Falcons open to trading the number 4 pick.

[Bourne Again Christian]

Agree and the Pats probably put too much stock in the 3-cone but DK’s number was historically bad for a WR, especially one who ran a sub 4.4 with a 40 inch vertical. I’m just saying that it probably contributed to his fall to 64..

Spot on I remember the whole board was calling him a one trick receiver after that 3 cone and mocking him.
There was a few posters banging the table for Brown most wanted Samuel.
I thought Samuel was more of a gadget player like a CP.
I didn’t think he could Develop into a sharp route runner.
I liked Isabella in that draft like many here.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Unfortunately for you, I have receipts too.
View attachment 32058

I agree about Manxman, and you seemed to agree with his point here in the “What you would have done?” thread.


View attachment 32059
So you considered Metcalf at top 15 pick and a “blatantly obvious” choice over Harry at 32 but you would have traded up two picks for Andy Isabella, with DK still available?

View attachment 32060

Nope, Now your just being silly. Lot more played into than just that. The fact that 59 picks were made before Metcalf can immediately sour your thoughts on a player a couple of days after the draft. You start to question why so many passed on him. Not to mention his little tirade with Carrol after being drafted which was a big turn off.

Yeah, was a fan of Isabella too. His game against Georgia was off the charts good. Congrats on your receipts.

 

[Ivan]

Is it worth trading up for a 50-50 chance at a top 10 quarterback. You say only if the team is completely sold on the player. Well, there is likely only one quarterback in that category, and that is likely to be the case every year.

So, it seems that you want to trade for those other have chosen and rejected and hope to win with them. I suppose this is a reasonable approach. Cam is one arrow; now trade for another one.

I suppose that this is a possible strategy. I would think that we might have signed Trubisky or one of the others (instead of Cam). In any case, perhaps, we have Jimmy or Bridgewater in mind. The problem with this strategy is that we don't ever have the chance at the successful QB picked at the top of the drafted. We choose from those who have failed with the team that drafted them. We won't ever have the one that succeeded.

I disagree with this. You are talking about the top rated QB, I’m talking about their own scouting reports. Generic scouting reports and mocks are largely based upon obvious talent, but when it comes to quarterbacks I would want much more information on who they are, what their athletic mentality is like, what their desire and work ethic is, and how they are as leaders. We did not have that information, they do, and they could see Davis Mills as a better choice than Mac Iones or Trey Lance based upon those qualities, or they could see Fields as better than all of them potentially, I have no idea, but I want winner at QB, and to this day one of my biggest questions about Newton is that desire. And as unfair as it might be the play in the SB where he didn’t go after the fumble has always called to me to question him. Patrick Mahomes is a winner, if any player fbthese guys have that then I’m a for the move up, if they don’t, but are “ great athletes” then I don’t

 

[Patriot Missile]

Spot on I remember the whole board was calling him a one trick receiver after that 3 cone and mocking him.
There was a few posters banging the table for Brown most wanted Samuel.
I thought Samuel was more of a gadget player like a CP.
I didn’t think he could Develop into a sharp route runner.
I liked Isabella in that draft like many here.

Right, thats the koolaid I drank at the time was the route tree and neck injury about why they passed on him.

Samuel kind of is a gadget player still and has shown sone injury concerns.

Got onboard with Harry because they made him the pick and was hoping for the best. Still am. Tbh, don’t follow too many pac 10 schools but that one writers hype article on him was amazing.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Agree and the Pats probably put too much stock in the 3-cone but DK’s number was historically bad for a WR, especially one who ran a sub 4.4 with a 40 inch vertical. I’m just saying that it probably contributed to his fall to 64..

True, the Pats have had some succes with that metric when it comes to slot. I’m sure without looking Edelman and Branch were probably in the 6’s. Suprisingly at cb Jonathan Jones came in at 7.25 at the cb position but ended up doing really well for himself despite that.

I may look into bigger receivers and see how they did compared to their smaller peers at 3 cone. Julio Jones has got to be the most incredible wr to ever be recorded. His 3 cone was off the charts along with everything else considering his size. Tried looking up Calvin Johnson but he didnt run it.

