is reportedly going to have an ankle operation. Unfortunately his worth to the Patriots is closely connected with their assessment of the first question. So we're quite in the dark here.

3. After them there's nobody - at least if we consider rout running and receiving an important part of TE position.

4. TE FA market is weak. That means Bennett's price tag will probably exceed his value and at the same time it will be hard to find replacement:
Jermaine Gresham, ARI, 28
Jack Doyle, IND, 26
Vernon Davis, WAS, 32
Jacob Tamme, ATL, 31 /inj/
Brandon Williams, SEA, 29
Luke Wilson, SEA, 27
Ryan Griffin, HOU, 27

5. TE draft class is deep, but there might not be many of Gronk/Bennett stature ready to go week 1. OJ Howard might be the only year 1 replacement of Bennett (but far from blocking monster Bennett is at 30).

So Im really curious how they go about the position BB loves so much and invested so much this season (Bennett, Harbor). We had such great expectations for this year (Gronk-Bennett-Derby) and saw only glimpses of unstoppable 2TE offense in early parts of the season .. and now we stand in front of a huge ?
 
Speaking of TE, what do you guys think of Rob Houser? After winning the Super Bowl, I wonder what veteran free agents out there are hungry to be on a winning team? We could use OL help, edge rusher, and LB
 
Speaking of TE, what do you guys think of Rob Houser? After winning the Super Bowl, I wonder what veteran free agents out there are hungry to be on a winning team? We could use OL help, edge rusher, and LB

Houser is a JAG

It's going to be very interesting to see how the market develops for Bennett. He'll be 30 in March and coming off surgery (which I assume will allow him to be 100%). I believe there are a number of teams that aren't exactly keen on his personality.

I hope hes back. They need him. They don't win the SB without him. Perfect insurance policy for Gronk.
 
Bennett will want a big payday. Not sure if we give it to him.

I'd sign Hightower to a 6 year/90 million dollar contract.
I see Hightower as a Dynasty guy.. A Patriot lifer, like a Willie (even though he left eventually) or a Teddy B.
 
I get your point, although I can't imagine Jimmy stays; not with Brady presently playing at this level and the Pats obvious love for Brissett. I think they expect him to be their QB of the future. I expect JG to go for picks this year to replace some of the players they expect to lose.

I worry about Hightower staying. He's going to cost a lot (Collins money) for multi-years and has had a ton of injuries both in the NFL and before at Alabama. He has both knee and shoulder issues, and I'll be interested to see if the Pats lock him up longterm. If not, they may flip the first Garoppolo pick for another interior LB from Alabama, this kid Foster. Who knows, but it will be fun to see Bill build a new team.
I actually think the Patriots will draft a couple more QBs in the next few years, at least once or twice more. (Same scenario, develop them, trade them for pics, except one of them becomes the Heir.)
 
The biggest ? is TE position.

1. Gronk would be the first player in NFL history to come back from 3rd back surgery. Even before this injury he played about 5 games reasonably healthy/ no preseason. He says he's ready to return but Id be more curious what Pats FO thinks of his situation.

2. Bennett wants his last big contract. He played through nagging injuries most of the season. He is reportedly going to have an ankle operation. Unfortunately his worth to the Patriots is closely connected with their assessment of the first question. So we're quite in the dark here.

3. After them there's nobody - at least if we consider rout running and receiving an important part of TE position.

4. TE FA market is weak. That means Bennett's price tag will probably exceed his value and at the same time it will be hard to find replacement:
Jermaine Gresham, ARI, 28
Jack Doyle, IND, 26
Vernon Davis, WAS, 32
Jacob Tamme, ATL, 31 /inj/
Brandon Williams, SEA, 29
Luke Wilson, SEA, 27
Ryan Griffin, HOU, 27

5. TE draft class is deep, but there might not be many of Gronk/Bennett stature ready to go week 1. OJ Howard might be the only year 1 replacement of Bennett (but far from blocking monster Bennett is at 30).

