[Old 2020 thread] NFL Free Agency/Trade Rumors:

[Froob]

Yeah, and if he can't beat Hoyer out, who can he beat out?


If Stidham can't be Hoyer out, it's better to find a better young QB than tread water with Hoyer. Everyone has seen what Hoyer has, it's not enough.


Bills played us hard this last season. We're in a rebuild. Makes sense for them to make their move now.

I was talking about Dalton.

 

[luuked]

If Stidham can't be Hoyer out, it's better to find a better young QB than tread water with Hoyer. Everyone has seen what Hoyer has, it's not enough.

That all sounds nice but if Hoyer (or whoever ends up being the vet QB) ends up being the most consistent option by the start of September then it is what it is. You can't keep just having QB auditions through the entire regular season.

 

[Bill Lee]

That all sounds nice but if Hoyer (or whoever ends up being the vet QB) ends up being the most consistent option by the start of September then it is what it is. You can't keep just having QB auditions through the entire regular season.

I don't know which one of us is right, but I think finding a young QB on a cheap contract is so important that you keep doing live tryouts till you find one. I think one thing BB is good at is self-scouting. He just keeps trying different pieces till he sees what he wants to see on the field. No on knows Minshew is better than Winston till he gets the ball. Some people had Stidham higher than Daniel Jones on their draft boards. Some XFL dude may play better than either of them. All of it is theoretical till they show it on the field.

 

[Bill Lee]

I was talking about Dalton.

Sorry, I misunderstood. I don't really see Dalton as a match, but am willing to admit maybe BB does. As above I think we are in the place where we need to keep trying young QBs till we find a workable one. Maybe BB feels he wants stability more than he wants to find the next young QB. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

 

[jah]

They overpaid to stick it to us.
They knew Bill wasn’t going close to that high.
Unless Diggs has a 2007 Moss year the Bills overpaid when they are looking at a incredible deep WR class.

Is Diggs that much better than Anderson?

How is overpaying sticking it to anybody but yourself?

 

[jah]

That all sounds nice but if Hoyer (or whoever ends up being the vet QB) ends up being the most consistent option by the start of September then it is what it is. You can't keep just having QB auditions through the entire regular season.

If it's midseason and the team looks dead in the water, can you start the auditions? Not that I think this will be the case, but I'm curious of your opinion.

 

[luuked]

I don't know which one of us is right, but I think finding a young QB on a cheap contract is so important that you keep doing live tryouts till you find one. I think one thing BB is good at is self-scouting. He just keeps trying different pieces till he sees what he wants to see on the field. No on knows Minshew is better than Winston till he gets the ball. Some people had Stidham higher than Daniel Jones on their draft boards. Some XFL dude may play better than either of them. All of it is theoretical till they show it on the field.

If it's midseason and the team looks dead in the water, can you start the auditions? Not that I think this will be the case, but I'm curious of your opinion.

The reason I say by the start of September is because you can't bring any young QBs in midseason and reasonably expect them to learn the offense and work on their own weaknesses.

Anyone that is not there for the install of the offense through camp will most probably not be a big part of the plan except for emergency situations.

The time to throw things against the wall will be OTAs, mini-camp and then camp. And all three might be cancelled / postponed due to COVID wrecking havoc for the next few months.

 

[Froob]

Reiss once again reiterates he believes Stidham is the guy. Bill must love Stidham.

 

[jah]

Reiss once again reiterates he believes Stidham is the guy. Bill must love Stidham.

I just don't take these reports about how much our staff love "our guys" seriously because I'm sure the moment we acquire a new player, the stories will change, even retroactively. We see these puff pieces and rumors every single year about every player on the 90 man roster. There's upside to every player, and there's nothing wrong with discussing and illustrating that upside, but we can't draw any further conclusions than that.

I do see some Jimmy G in Stidham and want him to get a fair shot at the competition. I just don't trust media reports about who our staff likes (which is just about everybody on the Patriots roster at any given moment) even a little bit. Of course the team is going to say the plan is to go with the only option on the roster right now, but it can and will change.

 

[DW Toys]

The reason I say by the start of September is because you can't bring any young QBs in midseason and reasonably expect them to learn the offense and work on their own weaknesses.

Anyone that is not there for the install of the offense through camp will most probably not be a big part of the plan except for emergency situations.

