Hoyer - How Long Does He Stay as a backup?

[Tyler.Durden]

Hoyer is valuable here as a backup.

You don't keep him around if Mallett is progressing, because many believe he is a starter+ quality talent. No point taking reps away from him if he is capable.

See what Hoyer is asking and keep him around, trade him when best deal comes up.

 

[supafly]

I think Hoyer is a viable backup for the NEP..because he knows the system, has Brady talking/communicating with him during meetings and preseason etc, and has great coaching.

But I don't think that Brian Hoyer is anything even close to what some here are projecting him to be.

Not to sound negative, but anyone thinking that Brian Hoyer is going to command a 2nd round draft pick has absolutely got to be kidding themselves...

WHO on earth would part with that kind of draft pick for a guy who no one has any idea about? There's no live game reps, no tape, no media hype (certainly a big part of it, unfortunately)...He is a huge unknown.

In my humble opinion, I truly would be totally shocked if any NFL team even gave him a 4th round pick.

 

[Gwedd]

I think Hoyer is a viable backup for the NEP..because he knows the system, has Brady talking/communicating with him during meetings and preseason etc, and has great coaching.

But I don't think that Brian Hoyer is anything even close to what some here are projecting him to be.

Not to sound negative, but anyone thinking that Brian Hoyer is going to command a 2nd round draft pick has absolutely got to be kidding themselves...

WHO on earth would part with that kind of draft pick for a guy who no one has any idea about? There's no live game reps, no tape, no media hype (certainly a big part of it, unfortunately)...He is a huge unknown.

In my humble opinion, I truly would be totally shocked if any NFL team even gave him a 4th round pick.

I can see the JETS going that route. Maybe even the Raiders. Tampa Bay maybe too.

I do, though, see New England keeping him for one more year, paying him decent money as a back up who knows the system and can help Mallet along.

 

[supafly]

I can see the JETS going that route. Maybe even the Raiders. Tampa Bay maybe too.

I do, though, see New England keeping him for one more year, paying him decent money as a back up who knows the system and can help Mallet along.

I don't know...

I suppose that you have a point in saying that there's always going to be someone who has him on their radar, even if it's an 'outside' radar; but I can't really see the NYJ deciding to forego their 60 million dollar QB without at least bringing in another high draft pick, or making a trade for a significant "name" QB. There's always bigger names out there, and NY is a big-name kind of town. Imagine the media reports and news coverage if the Jets suddenly dumped Sanchez for a backup QB who no one has even seen play??

I don't think Tampa dumps their QB either, as Josh Freeman is one of the up and coming young QB's on the rise. Just because the team was awful this year does not necessarily equal a change at QB from your young 'franchise' QB. I suppose anything's possible, but Josh Freeman was a fairly big name for young QB's just a few months ago. The thought of them dumping him for Brian Hoyer would stun an awful lot of people.

Oakland?? That seems like a big name QB team to me. Jason Campbell is still in the mix there, and now they have Carson Palmer. They used a 3rd rounder in the supplemental draft just this yr on Tyrelle Pryor!! The team just used their 1st, 3rd, and 4th round draft picks for April's draft on 3 different QB's.

I get what you're saying, that there will always be someone who's interested at some point, but there's no way in the world that they're parting with a high 2nd round pick like some have predicted. I think the whole Kevin Kolb thing made a lot of people feel as though teams would part with future high draft picks for backup QB's from now on, and that just isn't the case. Arizona could have just as easily taken their own franchise QB through the draft (and they still might this yr) had they just been patient enough. Now the entire NFL sees that a guy like John Skelton is much better equipped to run their team.

With guys like Matt Flynn from Green Bay, and John Skelton from Arizona, the rest of the NFL has at least gotten to see what they can do. Until (God forbid) Hoyer has to play a few games here, no one will be able to base any live game reps on anything...and that makes him a total unknown. If there's a GM that's willing to part with a 2nd round pick for a complete unknown, sight unseen QB after the Whitehurst and Kolb disasters, then I'd be very surprised.

 

[Gwedd]

With the JETS and Tampa Bay, I'm looking at Hoyer going in as their #2 guy, to maybe even push for the #1 spot. I would better dollars to donuts he could put the fear of God into Sanchez, because having been these years in New England, Hoyer will KNOW how to read a defense, do the check downs, look-offs, etc, that Sanchez seems to have problems with. Same for Freeman. Freeman might actually be pretty good in the future, but for now he's having some issues reading defenses too.

