Belichick's record without Brady since the Brady era began

[SHOWTIME15]

So I wasn't just thinking that - I wasn't sure if it was just in my head! Players win games and coaches lose them or something like that

He's being modest. Coaches and players win games, and coaches and players lose them.

 

[mike_usagisan]

I don’t really care about Bill’s record before Brady. At this point, I don’t really care about his record with Brady or Cam. All I care about now is his record this year, and I hope it ends up at 16-4.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Personally, I thought after this five game winning streak, the anti-Belichick crowd would have given it a rest at least until the next time the Pats lost.

Hmmmm….maybe it has to do with you downplaying and dismissing the Bill minus Brady win/loss record for years and years, only to start a thread that highlights Bill minus Brady, but using cherry picked games with the intent to mislead.

The anti-Belichick crowd did give it a rest. Who is the troll desperately seeking a reaction and a polarizing discussion? You. As always, every time, it’s a guy like you who starts it and then complains about it.

And why don’t you knock it off with the garbage “A person in this thread said this…”. Who? Use a name and back it up. You love to give vague straw man arguments and act like you’re taking the high road by not naming names. In reality, you’re making it up or exaggerating it, as usual.

I think 75% of the Belichick vitriol on this forum is a desire to see you, and a few of your crew members, have to eat **** for once, since that’s all that comes out of your mouths.

 

[NormZauchin]

That isn't true. He used the Perkins/Ehrhardt system back in Cleveland. Just because he was a defensive coach prior to being a head coach (which isn't 100% true because he was a receivers coach in Detroit, doesn't mean he wasn't married to an offensive system. He hired Charlie Weis specifically because he had a lot of experience in that offense.

I forgot that Belichick was a receivers coach back in the day. Makes you wonder why he has been so poor at drafting wide receivers.

 

[gobesmug]

That's BS. You Bill Walsh would have gotten a QB who couldn't run the West Coast Offense and revamp his entire offense around him? No! Just like Belichick, he wouldn't draft or trade for or sign a QB who didn't fit his system. His system. The system is in place. Belichick was looking QB that fit his system, not get a QB and revamp his system around him.

And the reason why Belichick was so quick to move on from Bledsoe was that never fit his system. He never loved Bledsoe. Bledsoe was obviously forced on him. Bledsoe was not passed his prime. He actually had a pretty good season in 2002. His team sucked, but he didn't. He just never fit on Belichick's system.

And yes, this is a QB driven league. Of course you need a QB. I never said otherwise.

It's not BS.

Great coaches tweak and revamp to match their players.

Look at Jim Harbaugh. He built a playoff juggernaut that knocked the Pats out of the playoffs with Joe Flacco as his QB.

He didn't look for a Joe Flacco clone in the draft. He got a QB with potential then built an entire offense to match that.

Bill revamped the offense last year to match Cam's skills and did a good job bringing that team deft of talent to a 7-9 record.

You make your players you have work or you suck as a HC. And no I'm not saying Bill sucks as a HC because he made it work with Cam last year as they would have gone probably 9-7 if Cam didn't get COVID

 

[catent]

I do not really care about the stupid Bill vs Brady argument.

Really? Would you be pouring time into making countless posts on the subject if you did not care?

I know for a fact that I almost always see your name in the Belichick-Brady threads and this one is no different, so I don't buy for a second that you "do not really care" about this discussion. It's a topic that you find compelling enough to post about a lot (35 times today in this thread alone, and counting). Of course you care.

You seem to be the one with the agenda.

Yeah, no agenda on your end, none at all. Just cold hard reality without any out-of-context facts

I will say this, whoever the coach was for KC when cassel went there must be pretty good because Cassel took them to the playoffs and couldnt take a 16-0 super team.

... oh wait.

 

[catent]

Bill is a coach, brady is a player, they literally do nothing of each others job.

A head football coach and a quarterback, sharing the same team, do "literally nothing of each others job"?

Not sure how you arrived at that conclusion but I strongly disagree. It would seem to me that those two respective jobs have a lot of mutual dependence and overlap.

 

[catent]

I will say this, whoever the coach was for KC when cassel went there must be pretty good because Cassel took them to the playoffs and couldnt take a 16-0 super team.

Just to reiterate how disingenuous/misleading this statement is, the Patriots went 11-5 in 2008 with Cassel at the helm of that "super team" and missed the postseason only because Miami was also 11-5 and held the tiebreaker. It's rare (especially during the era of the 16-game regular season) for an 11-5 team to entirely miss the playoffs.