The time to throw things against the wall will be OTAs, mini-camp and then camp. And all three might be cancelled / postponed due to COVID wrecking havoc for the next few months.

Keep your eyes on Carr IMO. Gruden and Mayock are luke warm about him. He doesn't fit their philosophy. Why grab Mariota day one if Carr was your man? Carr was not a Mayock/Gruden pick.

How many times has BB used the phrase " He gives us the best chance to win" (See Brady vs. Bledsoe).

Thoughts for all Cousins. Does Derek Carr give the Patriots a better chance to win over an NFL 4 pass with one pick 6 Stidham?

Stats

2019
Carr Raiders
70.4 Completion
4,054 Yards
21 TDs
8 INT
100.8 QB Rating

2018
Carr Raiders
68.9 Completion
4,049 Yards
19 TD's
10 INT
93.9 QB Rating

Remember, his WR corp was as bad as ours.

The Raiders might be selling low after Mariota and perhaps a Draft pick.

How do we get to Carr?

The Raiders have two picks in Round one.
Herbert will be gone but they might go with Jordon Love. The better fit for the Gruden type disciple is Jacob Eason of the rocket arm big stong QB type.

He might spend a first rounder on Love, but the smart play for Gruden and Mayock is Eason and he has two picks in the third he can swap for a second. Now...... we are in play for Carr and it could cost us a pair of threes that Gruden just lost to move up to the second round.

Now do Gruden and Mayock have the cajones they trade picks #12 and #19 ( a trade value of 2075) to the Giants at #3 (1800) plus perhaps the Giants 3rd round pick #99 (#104) and go for Tua? Again Carr would be in play for us.

Using BB's words. Who gives us the best chance to win? Carr is only 28. He fits our offense better than the Raiders I believe.

Thoughts?
DW Toys

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Agree...White is much more valuable than McCaffrey. And this is why I was on the Gilmore DPOY bandwagon last year because I think a shutdown CB is generally vastly underrated (look at their salaries compared to edge rushers.)

In addition, I researched and noted that the Steelers from roughly 2016-17 were much better as an offense when they played without Le'Veon Bell (pretty big sample size), and I think this is likely true with most teams that doesn't fully utilize an effective passing offense and instead tries to jack up the rushing attempts in some confusing attempt to control the ball, when in fact they're just getting fewer first downs, scoring less points, and winning less games as a result.

But it's still fascinating that football history is filled with the perception that running backs are the stars and at least as valuable, if not more, than the quarterback. That's how the perception was when I was growing up.

I think part of the devaluation of running backs is due to the realization the passing game is better and part of it is because football has evolved to this concept over time,.

So did the Manning 2004 griping and rule changes play into this as well? QBs now throw for such few INTs compared to the old school days. The running back workhorse was partly built with the concept that throwing too much led to more turnovers, and the actual passing game results weren't as impressive back then.

Finally, I wonder if part of this evolution also has to do with the size of the players these days. Rules based on the LOS and formations did not adjust to the increased size and speed of o-linemen, d-linemen, and linebackers. Maybe it's just my old false perception, but it seems like getting big holes to run through was more common when guys weren't so darn athletic and huge.

Dis right here Icy Icy

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

PFT responses are really ripping Elway for signing Gordon.

If Broncos again have a losing record in 2020 will this be the end for Elway?

Will he have enough sense to walk away or will he wait to be fired?

 

[farn]

Reiss once again reiterates he believes Stidham is the guy. Bill must love Stidham.

Can’t see Hoyer, Dalton, or any of those vets leading this team to the SB. Even if Stidham ISN’T the long term option, I’m open to finding out.

 

[jah]

Keep your eyes on Carr IMO. Gruden and Mayock are luke warm about him. He doesn't fit their philosophy. Why grab Mariota day one if Carr was your man? Carr was not a Mayock/Gruden pick.

How many times has BB used the phrase " He gives us the best chance to win" (See Brady vs. Bledsoe).

Thoughts for all Cousins. Does Derek Carr give the Patriots a better chance to win over an NFL 4 pass with one pick 6 Stidham?