And heck, Oakland is part of the New England/Oakland trade highway anyway, so you just never know what's going to come down THAT pike on any given day.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Remember, Hoyer also played the second half vs. the Texans in 2009, his rookie season. The Texans wanted to win to get to 9-7 (and did, 27-34) He played pretty good then too.

8/12 71 yards 0 TDs 0 INTs, I remember him leading the comeback down the field but a 40 yard pass got called back, and then Edelman dropped one on him.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

When I think about a subject like this, I realize how much I don't know about how NFL thinking works.

How does another team evaluate Hoyer, based on his limited playing time? Is the fact that Belichick has such confidence in him that he continues to keep him as Tom Brady's backup enough to convince a GM or owner that Hoyer is worth a top draft pick and a big contract?

What should another team be willing to trade for Hoyer? When we consider that the Chiefs gave a very attractive second round pick (#34 overall) for a QB who'd gone 11-5 in his first year as a starter, but then had the Pats throw in Mike Vrabel to sweeten the deal, suggests that maybe a third round pick is the best that could be reasonably expected.

Where does Ryan Mallett figure in all of this? The CW when the Pats drafted him was that he was a real bargain in the third round at 74 and that Belichick would get him to clean up his act, coach him up to make him a credible NFL QB and then trade him for a second round pick. So, where does all that stand?

Other than saying that backing up an elite QB is risky business, career wise, I'm not sure what this says about the lot of these backups. Aaron Rodgers and Steve Young emerged from the shadows to greatness, but in both cases it took time and a lot of guys seem not to be able to do so.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Hoyer isn't going anywhere just yet. He's an RFA and they will tender him. Then it's up to Mallett to prove to the coaches that he can be a #2 here. Pending that it's likely we keep 3 QB's heading into the off season and TC, but if one isn't progressing he'd be the more likely to go. Hoyer seems like the consumate pro on the sidelines. Mallett looks like someone's kid with a sideline pass. Hoyer certainly earned a couple of extra situational brownie points in thoroughly limited opportunities with that one shot throw to Gronk before taking a knee. That was akin to catching the punt that Bill dangles for an off day for the entire team...

What will be really interesting is if Hoyer remains the #2 here in 2012 what that will bode for the following off season - including for Mallett. I'd imagine in that case Hoyer would garner UFA interest in 2013 from any team Josh is affiliated with and/or KC or Atlanta as a #2 even if he doesn't get much playing time here again. What BOB does going forward may impact that situation as well given he's the QB coach as well as OC. If he moves on Hoyer could be his guy as a starter or backup on a team he's retooling to run this offense. He and BOB share the same agent.

So at that point Bill would have some decisions to make including whether to overpay to retain Hoyer or draft another QB or bring in one he liked who didn't catch on elsewhere to push and compete with Mallett for the #2. Without any late round ammo it's unlikely he drafts a QB this off season although he could (and likely will) always bring in another UDFA or FA to enhance competition.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

BB trades Hoyer for those coveted 5th, 6th and 7th round picks he's missing this April.

I for one would pay the beast to back up TFB for another year while The Hammer learns the job.

 

[NEP4Life]

Hoyer is likely worth a mid-round pick at best. He'd be camp fodder on most NFL teams, possibly fighting for the starter's job, but more likely competing for the backup role.

Being the backup here, given his dearth of NFL snaps, would help him get his foot in the door, but that's about it.

Would be nice to see Mallett move up the depth chart here.

All IMHO of course.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

With the JETS and Tampa Bay, I'm looking at Hoyer going in as their #2 guy, to maybe even push for the #1 spot. I would better dollars to donuts he could put the fear of God into Sanchez, because having been these years in New England, Hoyer will KNOW how to read a defense, do the check downs, look-offs, etc, that Sanchez seems to have problems with. Same for Freeman. Freeman might actually be pretty good in the future, but for now he's having some issues reading defenses too.

And heck, Oakland is part of the New England/Oakland trade highway anyway, so you just never know what's going to come down THAT pike on any given day.

