Coronavirus RESPECTFUL Discussion Only! (Mod edit: Closed)

[Nunchucks]

You should leave it at that because you’ll get absolutely smoked otherwise. My race is a prerequisite for determining if what I said is “racist.” By definition, there needs to be a belief in there that my race is superior. So it’s not surprising that you misused the term. You don’t even know what it means.

You should read a book or two, you are way out of your depth when it comes to studying this issue.

 

[Nunchucks]

Good for you. I’m glad the Yaris has that functionality now.

You are really hurting my feelings now. Lol

First you insult my likeness, then call me a coward, and then make fun of my choice in car...what's up with all the hate

Denial provokes strong emotions

 

[Adam Seward]

Actually you have been lied to, see this OpEd in the Washington Post from the person who headed that section:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opin...-didnt-dissolve-its-pandemic-response-office/

Now ask the question, what sort of political hack would tell a lie to politicize this sort of thing. Perhaps they remember R. Emmanuel's advice " Never Let a Crisis Go to Waste.

Pretty crazy, a former Trump advisor defending him in an OpEd.

Here is a bipartisan panel, with medical and industry experts, headlining for a restoration of leadership in that exact department.

Ending the Cycle of Crisis and Complacency in U.S. Global Health Security
https://csis-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/...191122_EndingTheCycle_GHSC_WEB_FULL_11.22.pdf

In the fall of 2016, in the aftermath of the slow, uncoordinated, and resource-intensive response to the Ebola crisis in West Africa, the White House NSC staff created the Global Health Security and Biodefense directorate. Designed to plan for and oversee rapid, efficient, government-wide responses to global health security threats, the directorate pooled NSC staff focused on domestic and international biodefense and health security issues. Led by a senior director, the directorate reported to the national security advisor and the deputy homeland security advisor, the latter of whom was designated as the lead for coordinating the U.S. response to a biological crisis. The White House also released a companion executive order in November 2016 advancing the GHSA. In the spring of 2018, the administration dissolved the NSC directorate for Global Health Security and Biodefense, and oversight of these issues was incorporated into the directorate for Weapons of Mass Destruction and Biodefense. In the fall of 2018, the White House released a National Biodefense Strategy designed to strengthen the country’s defenses against biological threats to health and safety. President Trump also signed a National Security Presidential Memorandum on Support for National Biodefense, which reaffirmed U.S. support for the GHSA, extending through 2024, and established a Biodefense Steering Committee chaired by the secretary of Health and Human Services and responsible for the monitoring, coordination, and implementation of the strategy. In May 2019, the White House released a Global Health Security Strategy, the first of its kind, which “defines the actions the Administration will take to prevent, detect, and respond to infectious disease threats, whether naturally occurring, accidental, or deliberate,” and which reiterated the administration’s support for the GHSA. The administration should be commended for advances in the national biodefense and global health security strategies.

However, critical leadership gaps remain. It remains unclear who would be in charge at the White House in the case of a grave pandemic threat or cross-border biological crisis, whether natural, accidental, or deliberate. Over the past year, the sluggish White House response to the Ebola outbreak in the DRC is but the latest example of this problem. And while the Biodefense Steering Committee plays an important role in implementing the National Biodefense Strategy, senior leadership in the White House is required to successfully coordinate the large number of government agencies and programs across health, security, development, and defense, as well as private-sector actors that would be involved in a response to an international public health threat. In the case of a health security emergency, White House leadership will also be critical in navigating challenging political issues like quarantines and travel bans and in communicating to and reassuring the American public. The authorities currently in place at HHS are insufficient to address these critical, complex, and often urgent interagency demands.In addition to coordinating the interagency process, a global health security and biodefense directorate at the NSC can reform fragmented programs and ensure higher efficiencies, strengthened accountability, and better spending of scarce resources. Together with the Office of Management and Budget (OMB), it can identify, rationalize, and align funding in the U.S. president’s budget across agencies.

Its almost like those who knew what something like this would take, saw we didnt have what it would take.

 

[venecol]

I didn’t have to lay them off. I had to fire them. And I’m fine with a quick loan to people to pay their bills. But that wouldn’t happen. They’ll spend it, there will be a short stimulus that will positively affect the market, then what? We’re right back where we are. The same people are still going to be facing eviction because they wasted the money. Then you have to do it again. And again. And again. I’m not much for the slippery slope fallacy, but if you’re going to hand over taxpayer dollars under the guise of helping people pay their bills, then pay their bills for them. If they want to spend on consumer goods, they need to do it with their own disposable income. If they don’t have any, welp... that sucks. At least they’ll have room, board, lights, and food to sustain them until this passes.

So you believe that people that are now working in the service industry that temporarily lose their jobs over government shut downs will not pay their rent and bills with money they receive to replace the income they were going to receive by working, but instead will go out and spend it on something else (aside from food)?

