BB watch

[sb1]

 

[Ring 6]

Let's look at things ina nuanced manner.

A. offensive line continuity. We are still one of the worst offensive lines and just kept a carousel for the line. This should be improved next year with sow, mafi, onwenu, Strange as starters and 1 stud LT who gets drafted

B. Wide receiver separation- if we can get tee higgins that can possibly plug the gap

V. Qb play - there is no quick solution to this. I noticed Parker having better chemistry with zappe and douglas also shining in. Hunter Henry and zappe are tied to the hip . So maybe Henry resigning takes priority if we decide to go with zappe . We might not win superbowl but with stellar defense and above average ST play we can definitely contend for postseason.

The teams who are healthiest in December win the superbowl. So if we build adequate depth we can definitely compete .


I think Mac just capitulated in a manner that none of us imagined . It's more an exception than norm.


Zappe floor should be that of minshew and ceiling that of purdy . I think we. An live with that considering the defense we have . Plug the offensive holes and health and get a WR1 and we should be okay.

Too many variables went against us this year . Who knows next year we could get moderately lucky. If the top 2 picks and the number 1 free agent addition pans out , we will be playoff bound in 2024.

Assuming we resign Henry, Dugger, Jennings if we add an adequate QB and a good OL we are a contender. That should be the priority. Anything we add on top of that just makes us a better contender.

 

[Toofy]

Assuming we resign Henry, Dugger, Jennings if we add an adequate QB and a good OL we are a contender. That should be the priority. Anything we add on top of that just makes us a better contender.

Correction.. onwenu is highest priority followed by jennings and henry . I don't mind skipping on Dugger if we can use the dollars on tee higgins .

And we should probably eat some cap and trade jujubto chiefs and use that dollars on tee higgins .

And offensive line sign only free agents who are trying to prove their worth and slugged it out in off season towards training and nutrition.

 

[palialka]

1) If Bill’s only other options are other teams who won’t make him the GM there either then he may as well take a reduced role here

2) The new GM here would have some job security knowing that Bill only has two years left at most and then he gets to aid in the decision on who replaces Bill at that time. So not much reason not to be OK with it as it’s unlikely he would get the axe before Bill retires and the next guy comes in and gets a couple years himself.

This makes sense to me and could be a feasible solution

The biggest obstacle to this will be getting buy in from Bill. I’m not sure his pride will allow him to accept a reduced role after 20+ years at the helm as HC and GM.

I think BB still has it as a coach…he may not be a 10 anymore but he’s still in the 7/8 range which is better than 2/3 of the HCs in the league. The hurdle is his player personnel decisions. It hasn’t been good the last 5+ years and that has really impacted the roster…pretty much all on the offensive side of the ball.

We all know, the Krafts included, that there has to be some significant changes in the off season…organizationally and with the roster. BB can’t be the final say with the upcoming draft and $100M in cap space.

 

[palialka]

That will never happen. Once you’re a HC for as long as Bill has been and what he’s accomplished, you can’t go back to DC.

Yeah I think the more reasonable option would be to keep BB on as the HC but hand the GM keys over to someone else.

The “big if” will be if Bill can accept that…

 

[RobertWeathers]

Why would you look at an employee who has been the best to ever do the job and ignore the successes? That’s is not smart business at all.
What are the circumstances?
What changed?
What is the vision?
How close are you to that vision?
How has being a member of a cooperative that operates to create parity kept the greatest ever from being the greatest at every moment?
Etc, etc, etc

Keeping a leader for 4 years who has not performed well is also bad business.

Narrow viewpoints lead to poor decisions.

Keeping a leader in power when his vision, strategy and tactics have not evolved but the results have worsened is also a poor decision.

 

[50-yard-line]

Ok Trevor Lawrence.. his teams winning no matter the struggles. Is this patriots team winning? If so show me some examples?

His team is 8-7 in a pathetic division. First pick, third year, making bad decisions and throwing picks.

And THAT team wasn’t stripped naked by an historic 5-year run.

Agreed it is toss up when drafting a QB. Not every one hits. We were blessed with one for 19 seasons..

No argument here.

On your examples I'd urge you to read the Seth wickersham material on brady,Bill and Bobby Kraft. ( this isn't felgah)

Gives you In depth 1st person accounts of all the great men aforementioned above. And how things went down..

Nah. Sports books are either hit jobs or blow jobs.