The 2010 Chiefs team Cassel took to the playoffs that you're referring to? They went 10-6 ... they won fewer games than the 2008 Patriots, led by Cassel, who missed the postseason.

If you actually took the time to do your research you'd realize that argument holds no water.

The ignorance doesn't bother me as much as the hypocrisy/dishonesty, though. You're self-appointing yourself as a neutral evaluator with no agenda, and yet you're throwing out misleading and dishonest stuff like the above, which clearly indicates an underlying bias/agenda (even if you, yourself, aren't consciously aware of that bias or willing to admit it).

 

[catent]

I will say this, whoever the coach was for KC when cassel went there must be pretty good because Cassel took them to the playoffs and couldnt take a 16-0 super team.

The 2008 Patriots, quarterbacked by Matt Cassel, finish with an 11-5 record and miss the playoffs:
"This is evidence that Bill Belichick isn't all that special of a coach".

The 2010 Chiefs, quarterbacked by Matt Cassel, finish with a 10-6 record and make the playoffs:
"This is evidence that the Chiefs have a darn good coach".

 

[lancerman]

Dreighver is pissed

 

[RobertWeathers]

Dreighver is pissed

Don't be messing with @dreighver now

 

[Pats2000]

Why dont they count 2000? Brady was on the team. Bill was the coach and brady was on the team, seems like that should count. I guess if people want to ignore 18 games Bill was coach and Brady was not starting and not count that, then we can just change anything we want. Bill as the head coach of the patriots without Brady starting at QB is 33-32....thats his record on the patritos as the head coach when someone besides Brady is starting.

Because 2000 was his first year, he didn't have his guy, team, or complete philosophy in place. He was still overcoming the crap Carroll left behind the previous year

 

[RobertWeathers]

Because 2000 was his first year, he didn't have his guy, team, or complete philosophy in place. He was still overcoming the crap Carroll left behind the previous year

You are wasting your time

 

[KamikazeKnight]

I'm no expert, but seems pretty unlikely to me that current-day Belichick is anything like pre-Brady Belichick. We're talking about more than 20 years ago. That's 2 decades of additional experience with coaching and team-building and winning that he didn't have back then. So, personally, I consider that a different lifetime and view post-Brady Belichick to refer exclusively to last year and this year.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Tom went to Tampa Bay and blew up any notion that he was the puppet of a mastermind 5D chess system, that he has supposedly had limitations, and that he couldn’t lead or succeed in a totally different system, not to mention culture.

Bill is currently on the cusp of bringing a second quarterback drafted and coached by the team, into the higher levels of QB play. It’s still very early, but it’s impressive. The way the team has played for the last five weeks, playing complementary football with incredible poise and confidence, is remarkable. If the team can keep this up and Jones continues to develop, Bill will have shed his dependency perception like Tom did. I don’t care if he wins a SB; he just needs to rebuild a long-term competitive team.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I'm no expert, but seems pretty unlikely to me that current-day Belichick is anything like pre-Brady Belichick. We're talking about more than 20 years ago. That's 2 decades of additional experience with coaching and team-building and winning that he didn't have back then. So, personally, I consider that a different lifetime and view post-Brady Belichick to refer exclusively to last year and this year.

A very valid point

I'd argue Dynasty 2 BB is better than Dynasty 1 BB

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

A very valid point

I'd argue Dynasty 2 BB is better than Dynasty 1 BB

It is, if you go by almost any objective measure. Record, point differential, playoff success, and all this without a rookie QB deal.

The only way to knock it is to cite some of the more controversial/negative stuff, but I’m not going there. That’s not me. No siree.

 

[RobertWeathers]

It is, if you go by almost any objective measure. Record, point differential, playoff success, and all this without a rookie QB deal.

The only way to knock it is to cite some of the more controversial/negative stuff, but I’m not going there. That’s not me. No siree.

LMFAO

 

[Rob0729]

I'm no expert, but seems pretty unlikely to me that current-day Belichick is anything like pre-Brady Belichick. We're talking about more than 20 years ago. That's 2 decades of additional experience with coaching and team-building and winning that he didn't have back then. So, personally, I consider that a different lifetime and view post-Brady Belichick to refer exclusively to last year and this year.

That is a good answer. Belichick is still growing and adapting as a coach. Unlike players, a head coach can get better every day until he retires. And Belichick is good about learning from his mistakes and improving himself and his teams based on what he has learned. It is clear that Belichick wasn't the same coach in 2001 that he was in 1995 with the Browns. I think he learned a lot from 2000 to 2001.

 

[Guts]

Why isn't this thread being moved to the Brady forum? Let's keep the same energy