 

[captain stone]

We aren’t winning without a top qb. We have to do whatever it takes to get one.

Do you mean a current top-performing NFL QB, or a top-ranked college QB in the 2021 draft, the Worst Year Ever to evaluate college QBs?

Because if the answer's the former, then I agree...If the answer's the latter...then not so much...

 

[captain stone]

Agree and the Pats probably put too much stock in the 3-cone but DK’s number was historically bad for a WR, especially one who ran a sub 4.4 with a 40 inch vertical. I’m just saying that it probably contributed to his fall to 64..

He did improve on both his shuttle & 3-cone times at his pro day, though not by enough to keep his late 1st-/early 2nd-round hopes alive:

*D.K. Metcalf - WR - Mississippi - 2019 Draft Scout/NCAA College Football

*D.K. Metcalf - WR - Mississippi - 2019 Draft Scout/NCAA College Football

draftscout.com

 

[Ring 6]

Do you mean a current top-performing NFL QB, or a top-ranked college QB in the 2021 draft, the Worst Year Ever to evaluate college QBs?

Because if the answer's the former, then I agree...If the answer's the latter...then not so much...

The answer is we need a qb and there appears to be no other way to get one than the draft.

 

[Patriot Missile]

The answer is we need a qb and there appears to be no other way to get one than the draft.

Without having to go back and look at your posts. You seem to be Fields biggest fan and biggest supporter on this board. In your opinion, since you’ve watched every game of his. What is his ceiling? What would the Patriots have to run to make him succesfull here? It’s not uncommon for college qb’s to hit their first read, what do you say to the people that claim he can’t check down to his 2nd, 3rd and 4th? I’d like to see your big write up on him. Don’t think a lot of Pats fans know where to begin on armchair scouting qb’s because frankly, we havent had to for 20 years. I do find him to be an intriguing prospect. Especially after the pro day he just had with the 4.4 speed.

 

[Deus Irae]

Don’t necessarily need a top QB (Eli Manning isn’t a top QB and he has 2 rings) but a good one. Which we have to assume Cam isn’t anymore, at least until proven otherwise.

Eli caught lightning in a bottle about 6 years apart. Yes, it's true that you don't need a top QB to win a SB. But, if you look at the history, you need a top QB to be a consistent challenger for the Lombardi.

 

[1960Pats]

The gift that keeps on giving.

“...fullback...”

“OHHHHH NOOOOOOO!!!”

The best part of the jete drafts is that many of the busts they took came after they gave up a lot to move up. And the choice of the biggest bust of them all, Vernon Gholston, was cheered.

My favorite moment of all was when they passed on Dan Marino which caused the fans to boo. That's when one of their fans said, "apparently the jets know something that these people don't."

The New York Jete... the gift that keeps on giving.

 

[1960Pats]

My point was that 3 games doesn't determine actual value. It can certainly determine sentimental value.


And, in the case of Eli, it's going to be 8 games that take an average QB and get him elected into the HOF. And, when that happens, remember that this

View attachment 31999

View attachment 32000

and playing in New York, Got a career .500 QB (236-234) into the Hall Of Fame.

This is one reason why the HOF is a joke.

 

[PP2]

It makes ZERO difference how a qb is rated in this draft by pundits and media. It only matters how the pats rate them. If they love any of the qbs and they are available, try to trade up for them if they do not love them hit the ignore button

My bet is still on us picking the backup QB of East Gotham University.

 

[Ollie]

The answer is we need a qb and there appears to be no other way to get one than the draft.

There were 22 first round qbs drafted between 2009 - 2016. Not a single one of them is still with the original team that drafted them.

No QBs drafted in first round from 2009-16 are set to be on original team in 2021

There were 22 quarterbacks drafted in the first round between the 2009 and 2016 seasons and all of them came with hopes that they'd lead their teams for years to come.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

 

[jah]

There were 22 first round qbs drafted between 2009 - 2016. Not a single one of them is still with the original team that drafted them.