So Im really curious how they go about the position BB loves so much and invested so much this season (Bennett, Harbor). We had such great expectations for this year (Gronk-Bennett-Derby) and saw only glimpses of unstoppable 2TE offense in early parts of the season .. and now we stand in front of a huge ?
I am totally on board with drafting a TE
 
Getting Gronk back and hopefully resigning Floyd and having him in our system all offseason is going to do SO MUCH to alleviate many of the offensive woes we saw during the Super Bowl.

Gronk, Edelman, Hogan, Mitchell, Floyd, Lewis, White

That is an imposing lineup and it gets even better if we resign Bennett and restructure Amendola. Then it becomes borderline best of all time. We need an every down back to replace Blount I think though. We'll find one somewhere.

And I think Lewis will be better with another year on that knee. You could tell he was not the same player as last year. That lineup above would be dynamite!
 
Some basic thoughts:

1. I think these are the major FA's we have on the team

Harmon
Ryan
Bennett
Branch
Blount
Hightower
Butler
Vollmer
Floyd
Sheard
Long
Mingo?
Van Noy?

2. We have 60-70MM in cap space (3rd highest # in the league), and no longer have to resign Collins and CJones. Plus with a few selected cuts we can add even more. So we really can sign all these guys back and still have room left over to still be a player in FA. And we know we won't be signing all of them back.

3. For everyone we don't sign we should have enough cap space to go into FA and sign a resonably decent replacement.

4. This draft will be very deep in the positions we could possibly need help.

5. We will add either mid round first rounder or higher if the bidding war for Garapolo goes as I see it, OR a high 2nd rounder this year and a first next year. If you can't do better than that, then I might keep him. because this team would still be a SB contender with either Brady or JG (though Brady makes our chances better)

6. Lets go down the list"
a. Harmon - He's currently the #3 Safety who's got more value to us than other teams quite frankly. I'm not sure how much he's worth to another team he had an 1.8MM cap hit this year. I might go as high as $3.2MM per year on a 3-4 year deal to keep him. Or could Ebner be ready to get time as the #3 S next year, or what about Richardson.

b. Ryan. There is no way Ryan gets a 10MM/yr contract, but it could be in the area, and it is certainly going to be a lot more than the $1.8 he cost this year. I'm thinking S7-9MM/yr. Again I see him being more valuable in our system than on another team. This will be the most interesting to watch

c. Bennett is also be interesting. He's a 30 year old TE who had a productive year on a great team, so who is going to pay this guy over $8MM/yr on a long term deal (3-4 yr deal). He cost $5MM this season. I'd set his value at around $7MM on a 3 year deal with half guaranteed) Then he can test his theory that someone will overpay him, and come back to him when he finds out the truth. He'd be great WITH Gronk in the offense, and great Gronk insurance when he isn't.

d. Branch - We paid Branch $2.7MM to be one of the best and most reliable DT's in the league. He certainly deserves a raise. But God the guy is 32 now at a position where players in their 30's age fast. I'd pay him a bit more on a one year deal than on a multi year deal. He's another one of those great teammates and gets it, despite being a reported serial dancer. I would reward him with a one year deal up to $4MM

e. Blount - This is hard one for me. He's been good for us and carried a heavy load for us during the first part of the season. 18 TD's and over 1100 yds is a good year for any RB. He's not an elite guy, but a great value at $1MM/year. He too deserves a raise, and I'd give him one up to $2MM/yr. BTW - my lasting memory of Blount was that he was the first player to go to Brady while he was being surrounded by those mediot parasites. They all clearly love him. Cutting him when he isn't making much would send a bad message to the lockerroom.

f. Hightower - He's another guy I think has more value to the Pats than anyother team. He's a great leader, a great communicator. He's the kind of player who isn't going to have great stats, but makes all the players around him better. You paid McCourty and he's been worth it. You pay Hightower too, maybe not at the top of the market, but damned close.

g. Butler - Contrary to what Felger would like you to believe, Butler is NOT going to get paid less than million next year. With a first round tender IIRC he'll get around $5MM as a RFA and be free next year. It's not top end CB money, but it isn't just pocket change either. In an ideal world they's work out some kind of short term deal where Malcom can make more the the $5MM but less than market value. Like a bridge deal to FA. No one fits the patriot way better than Malcolm. Tough dependable, and severely competitive. No question he will be here next year. Only the price is in question. Also this is one of those sending the right message to the locker room. And you don't want to resign Ryan and have him making a lot more than Butler. That WOULD be a problem.

