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Nate Solder and our LT conundrum


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I want to know what's the story on Garcia??

From Reiss
"Meanwhile, 2017 third-round draft choice Antonio Garcia has been out of practice with an undisclosed injury the past two weeks. He had been working with the third-unit offensive line before the injury and won't play Friday night."
 
When Gronk plays a pre season game and Solder doesn't, hummm I'm scratching my head.
Not sure why that is surprising, considering that Solder just hit the practice field for the first time only two days ago.
 
As an FYI, here are contract numbers for NFL left tackles (in addition to the article cited in the original post).

Note: you can use the drop down menus to change from 2017 to 2018, 2019, full length of contract, etc.

Left Tackle Contracts and Salaries | Over The Cap

Left Tackle Active Player Contracts | Spotrac

NFL Salary Rankings and Cap Hits - LT | Spotrac

Since his original rookie contract expired, Nate Solder's cap number has ranked 2nd among left tackles (in 2016, the first year of his extension) and now 5th in 2017.

Right now the 5th cap number for a LT in 2018 would be $13,950,000; 10th would be $11,400,000. For 2019 we are looking at $14,200,000 (5th) and $11,700,000 (10th). That should give us a benchmark of what it would cost to extend Solder - assuming of course that he even wants to continue playing beyond this season.


One important aspect to keep in mind: we already know that the salary cap is going to increase significantly over the next few years based on television contracts that have already been signed. We are looking at base salary caps along the lines of:
2015 -- $143,280,000
2016 -- $155,270,000
2017 -- $167,000,000
2018 -- $178,000,000
2019 -- $190,000,000

That is a significant consideration. What may appear to be an outrageous contract that does not make fiscal sense today, could actually represent the same (or even lower) portion of a team's cap a year or two from now.

Great post, very informative.

I would argue that Solder's value is increased considerably by the extreme difficulty of finding decent Left Tackles. To add a little more info, I pulled up a 2017 ranking of Left Tackles (yes, I know that is very arbitrary, but it is a start). The ranking of the top 12, along with the round they were drafted and their age is:

1) Tyron Smith, First Round Pick 9, Age 26
2) Joe Thomas, First Round Pick 3, Age 32
3) Jason Peters, Undrafted, Age 35
4) Trent Williams, First Round Pick 4, Age 29
5) Terron Armsted, Third Round Pick 75, Age 26
6) Andrew Whitworth, Second Round Pick 55, Age 35
7) David Bakhtiari, Fourth Round Pick 109, Age 25
8) Donald Penn, undrafted, Age 34
9) Duane Brown, First Round Pick 26, Age 31
10) Joe Staley, First Round Pick 28, Age 32
11) Russell Okung, First Round Pick 6, Age 29
12) Nate Solder, First Round Pick 17, Age 29

My interpretation of this chart is that Left Tackles largely require extremely high draft capital or a gigantic payout (just look at the $55M contract with $31M guaranteed given to Matt Kali, who really isn't a decent tackle). First let's throw out players that are near retirement as they clearly have less value: Jason Peters (Age 35), Andrew Whitworth (Age 35) and Donald Penn (Age 34).

Then of the remaining 9 top Left Tackles left on the list, only two outliers weren't drafted in the first Round (Terron Armsted and David Bakhtiri) and four of the nine were drafted in the top nine of the First Round.

I have long thought that the high cap hit of Nate Solder (second behind Brady) was no accident, because of the difficulty of obtaining decent Left Tackles via the draft or in free agency. If Solder could be convinced to return for a couple of years (or even longer) I think he would be well worth the money.

https://athlonsports.com/nfl/nfl-offensive-linemen-rankings
 
I know that some folks disagree. However, I believe that Solder's injury factors in to future contracts. IMHO, other teams will likely to take higher risks than Belichick.

Great post, very informative.

I would argue that Solder's value is increased considerably by the extreme difficulty of finding decent Left Tackles. To add a little more info, I pulled up a 2017 ranking of Left Tackles (yes, I know that is very arbitrary, but it is a start). The ranking of the top 12, along with the round they were drafted and their age is:

1) Tyron Smith, First Round Pick 9, Age 26
2) Joe Thomas, First Round Pick 3, Age 32
3) Jason Peters, Undrafted, Age 35
4) Trent Williams, First Round Pick 4, Age 29
5) Terron Armsted, Third Round Pick 75, Age 26
6) Andrew Whitworth, Second Round Pick 55, Age 35
7) David Bakhtiari, Fourth Round Pick 109, Age 25
8) Donald Penn, undrafted, Age 34
9) Duane Brown, First Round Pick 26, Age 31
10) Joe Staley, First Round Pick 28, Age 32
11) Russell Okung, First Round Pick 6, Age 29
12) Nate Solder, First Round Pick 17, Age 29

My interpretation of this chart is that Left Tackles largely require extremely high draft capital or a gigantic payout (just look at the $55M contract with $31M guaranteed given to Matt Kali, who really isn't a decent tackle). First let's throw out players that are near retirement as they clearly have less value: Jason Peters (Age 35), Andrew Whitworth (Age 35) and Donald Penn (Age 34).

