Game manager instead of Franchise QB till we find our Mahomes

[venecol]

People go gaga over the QBs. Even the highest rated ones aren’t winning. Herbert does nothing but (1) not make the playoffs or (2) lose asap in the playoffs. Allen - the chosen one - is one of the very reasons Buffalo is out. Too many TOs this year.

Mahomes is VG. He’s got one SB and if he doesn’t win this year, he’ll be 30 with one SB….

“Waiting for our Mahomes” ? That might indeed be after we are all gone. Or never. And even IF they get a Mahomes - it might be one more SB…

So you believe we should sign Andy Dalton this offseason? He's available you know.

 

[farn]

So you believe we should sign Andy Dalton this offseason? He's available you know.

Umm. No, I’m saying “waiting for your mahomes” is illogical. If you are lucky enough to find a franchise QB, great. But they are few and far between. In the meantime - shore up all holes if you can and find a competent QB. It’s worked for SF and Philly this year so far.

 

[crawhammer]

People go gaga over the QBs. Even the highest rated ones aren’t winning. Herbert does nothing but (1) not make the playoffs or (2) lose asap in the playoffs. Allen - the chosen one - is one of the very reasons Buffalo is out. Too many TOs this year.

Mahomes is VG. He’s got one SB and if he doesn’t win this year, he’ll be 30 with one SB….

“Waiting for our Mahomes” ? That might indeed be after we are all gone. Or never. And even IF they get a Mahomes - it might be one more SB…

Mahomes is 27. So if doesn't win a SB this year then he'll be 27 with one SB. Allen, Burrow and Herbert are younger. Herbert's only 24. These guys are going to obviously knock each other off repeatedly in the playoffs but collectively they're very likely to win multiple more SB's.

Allen is way too talented to drop out of the top tier of QBs anytime soon. He's got to clean up the turnovers but that team ended up having many issues... Gab Davis was a dud WR2, no legitimate RBs, and the defense crumbled with key injuries. Buffalo will continue to win the division but yes Allen will have to match the lofty expectations of his talent to get them to a Super Bowl.

 

[Toofy]

Agree. You can't fault the last GM for signing Carr to a top-tier contract since there wasn't a good alternative in the wings and letting him go means you have nothing, yet everyone knows he wasn't/isn't a top-tier guy. Also, now you can't fault the current GM for dumping Carr and eating the huge salary cap hit, since he isn't making the team any better.

Carr has no cap hit. The raiders GM is a genius. Zero dead cap...

 

[Toofy]

Umm. No, I’m saying “waiting for your mahomes” is illogical. If you are lucky enough to find a franchise QB, great. But they are few and far between. In the meantime - shore up all holes if you can and find a competent QB. It’s worked for SF and Philly this year so far.

I feel you misunderstood me. I am saying just geta. Decent game manager and do not overpay for QB unless you land the pats version of Mahomes which may or may not happen. I am essentially saying the same thing as you follow 49ers model . Better chances of success there than signing a mid rung qb to 35 or 40 million.

 

[Rob0729]

Five QBs went in the first 15 picks in 2021 and exactly one of them looks to be franchise QB potential thus far. One looks like a complete bust. Another is a complete unknown. Two others are hard to tell what they are because of their situations.


Yet, people think the Pats can just draft a franchise QB like it is an easy thing. The fact is that the Pats could go decades before they get another top 5 QB. That is why giving up on Jones so quickly could be a big mistake.

 

[venecol]

 

[Toofy]

Five QBs went in the first 15 picks in 2021 and exactly one of them looks to be franchise QB potential thus far. One looks like a complete bust. Another is a complete unknown. Two others are hard to tell what they are because of their situations.


Yet, people think the Pats can just draft a franchise QB like it is an easy thing. The fact is that the Pats could go decades before they get another top 5 QB. That is why giving up on Jones so quickly could be a big mistake.

Agree.. maximize Mac rookie contract and possibly 5th year on 1 year prove it deal. build team around your QBs strength and minimize weakness..

For Mac get him solid Offensive line and intelligent route runners and 1 solid contested catch receiver , he will do wonders. And safety valve in Rham and Montgomery should elevate him.

 

[venecol]

Raiders should sign Rodgers after freeing up $30M of Carr's contract. He'll be reunited w/ Adams & w/ Renfro, Waller & Jacobs, they should be able to compete w/ the Chefs.