What exactly is your basis for this theory because it makes no sense.

 

[Kontradiction]

You should read a book or two, you are way out of your depth when it comes to studying this issue.

So take me on, then. Should be easy work for you, right? Just to note, you’re disagreeing with an actual dictionary definition. There’s no indication of a belief of racial superiority. If you disagree with that, you’re welcome to research the definition yourself.

 

[Kontradiction]

So you believe that people that are now working in the service industry that temporarily lose their jobs over government shut downs will not pay their rent and bills with money they receive to replace the income they were going to receive by working, but instead will go out and spend it on something else (aside from food)?

What exactly is your basis for this theory because it makes no sense.

The general economic state of the United States. Start with our level of credit card debt and work your way back from there.

 

[Nunchucks]

So take me on, then. Should be easy work for you, right? Just to note, you’re disagreeing with an actual dictionary definition. There’s no indication of a belief of racial superiority. If you disagree with that, you’re welcome to research the definition yourself.

Lol, internet trolling is for people without children or work to do. So sorry. Go pick a fight with somebody who is less busy. I already spent more time on this than I should have...a throw back to my younger and more impetuous days I suppose...lol cheers

 

[JetFan79]

So take me on, then. Should be easy work for you, right? Just to note, you’re disagreeing with an actual dictionary definition. There’s no indication of a belief of racial superiority. If you disagree with that, you’re welcome to research the definition yourself.

You know Kon is sitting in front of his computer rocking out to this song right now...

 

[NashuaPats]

I thought this was entertaining and worth posting for a laugh.

 

[Deus Irae]

Do your children ever wish they had a father?

What are you soying?

 

[primetime]

I didn’t have to lay them off. I had to fire them. And I’m fine with a quick loan to people to pay their bills. But that wouldn’t happen. They’ll spend it, there will be a short stimulus that will positively affect the market, then what? We’re right back where we are. The same people are still going to be facing eviction because they wasted the money. Then you have to do it again. And again. And again. I’m not much for the slippery slope fallacy, but if you’re going to hand over taxpayer dollars under the guise of helping people pay their bills, then pay their bills for them. If they want to spend on consumer goods, they need to do it with their own disposable income. If they don’t have any, welp... that sucks. At least they’ll have room, board, lights, and food to sustain them until this passes.

I mean, you're touching on an argument about helicopter cash that's fair even if I disagree with your moralizing. (Studies generally show that people given money will use that money on necessities. Yes, it's not always true, but it's true more often than not. And when it's not true, it's worth noting that there's a trillion dollar advertising industry meant to get you to buy things you don't need, and the entire economy is predicated on people going into debt to buy crap they don't need.)

But if your concern is ultimately about people rather than economic stimulus, then you'd put a moratorium on evictions and mortgage payments, as Italy has done, instead of just handing people cash. The issue is that the government (both parties) is mainly interested in spending money on, say, bailing out an airline industry that's just going to spend it all on stock buybacks again rather than on helping out working schmucks like all of us.

 

[Kontradiction]

I mean, you're touching on an argument about helicopter cash that's fair even if I disagree with your moralizing. (Studies generally show that people given money will use that money on necessities. Yes, it's not always true, but it's true more often than not. And when it's not true, it's worth noting that there's a trillion dollar advertising industry meant to get you to buy things you don't need, and the entire economy is predicated on people going into debt to buy crap they don't need.)

I never said EVERYONE would use that cash on consumer goods. I was very clear about that in my OP before I hurt Nunchucks’ feminine, little feelings by daring to say that black people like J’s. My concern is that many people would do that, making it a necessity to pay out more money in taxpayer dollars when that percentage doesn’t use that money for their bills.

But if your concern is ultimately about people rather than economic stimulus, then you'd put a moratorium on evictions and mortgage payments, as Italy has done, instead of just handing people cash.

I’m down. Where do I sign up? As the now single bread winner for my house with a mortgage, my wife’s student loans, and two car notes, I’d gladly sign off on that.

 

[varjao]

First death confirmed here in Brazil in my city, Sao Paulo. As the greatest financial center in South America expectations are that it will spread in an exponential rate. People can't afford to stop working, taking the crowded subway or bus.

I work for Ford Motor Company, we started worldwide to work remotely since monday, it was a little late in my opinion.

So sad, today it hit me hard, watching this chaos, some stocks I have in a long position completely melting (i'm not even mad at that since I know eventually they will recover).

 

[venecol]

The general economic state of the United States. Start with our level of credit card debt and work your way back from there.

That's the way the economy in the Country works, they encourage getting into debt. Everyone is mortgaged to the hilt. Savings are zero for most people.

However, that doesn't mean that people that are clearly scared at facing the prospect of no income and current bills being due are not going to fv^king panic unless they receive some help, and if they do, that they all of a sudden are going to go out shopping with it.