Stats

2019
Carr Raiders
70.4 Completion
4,054 Yards
21 TDs
8 INT
100.8 QB Rating

2018
Carr Raiders
68.9 Completion
4,049 Yards
19 TD's
10 INT
93.9 QB Rating

Remember, his WR corp was as bad as ours.

The Raiders might be selling low after Mariota and perhaps a Draft pick.

How do we get to Carr?

The Raiders have two picks in Round one.
Herbert will be gone but they might go with Jordon Love. The better fit for the Gruden type disciple is Jacob Eason of the rocket arm big stong QB type.

He might spend a first rounder on Love, but the smart play for Gruden and Mayock is Eason and he has two picks in the third he can swap for a second. Now...... we are in play for Carr and it could cost us a pair of threes that Gruden just lost to move up to the second round.

Now do Gruden and Mayock have the cajones they trade picks #12 and #19 ( a trade value of 2075) to the Giants at #3 (1800) plus perhaps the Giants 3rd round pick #99 (#104) and go for Tua? Again Carr would be in play for us.

Using BB's words. Who gives us the best chance to win? Carr is only 28. He fits our offense better than the Raiders I believe.

Thoughts?
DW Toys

What does Carr give us the best chance to win? Because it's definitely not going to be a Super Bowl.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Keep your eyes on Carr IMO. Gruden and Mayock are luke warm about him. He doesn't fit their philosophy. Why grab Mariota day one if Carr was your man? Carr was not a Mayock/Gruden pick.

How many times has BB used the phrase " He gives us the best chance to win" (See Brady vs. Bledsoe).

Thoughts for all Cousins. Does Derek Carr give the Patriots a better chance to win over an NFL 4 pass with one pick 6 Stidham?

Stats

2019
Carr Raiders
70.4 Completion
4,054 Yards
21 TDs
8 INT
100.8 QB Rating

2018
Carr Raiders
68.9 Completion
4,049 Yards
19 TD's
10 INT
93.9 QB Rating

Remember, his WR corp was as bad as ours.

The Raiders might be selling low after Mariota and perhaps a Draft pick.

How do we get to Carr?

The Raiders have two picks in Round one.
Herbert will be gone but they might go with Jordon Love. The better fit for the Gruden type disciple is Jacob Eason of the rocket arm big stong QB type.

He might spend a first rounder on Love, but the smart play for Gruden and Mayock is Eason and he has two picks in the third he can swap for a second. Now...... we are in play for Carr and it could cost us a pair of threes that Gruden just lost to move up to the second round.

Now do Gruden and Mayock have the cajones they trade picks #12 and #19 ( a trade value of 2075) to the Giants at #3 (1800) plus perhaps the Giants 3rd round pick #99 (#104) and go for Tua? Again Carr would be in play for us.

Using BB's words. Who gives us the best chance to win? Carr is only 28. He fits our offense better than the Raiders I believe.

Thoughts?
DW Toys

This is nitpicking but Love has more arm talent than Eason. Probably a stronger one too.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Dis right here Icy Icy

Asinine signing.

Funny thing is I'm starting to think fullbacks are more valuable than halfbacks.

The market certainly doesn't reflect it, but the supply and demand makes guys like Develin and Juszczyk worth spending some dollars on. There aren't a lot of talented fullbacks, and they allow teams to excel in critical short yardage situations. They also allow teams to have tremendous versatility.

 

[Deus Irae]

Dis right here Icy Icy

That was comedy well done.

 

[oceansizer]

 

[oceansizer]

 

[upstater1]

I don't know which one of us is right, but I think finding a young QB on a cheap contract is so important that you keep doing live tryouts till you find one. I think one thing BB is good at is self-scouting. He just keeps trying different pieces till he sees what he wants to see on the field. No on knows Minshew is better than Winston till he gets the ball. Some people had Stidham higher than Daniel Jones on their draft boards. Some XFL dude may play better than either of them. All of it is theoretical till they show it on the field.

But historically, you find good QBs in the first and second rounds. Russell Wilson and Dak Prescott are the exceptions.

Everyone else is a 1st rounder or Garoppolo in the 2nd.

Don't even bother trying to find another Brady in the 6th.

Looking back, teams screwed up royally by not taking Deshaun Watson when they should have. I bet everyone looks back on Watson and thinks, I don't want to let a guy like him go by again. As long as you don't draft EJ Manuel.