 

[40yrpatsfan]

Of the last 10 SB’s, 4 were won by non-elite QB’s:

• - Philly with backup Nick Foles in 2018
• - Denver with a washed up Peyton and a great D in 2016
• - Baltimore with a good/not great Joe Flacco in 2013
• - Rams with a good/not great Matt Stafford in 2022

In the prior decade, Tampa won with Brad Johnson, and 2 each were won by Eli & Ben who were good/not great. So that’s 25-50% of the last 20 SB’s won by non-elite QB’s.

 

[crawhammer]

Raiders should sign Rodgers after freeing up $30M of Carr's contract. He'll be reunited w/ Adams & w/ Renfro, Waller & Jacobs, they should be able to compete w/ the Chefs.

Not in the playoffs. Rodgers even started his gagging this season before the playoffs.

 

[Toofy]

Brady took discounted deals which allowed team to be competitive for extended period . So we should remove Brady also from the list not because he is not elite but because he allowed pats and bucs to minimize QB salary impact on overall salary cap. None of other QBs are doing that and getting paid over 40 million constraining teams . So if we remove Brady ,then 80 % would be won by game managers or above average QB.

 

[crawhammer]

- Philly with backup Nick Foles in 2018

A backup who had a passer rating of 115.7 in the postseason and 373 passing yards in the Super Bowl (which he won with a major assist from the opposing head coach).

- Baltimore with a good/not great Joe Flacco in 2013

Flacco went berserk in that postseason (11 TDs & 0 INTs).

2 each were won by Eli

Unfortunately Eli was outstanding in those two postseasons (combined 15 TDs, 2 INTs, 4 fourth quarter comebacks & 5 game-winning drives in 8 games).

I don't think you're diminishing the value of the quarterback with these examples.

 

[Boomer B]

Of the last 10 SB’s, 4 were won by non-elite QB’s:

• - Philly with backup Nick Foles in 2018
• - Denver with a washed up Peyton and a great D in 2016
• - Baltimore with a good/not great Joe Flacco in 2013
• - Rams with a good/not great Matt Stafford in 2022

In the prior decade, Tampa won with Brad Johnson, and 2 each were won by Eli & Ben who were good/not great. So that’s 25-50% of the last 20 SB’s won by non-elite QB’s.

Ben is a HOF QB

 

[40yrpatsfan]

A backup who had a passer rating of 115.7 in the postseason and 373 passing yards in the Super Bowl (which he won with a major assist from the opposing head coach).


Flacco went berserk in that postseason (11 TDs & 0 INTs).


Unfortunately Eli was outstanding in those two postseasons (combined 15 TDs, 2 INTs, 4 fourth quarter comebacks & 5 game-winning drives in 8 games).

I don't think you're diminishing the value of the quarterback with these examples.

Yes they played very well for a brief period, but that's the point. Mac can play very well for a brief period too.

 

[40yrpatsfan]

Ben is a HOF QB

Ben may become a HOF QB, and was borderline great for a few seasons, but to me not an all time elite/great QB. But even if you count him that way, there's still 7 of the past 20 seasons where fairly average QB's won the Lombardi.

 

[Boomer B]

Ben may become a HOF QB, and was borderline great for a few seasons, but to me not an all time elite/great QB. But even if you count him that way, there's still 7 of the past 20 seasons where fairly average QB's won the Lombardi.

Sure, if you have the best defense of your era you may be able to get a SB win (Bears, Bucs, Ravens, Broncos) but if you want continued success you need the QB. Ben won't go down as one of the best of all time, but he's a definite HOFer and he could put the team on his shoulders and win them games.

 

[venecol]

Brady took discounted deals which allowed team to be competitive for extended period . So we should remove Brady also from the list not because he is not elite but because he allowed pats and bucs to minimize QB salary impact on overall salary cap. None of other QBs are doing that and getting paid over 40 million constraining teams . So if we remove Brady ,then 80 % would be won by game managers or above average QB.

We should sign Andy Dalton then. He's available and meets your criteria.

 

[Toofy]

We should sign Andy Dalton then. He's available and meets your criteria.

I am okay with Mac..I don't see difference between Mac, Dalton, cousin, tannehill, Watson, Dak and carr

 

[venecol]

I am okay with Mac..I don't see difference between Mac, Dalton, cousin, tannehill, Watson, Dak and carr

Aside from all them being better than Mac, there isn't much of a difference. Well Dak & Watson are black, so that's another difference.