The JETS drafted McElroy late last year and unfortunately after looking good in camp he got injured. If he can stay healthy he could give Sanchez fits, not that he's all world or anything but he's poised and accurate and can read defenses and is more of a thinking man's game manager which if they opt to feature so-called JETS football (ground and pound and tough D) is what they really need at the position. If the braintrust in the swamp doesn't get the toxic mess they created turned around before next season commences, Sanchize could be toast heading toward his contract year and McElroy could emerge from the ashes...

 

[VJCPatriot]

Hoyer is valuable as the NEP's backup. And several members of the media have been bragging him off and on. They probably get that from sources around the league.

But with bad teams drafting QBs early and often, how much can they get for him ? If it's less than a 2nd (which I'd tend to think is the case) I'd say keep him. I am pretty certain they can limit his movement for next season...

One dude who'd command a HUGE ransom ? The GB QB. Wow. That's the guy I see moving - ahead of Hoyer by a long shot (in terms of what he'd fetch).

Yeah Flynn had a huge game. Hoyer is still under the radar. If he will stay for reasonable dollars, I think NE will keep Hoyer around. Mallet has higher upside though.

 

[SONS_OF_BELICHICK]

I think Hoyer is going to be around 1 more year before they trade him....you need to turnover players once they are ripe...and give mallet a chance. two years should be a decent amount ..to get mallet's feet wet....

 

[Snake Eyes]

He is very accurate and has very good poise back there, but he does not have a strong arm and he is slight of stature. Not sure he can take the pounding.

He's 6'2, 215lbs. For some perspective Joe Montana was 6'2, 205lbs.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I think Hoyer is going to be around 1 more year before they trade him....you need to turnover players once they are ripe...and give mallet a chance. two years should be a decent amount ..to get mallet's feet wet....

In one more year they won't be able to trade him unless they franchise him...which isn't likely to happen again.

And what Mallet is remains to be seen, he's got some skills but they don't appear to remotely mirror Brady's which doesn't bode well for him as a backup let alone starter here. I think he was taken as a potential trading chip, but he's going to have to find a way to showcase himself in limited opportunities absent the kind of setting that might have better suited his skillset. I don't see Brady departing here in the forseeable future barring the unthinkable. I fully expect his contract to be extended after next season for at least a couple of more taking him thru 2016, although the changes to the franchise tag calculation under the new CBA could also make tagging him a couple of times a practical transition to his ultimate retirement as the ultimate Patriot.

 

[patchick]

As others have noted, the Patriots control Hoyer's rights for 2012 as an RFA, and he'll be a UFA in 2013.

What little I've seen of him in camp and exhibitions has certainly impressed me, and of course the fact that BB was willing to go with him as the sole backup is high praise. Realistically, though, Cassel was not only more proven, but fully looked the part. Hoyer doesn't have a prototype frame, a rocket arm, a big college reputation, or any significant game film. He's not likely to make many OC's get starry eyed.

IMO the only way another team comes after him hard is if they have a recent Patriots coach on staff who advocates for him based on personal experience. I expect to see him around next year, barring a huge Mallett surge. (Come to think of it, I'd say the Patriots' 3rd QB has more trade value than their #2. How often do you see that?)

 

[Deus Irae]

It probably depends on the Hoyer v. Mallet comparison in the minds of BB and BOB.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Sirius NFL radio Rich Gannon & Adam Schien speculating on how long it would take a 2012 rookie drafted QB to adapt to the Colts' sight adjust system. their conclusion - four (4) years and that's with a severely restricted offensive playbook.

Hasn't Hoyer shown us in camp and pre-season that he has if not mastered this offense he's been able to execute it with calm competence?

Clearly, the Patriots have a different core competence model for their QBs and WRs.

 

[Deus Irae]

Sirius NFL radio Rich Gannon & Adam Schien speculating on how long it would take a 2012 rookie drafted QB to adapt to the Colts' sight adjust system. their conclusion - four (4) years and that's with a severely restricted offensive playbook.

Hasn't Hoyer shown us in camp and pre-season that he has if not mastered this offense he's been able to execute it with calm competence?

Clearly, the Patriots have a different core competence model for their QBs and WRs.

Rich & Adam are lying their asses off.

 

[Dessalines]

For a lot of PATS fans have the same attitude towards Hoyer that they have towards Green Ellis. Not a guy with a big school college pedigree, so they want someone else. I don't. The man has potential and I'd like him to continue to back Brady up. However shouldn't he get a shot to play somewhere? That said, I hope we keep him, I like him and he can play for sure.