No QBs drafted in first round from 2009-16 are set to be on original team in 2021

There were 22 quarterbacks drafted in the first round between the 2009 and 2016 seasons and all of them came with hopes that they'd lead their teams for years to come.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

It seems like there was a huge QB drought for a while (or the ones that were good like Luck and RG3 had their careers ruined by external factors). If you look at the current "elite" QBs, they're all either extremely old or extremely young, with Russell Wilson being maybe the only exception (and he was not a first round pick, though in this post-Kyler Murray world he probably would be now).

Not sure if that means it's not a good idea to take a first round QB considering recent drafts have seen more success stories. There's a reason the cutoff was 2016 in your stat.

It does mean we have to be very careful in identifying potential busts because chances are that the *majority* of these QB prospects won't pan out.

 

[Sicilian]

There were 22 first round qbs drafted between 2009 - 2016. Not a single one of them is still with the original team that drafted them.

No QBs drafted in first round from 2009-16 are set to be on original team in 2021

There were 22 quarterbacks drafted in the first round between the 2009 and 2016 seasons and all of them came with hopes that they'd lead their teams for years to come.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

Going back too far skews this data I think. It's just the nature of the NFL that a player isn't going to be on the same team for 10+ years. What that data DOES show though, is that a lot of garbage QB's get taken in the first round. 2011 had Cam Newton and then a whole lot of yikes.

 

[40yrpatsfan]

There were 22 first round qbs drafted between 2009 - 2016. Not a single one of them is still with the original team that drafted them.

No QBs drafted in first round from 2009-16 are set to be on original team in 2021

There were 22 quarterbacks drafted in the first round between the 2009 and 2016 seasons and all of them came with hopes that they'd lead their teams for years to come.

profootballtalk.nbcsports.com

I'd say the main reason that high 1st round QB's don't stick is the instability of the franchise. The bottom dwellers don't have a good team, don't know how to build a good team, don't make the right pick, and/or mismanage the QB's career.

The ideal scenario is when you have a team like SF or NE, good organizations that have 1 rough year or make a trade so that they're picking near the top 1 time, and in a year like this when there are multiple promising prospects.

If we can't make a deal for one of these guys, maybe we can trade down with the Jags to #25 or 33, and get a 2022 1st for it. Then next year we'd have two 1sts, including one that should be a top 8 pick (Jags have a tough schedule). And get a top QB next year.

 

[Lansdowne]

I'd say the main reason that high 1st round QB's don't stick is the instability of the franchise. The bottom dwellers don't have a good team, don't know how to build a good team, don't make the right pick, and/or mismanage the QB's career.

The ideal scenario is when you have a team like SF or NE, good organizations that have 1 rough year or make a trade so that they're picking near the top 1 time, and in a year like this when there are multiple promising prospects.

If we can't make a deal for one of these guys, maybe we can trade down with the Jags to #25 or 33, and get a 2022 1st for it. Then next year we'd have two 1sts, including one that should be a top 8 pick (Jags have a tough schedule). And get a top QB next year.

The Steelers were a prime example of this. They just came off back to back division winning seasons, but then 2003 happened and they could no longer get away with having Tommy Maddox at QB. Picked 11th in the 2004 draft and that’s when Ben Roethlisberger fell to them as the third QB taken. All three of those QB’s had successful careers with Roethlisberger’s being the best of them all. 11th overall pick. The next, and only, time the Steelers would draft that high again came 15 years later in the 2019 draft, when they took Devin Bush with the 10th overall pick, and that’s only because they managed to trade up from their original spot at 20th overall.

 

[moosekill]

Eli caught lightning in a bottle about 6 years apart. Yes, it's true that you don't need a top QB to win a SB. But, if you look at the history, you need a top QB to be a consistent challenger for the Lombardi.

How many teams, other than the Patriots, have consistently been a challenger for the Lombardi?

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Pats and Niners are the only team attending Fields' 2nd pro day...