Is andy reid a top 10 coach of all time?

[reesebobby]

I was replying to someone that said reid has done nothing but have good players. All coaches that achieve have good players. And they all develop players. But its dumb to think andy reid couldn't have success with randy moss and Tom Brady. And of course your point raises the question on why didnt bill do a good job coaching the past couple years if winning is the result of good coaching.

It’s about achievements. For every “yeah but he had this advantage” there is a “but he had this disadvantage”
Part of coaching is teaching, and developing players as well as coaching to their strengths and weaknesses.
When you say “that coach had good players” I say of course he did because he did a good job coaching them.

 

[Ring 6]

I was replying to someone that said reid has done nothing but have good players. All coaches that achieve have good players. And they all develop players. But its dumb to think andy reid couldn't have success with randy moss and Tom Brady. And of course your point raises the question on why didnt bill do a good job coaching the past couple years if winning is the result of good coaching.

Now we are getting into the stupid part of the discussion.

Winning is a result of everything. Remove one piece and it changes the formula. You are talking about 32 teams In a system designed to promote parity. The best anything doesn’t win all the time. Coaches are limited by their players; players are limited by the coaching. Winning or not winning once doesn’t prove anything. Long term success does, and diminishing the long term success of anyone involved because of who they worked with is ignorant.
You achieve what you achieve and you don’t add to or subtract from that with coulda woulda shoulda.

 

[mosi]

He is. And his record without Brady is better than BB's record without Brady.

 

[mosi]

But in all honesty, I think he is. He has taken two teams, in each of the conferences, to four straight conference championship games. He has built two different programs with two completely different set of players. His coaching tree itself is pretty remarkable as well.

Someone had mentioned that ranking players and people is hard but rather had people in tiers. In the QB play, Brady is in a tier by himself with others clearly below. I personally think for coaches, I would not put anybody in the "Brady" league. Not even BB. Brown and Walsh changed the game. Gibbs won the SB with three different QB's. BB won with the greatest player in the history of the NFL. Brady has people thinking that Arians is a good coach for christ sake.

If I had to pick between BB and AR RIGHT NOW to build my 2-15 team, I would go with AR.

 

[Guts]

But in all honesty, I think he is. He has taken two teams, in each of the conferences, to four straight conference championship games. He has built two different programs with two completely different set of players. His coaching tree itself is pretty remarkable as well.

Someone had mentioned that ranking players and people is hard but rather had people in tiers. In the QB play, Brady is in a tier by himself with others clearly below. I personally think for coaches, I would not put anybody in the "Brady" league. Not even BB. Brown and Walsh changed the game. Gibbs won the SB with three different QB's. BB won with the greatest player in the history of the NFL. Brady has people thinking that Arians is a good coach for christ sake.

If I had to pick between BB and AR RIGHT NOW to build my 2-15 team, I would go with AR.

Nah...AR didn't win squat until he got Mahomeboy and a top 5 TE of all time and a generational weapon in Tyreek. BB brought us back to the playoffs with one mediocre season in between after the GOAT had left. Give me BB all day everyday.

 

[Ring 6]

I think the 3rd poll option should be changed from Ray Lewis killed a guy to Britt Reid maimed a little girl

 

[Ring 6]

But in all honesty, I think he is. He has taken two teams, in each of the conferences, to four straight conference championship games. He has built two different programs with two completely different set of players. His coaching tree itself is pretty remarkable as well.

Someone had mentioned that ranking players and people is hard but rather had people in tiers. In the QB play, Brady is in a tier by himself with others clearly below. I personally think for coaches, I would not put anybody in the "Brady" league. Not even BB. Brown and Walsh changed the game. Gibbs won the SB with three different QB's. BB won with the greatest player in the history of the NFL. Brady has people thinking that Arians is a good coach for christ sake.

If I had to pick between BB and AR RIGHT NOW to build my 2-15 team, I would go with AR.

Hahahahahahahahahahahaha

 

[stinkypete]

Reid is 5th all time in wins. He's 21st all time in win % (13th among coaches with 100 total games). 3rd in playoff games. 4th in playoff wins. Tied for 9th in conference championship appearances. As long as he keeps caching with Mahomes as his QB, he is likely to move up all of these lists.

Why are we arguing this? Anyone who denies his status among the all time greats is blinded by homerism. It's the same disease that impacts all the people to ignorant to give Peyton Manning his due.

 

[Gumby]

It’s about achievements. For every “yeah but he had this advantage” there is a “but he had this disadvantage”
Part of coaching is teaching, and developing players as well as coaching to their strengths and weaknesses.
When you say “that coach had good players” I say of course he did because he did a good job coaching them.

Yes I agree.

but then you need to analyze those coaches -players.

I see it that BB gets credit for credit for creating the Frankenstein QB (Tom Brady), developing guys like Stephen Neal, Jules, and many more UDFAs over the years.

In the few instances when he had any great-natural talent guys- (Moss/LT.), He didn’t really develop them (like with L Taylor; he kind of let him loose-moved him around the chessboard, but not sure about developed)
but anyway, The starting question was Andy Reid. I don’t see him as developing-building up a Mahomes. As someone else said, he doesn’t even know what he will do on any given play. And point to anyone else AR developed, innovations he started, in-game mgmt (probably his weakest trait), or significant action other than GM-Type talent acquisition. Which may or may not have been his authority/direction.