Government would also have to freeze payment of credit card debt and interest charges otherwise money could end up there instead.

Now, will there be people that are addicts or whatever that will abuse the situation, absolutely. I don't believe everyone is getting a check anyway. Probably based on last years taxes. They don't even know how this will work. Millionaires aren't getting a check.

If I get one, I'll probably use it to help out my kids.

 

[patsfan13]

I cannot read that OP-ed. But here is one with citations from the former director

https://abcnews-go-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/abcnews.go.com/amp/Politics/wireStory/trump-disbanded-nsc-pandemic-unit-experts-praised-69594177?amp_js_v=a3&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA=#aoh=15844656912939&referrer=https://www.google.com&amp_tf=From %1$s&ampshare=https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/trump-disbanded-nsc-pandemic-unit-experts-praised-69594177

I suspect the op ed you cited is making a semantic argument.

Well as I knew you are wrong, The article cites Beth Cameron the first director of that particular office.

The OpEd I linked was written by Tim Morrison who headed this group that was 'disbanded' in 2018. He wrote hi OpEd on March 16, likely in response the the lies being put out by Cameron.
So why did Cameron intentionally lie during the midst of this crisis?

Here is a memo issued by the WH in Sept 2018 supporting the National Bio Defense Effort:

Presidential Memorandum on the Support for National Biodefense | The White House


Hate on Trump all you want. Just don't repeat outright lies.

 

[Nunchucks]

Well as I knew you are wrong, The article cites Beth Cameron the first director of that particular office.

The OpEd I linked was written by Tim Morrison who headed this group that was 'disbanded' in 2018. He wrote hi OpEd on March 16, likely in response the the lies being put out by Cameron.
So why did Cameron intentionally lie during the midst of this crisis?

Here is a memo issued by the WH in Sept 2018 supporting the National Bio Defense Effort:

Presidential Memorandum on the Support for National Biodefense | The White House


Hate on Trump all you want. Just don't repeat outright lies.

As I thought, a semantic argument. The directorate was disbanded. The CDC still ran programs, just did not have the cohesive leadership.
Trump disbanded NSC pandemic unit that experts had praised | Us World News | fox10tv.com

 

[venecol]

Well as I knew you are wrong, The article cites Beth Cameron the first director of that particular office.

The OpEd I linked was written by Tim Morrison who headed this group that was 'disbanded' in 2018. He wrote hi OpEd on March 16, likely in response the the lies being put out by Cameron.
So why did Cameron intentionally lie during the midst of this crisis?

Here is a memo issued by the WH in Sept 2018 supporting the National Bio Defense Effort:

Presidential Memorandum on the Support for National Biodefense | The White House


Hate on Trump all you want. Just don't repeat outright lies.

Which one of the people we're seeing on TV heading this crisis belong to this group that's still around to address pandemics?

 

[patsfan13]

Pretty crazy, a former Trump advisor defending him in an OpEd.

Here is a bipartisan panel, with medical and industry experts, headlining for a restoration of leadership in that exact department.

Ending the Cycle of Crisis and Complacency in U.S. Global Health Security
https://csis-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/...191122_EndingTheCycle_GHSC_WEB_FULL_11.22.pdf



Its almost like those who knew what something like this would take, saw we didnt have what it would take.

So who exactly would correct the lie being spread by ex Obama officials?
So are you saying Morrison lied?

 

[Kontradiction]

That's the way the economy in the Country works, they encourage getting into debt. Everyone is mortgaged to the hilt. Savings are zero for most people.

However, that doesn't mean that people that are clearly scared at facing the prospect of no income and current bills being due are not going to fv^king panic unless they receive some help, and if they do, that they all of a sudden are going to go out shopping with it.

Government would also have to freeze payment of credit card debt and interest charges otherwise money could end up there instead.

Now, will there be people that are addicts or whatever that will abuse the situation, absolutely. I don't believe everyone is getting a check anyway. Probably based on last years taxes. They don't even know how this will work. Millionaires aren't getting a check.

If I get one, I'll probably use it to help out my kids.

That’s the way our culture is. We’re addicted to consumer goods, by and large. Our culture as a country is to borrow the money for the things we want and pay it back later. You may contrast that with Asian cultures if you wish. So yes, there would be a large percentage that doesn’t use such a payout in the “correct” way and instead spends the payout on consumer goods. That’s why I wouldn’t advocate a direct payout. Instead, force people to produce bills that they’re past due on, confirm that information with the debtor, and submit a voucher directly to them for payment of the bill up to that certain amount. It’s not pretty, would take a ton of man hours, and wouldn’t be efficient at all. But it’s better than giving people a handout then having to do it again when a certain percentage of the country doesn’t use that handout for their bills.

 

[venecol]

@italian pat patriot come stai amico?

Tell us the latest. How is the government handling the economic impact over there?