Then of the remaining 9 top Left Tackles left on the list, only two outliers weren't drafted in the first Round (Terron Armsted and David Bakhtiri) and four of the nine were drafted in the top nine of the First Round.

I have long thought that the high cap hit of Nate Solder (second behind Brady) was no accident, because of the difficulty of obtaining decent Left Tackles via the draft or in free agency. If Solder could be convinced to return for a couple of years (or even longer) I think he would be well worth the money.

https://athlonsports.com/nfl/nfl-offensive-linemen-rankings
 
I know that some folks disagree. However, Ibeleive that Solder's injury actors in to future contracts. IMHO, other teams will likely to take higher risks than Belichick.

You could be right, I've been pretty stunned by some of the contracts handed out to mediocre and worse Left Tackles this off season. Perhaps Solder likes it here in New England. One can only hope.
 
Not sure why that is surprising, considering that Solder just hit the practice field for the first time only two days ago.

He wasn't on PUP, I think he was on the field at the start of training camp and then got sidelined for a while.
 
I want to know what's the story on Garcia??
You mean besides the fact that he's a 285 lb, small-school LT who built his rep against inferior competition and is now competing against grown men?
 
You mean besides the fact that he's a 285 lb, small-school LT who built his rep against inferior competition and is now competing against grown men?

Please tell us how you really feel. Don't hold back.
 
I feel even Solder's previous contract was a somewhat emergency move as BB was using huge draft resources rebuilding the D and for some time invested little draft capital on the O.

No way I see Billy forking over those big bucks for a 30+ yo mediocre lineman. He will look to draft, trade or sign a FA of some sort.
 
You mean besides the fact that he's a 285 lb, small-school LT who built his rep against inferior competition and is now competing against grown men?

I'm sure our training staff will have no issues bulking him up 15-20 lbs which would put him around 300 lbs.. that is plenty big enough to play LT, assuming he has the talent and good technique
 
I hope so, because the staff at Troy had a difficult (impossible?) time of getting him to, and keeping him at, the magical 300 #.

At that point of the draft, I might've just taken Dorian Johnson and cross-trained him at LT as well as LG.
 
You mean besides the fact that he's a 285 lb, small-school LT who built his rep against inferior competition and is now competing against grown men?


I can understand you don't like the guy or the pick for whatever the reason . but I don't understand why you need to go there..

The actual fact is that he was measured 302 at Combine and he built his rep against college champions Clemson as i'm sure you very well know (below a clip for reminder if needed). He was the only T who stopped one of the best pass rushers in college - Clelin Ferrell. He was one of the top OL at Senior Bowl "The top tackle prospect at the Senior Bowl practices was Antonio Garcia of Troy.“

As a Patriot some struggles were reported from minicamp but he seemed to bounce back nicely at the beginning of TC winning most 1v1 and playing LT w 2nd stringers in the first scrimmage.

Of all the rookies he was the guy I wanted to see most in preseason games . so I can certainly share some of your frustration . but no need to diminish the guy..

____
reminder from this boards thread on Garcia: Patriots draft Antonio Garcia OT @ No. 85

Antonio Garcia Troy OT • r/NFL_Draft

Moves his feet very quickly. Great Great hand usage. Has a nice snap down move that he uses on pass blocking and could use more on run blocking. Does a great job of displacing defenders in run blocking. Has good strength. Plays aggressive. Finishes all blocks.

Scouting Report: Antonio Garcia, OT, Troy 2017 NFL Draft

Elite pass protector that has been one of the better left tackles in college football. Perfect combination of size, length, and technique that should allow him to move into a starting role very early in his NFL career. Simply doesn’t allow defenders to get by him. Very nasty player that coaches will love to coach.
____


 
Taking someone from a smaller school is always a risk, because of the level of competition. Luckily these schools usually play some of the big time teams as a source of revenue. In the end, who do you think will play more snaps for the Pats, Garcia or the undrafted free agent 4 year starter from Georgia?
 
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