h. Volmer - I read where Volmer was looking as skinny as Matt Light. I think he's done, and Cannon's success this year would mean he'd likely be back up. I don't think he'd come back for back up money. Not with his back history.

i. Floyd- If he wants to come back I'd give him a deal non-guaranteed deal or guarantee just a million or so, and give him insentives that can raise that up to $7MM (what he got this year) if he plays at a #1 WR level. Then at THAT point he's a rehabbed FA with a Pats seal of approval, or if not he's can be cut at a low cost. Good for us, because we get a remarkable talent for at least a year, and good for him because he can rehab a badly torn rep and make decent money if he plays well AND can take that year and hit the FA market in 2018.

Sheard - I don't think you are going to have pay much for Sheard. Off of this season who is going to pay him $7MM/yr for that kind of production. If we don't get him back for less, I think he's gone period.

Long- He was thinking of packing it in last season. I'd be surprised he doesn't just take his ring and the memories of this year and say sayonara. But if the fire still burns I think the Pats will want him back with just a small raise for another year.

Mingo - I'd like him back. He's still long with great speed. I'd try to sign him to a STer's deal with incentives if he can break into the regular D and base it on snaps.

Van Noy - I'm not sure what to do about him and I'm tired of writing this thread

FYI, the pats get Van Noy back next year for a paltry 1.1m.

Kyle Van Noy

McClellin's back, too, and Freeny will be back. And they like Elandon Roberts, it seems. They're deep, but with a bunch who could be upgraded.
 
FYI, the pats get Van Noy back next year for a paltry 1.1m.

Kyle Van Noy

McClellin's back, too, and Freeny will be back. And they like Elandon Roberts, it seems. They're deep, but with a bunch who could be upgraded.

They got no cover guy in the LB group. Getting a hybrid LB that can cover and play the run would be one of the few cases where I'd be ok using a potential top 15 pick from a Jimmy G trade on.

Otherwise, trade down.. business as usual..
 
I like Van Noy and hope he sticks around. E. Roberts seems to have a lot of potential too. I still see Freeney as a special teams only guy but who knows. Mingo has potential but is still a special teamer at this point.
 
For some time now I have the feeling that the Browns will trade us Pick no. 12 for Jimmy G. If that happens i hope we trade back and have 6 picks (2x 1st, 2x seconds, 2x thirds) in the top 100 and can reload big in this draft.
 
I like Van Noy and hope he sticks around. E. Roberts seems to have a lot of potential too. I still see Freeney as a special teams only guy but who knows. Mingo has potential but is still a special teamer at this point.
Van Noy isa solid LB. He can rush the passer some, can cover a bit and is a good run stopper. Roberts is good in run stuffing and bad in covering. Now Hightower is the best at rushing the passer and also very good at runn stopping. If we can add a cover LB this group will be fine for some time.
 
DeAndrew White is somewhat surprising .. one of the 5 PS guys that got a raise .. maybe he has better offer elsewhere?


 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Patriots News 04-19, Countdown To Draft Day
Patriots News 04-19, Countdown To Draft Day
Steve Balestrieri
22 hours ago
MORSE: Patriots Mock Draft 6 – A Week Before the Draft
TRANSCRIPT: Eliot Wolf Pre-Draft Press Conference 4/13
Patriots News 04-12, What To Watch For In The NFL Draft
MORSE: Pre-Draft Patriots News and Notes
MORSE: Patriots Mock Draft 5
MORSE: Patriots Mock Draft 5
Mark Morse
2 weeks ago
Patriots Part Ways with Another Linebacker as Offseason Roster Shake-Up Continues
Patriots News 04-05, Mock Draft 2.0, Patriots Look For OL Depth
MORSE: 18 Game Schedule and Other Patriots Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Mike Vrabel Press Conference at the League Meetings 3/31
Back
Top