 

[mosi]

Nah...AR didn't win squat until he got Mahomeboy and a top 5 TE of all time and a generational weapon in Tyreek. BB brought us back to the playoffs with one mediocre season in between after the GOAT had left. Give me BB all day everyday.

He went to four straight NFC conference champion games and a SB with the Eagles. He took a team that was terrible and rebuilt it. He went 11-5 and 12-4 with Alex Smith with KC. He coaching tree has not only won but won SBs. He is a quality coach and at this moment, is doing a better job than BB.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

Absolutely.

He got to 5 championship games (Including one SB) with McNabb.

He got to the postseason four times with Alex Smith.

Now, McNabb & Smith aren't exactly bad QB's. They were good to very good. But I feel as though they benefited from him more than he benefited from either.

He's 1-2 In SB's. About to be 2-2 in a few weeks. (Obviously I'm counting on the Chiefs blowing out Cincy today).

I feel as though Reid has done more with less than most other coaches. Obviously that isn't the case anymore with Mahomes as his QB.

Reid never had that QB who could perform at an elite level at crucial times in games. He does now.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

My top 7:

Belichick
Halas
Lombardi
Walsh
Brown
Noll
Reid

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

My top 7:

Belichick
Halas
Lombardi
Walsh
Brown
Noll
Reid

Curly Lambeau - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Ring 6]

Yes I agree.

but then you need to analyze those coaches -players.

I see it that BB gets credit for credit for creating the Frankenstein QB (Tom Brady), developing guys like Stephen Neal, Jules, and many more UDFAs over the years.

In the few instances when he had any great-natural talent guys- (Moss/LT.), He didn’t really develop them (like with L Taylor; he kind of let him loose-moved him around the chessboard, but not sure about developed)
but anyway, The starting question was Andy Reid. I don’t see him as developing-building up a Mahomes. As someone else said, he doesn’t even know what he will do on any given play. And point to anyone else AR developed, innovations he started, in-game mgmt (probably his weakest trait), or significant action other than GM-Type talent acquisition. Which may or may not have been his authority/direction.

I don’t put value in all that subjective, opinion stuff. A coach has one job, win. There are many different ways to skin a cat. There are many different combinations of strengths and weakness.
The way to judge a coach is on results.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

Curly Lambeau - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Forgot him.

Damn it.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

I don’t put value in all that subjective, opinion stuff. A coach has one job, win. There are many different ways to skin a cat. There are many different combinations of strengths and weakness.
The way to judge a coach is on results.

Not all results are created equal.

Gibbs winning three titles with three average to good QB's is more impressive than Noll winning four with the best defense ever. And a top 10 QB ever.

Jmo.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Forgot him.

Damn it.

I think the top 7 are (chronological order) Halas, Lambeau, Brown, Lombardi, Noll, Walsh, Belichick. All are dynasty coaches and basically undisputed. I’d put Shula next at 8 because he did win three championships and was the winningest coach ever, even though he has flaws…his big game record was atrocious and he had Hall of Fame QBs for like 30 years. After that, there’s a lot of guys who could be 9-10.

Gibbs, Ewbank, Landry, Parcells, Shanahan, and Reid come to mind.

The thing with Reid is he’s the only one without multiple championships. Winning a second would do a lot for his legacy, and I think that puts him in the top 10. Without a second championship, though, he has a weaker argument than others.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

I think the top 7 are (chronological order) Halas, Lambeau, Brown, Lombardi, Noll, Walsh, Belichick. All are dynasty coaches and basically undisputed. I’d put Shula next at 8 because he did win three championships and was the winningest coach ever, even though he has flaws…his big game record was atrocious and he had Hall of Fame QBs for like 30 years. After that, there’s a lot of guys who could be 9-10.

Gibbs, Ewbank, Landry, Parcells, Shanahan, and Reid come to mind.

The thing with Reid is he’s the only one without multiple championships. Winning a second would do a lot for his legacy, and I think that puts him in the top 10.

I'm going by the assumption Big Red gets that 2nd SB this year.

Certainly he would have to be ahead of guys like Shanahan, Parcells, and Eubank at that point.

 

[Ring 6]

Not all results are created equal.

Gibbs winning three titles with three average to good QB's is more impressive than Noll winning four with the best defense ever. And a top 10 QB ever.

Jmo.

All results are created equal because the job is to win.
Coaching a football team isn’t being handed a madden game and calling plays.
Coaching a football team is about everything to do with that team. Noll had the best defense ever because of Noll. Gibbs ran through QBs because of Gibbs, but coached up the ones he has as part of his system.

 

[MahomestoKelce]

All results are created equal because the job is to win.
Coaching a football team isn’t being handed a madden game and calling plays.
Coaching a football team is about everything to do with that team. Noll had the best defense ever because of Noll. Gibbs ran through QBs because of Gibbs, but coached up the ones he has as part of his system.

Do you think Parcells is better than Reid?