 

[The Gr8est]

Well first of all he never “took acclaim” for Brady.
And of course he is responsible for the QB play.
But you don’t fire the GOAT because one position needs to be upgraded to be back in contention. When you have 100 mill in cap space to do so, and upgrade the rest of the roster too

Mac Jones was the first real attempt at finding Brady’s replacement, and BB failed, like so many other teams have found out before, but we have “experts” here who insist that BB be fired and we can draft a QB, in this draft, even trading up if necessary, and everything will be fixed.

Building an NFL roster is easy, and any reasonably informed NFL fan can do it, certainly better than BB.

 

[50-yard-line]

Those are silly arguments. Who you think is better, what you think is more important is irrelevant and proves nothing. What happens on the field matters. Football is a team game.
A playoff worthy roster is a roster that makes the playoffs.
A playoff worthy roster, except for the QB, I’d a roster that makes the playoffs with average QB play. LV, wash, giants, la, Indy games are certain wins if we had average qb play. That’s a 9-6 roster with an average QB, 4-11 with the dregs of the league.

This is actually kind of funny. Talk about grass-is-greenerisn

Trent Brown > Dion Dawkins
David Andrews > Mitch Morse
Mike Onwenu > Anyone on Buffalo’s OL

Rham…starter

JJSS or Parker would start over Gabe Davis.

Pop Douglas > Shakir

New England D > Buffalo D (and a lot younger)

Hunter Henry as good as any Buffalo TE

Swap Allen for Mac/Zappe and New England is in the playoffs and the Bills are watching Carolina with interest.

 

[UGAPatsfan]

I have a feeling the Krafts are going to do literally the one thing I don’t think they should…

Walk up to Bill after the Jets game and fire him.

Full stop.

I hope not, but it’s odd they haven’t spoken.

I do think it’s time to move on BUT also think you can do that in a way which still honors a pretty damned good stretch that has just run it’s course.

 

[palialka]

The roster is garbage. Going to Zappe earlier might not have changed anything. Maybe they lose the games they lost with him under center. Maybe they don't. It's impossible to say. I mean, the teams Zappe has beaten haven't been the greatest. The Broncos are a middling team (how many 3 and outs did the Pats have?), the Steelers are a below average team. Zappe was shut out by one of the worst passing D's in the league (at home no less).

People wanted to talk about a "signature win" with Mac. Zappe hasn't had one either. Let's see him go up against a legit contender and see how he does. Buffalo is playing for their playoff lives so we'll see how he does next Sunday...but even they're trending in the wrong direction.

Luckily for us, the roster is not complete garbage.

2 or 3 changes to upgrade the OL, add a #1 WR and a couple of legit NFL WRs and we should be better.

The key will be what we do with the QB situation. We can all agree that Mac is done here. The question is Zappe…realistically I think the next 2 games will go a long way in determining how the organization moves forward at QB. If Zappe balls out then he’ll probably get his shot as QB1 next season. If he performs decently then he’ll stick as QB2. If he bombs…well then we’ll probably draft one early and look for another QB in FA for next season. Ideally, I’d like to keep Zappe as a QB2 and draft a QB to be groomed as the next franchise QB….or…have Zappe be a bridge QB1 for a year and then get a QB1 next year if they don’t like the QBs in the upcoming draft.

The other question is Ryland…the next 2 games will also be huge assessment for him and whether or not he’s the guy. I think the Pats still like him but they’ll bring another K into camp for some real competition.

 

[Real fan 02]

His team is 8-7 in a pathetic division. First pick, third year, making bad decisions and throwing picks.

And THAT team wasn’t stripped naked by an historic 5-year run.

No argument here.

Nah. Sports books are either hit jobs or blow jobs.

Seth wikersham was invited into Brady's home with his family, same with Kraft.. I'd put some real stock into that than just a "report"...

 

[The Gr8est]

You could ask the same about any of Bills people like most of Bill's hires.. he knew his father Al groh!!!! However he's been with the organization for a while in different personnel capacity roles, he's in charge or contracts and signing players. Basically the nick caserio role.

I ask because he is a name that I hear being bandied about as a GM replacement for BB.

People should be careful about what they ask for, just like replacing BB as HC.

There is a large body of evidence of the failures from other franchises who have tried that.

The Pats were arguable the worst franchise of any franchise in any sport prior to Parcels and BB, and so many fans seem so ready to throw that away,

For uncertainty.

 

[palialka]

This is actually kind of funny. Talk about grass-is-greenerisn

Trent Brown > Dion Dawkins
David Andrews > Mitch Morse
Mike Onwenu > Anyone on Buffalo’s OL

JJSS or Parker would start over Gabe Davis.

Pop Douglas > Shakir

New England D > Buffalo D (and a lot younger)

Hunter Henry as good as any Buffalo TE

Swap Allen for Mac/Zappe and Nee England is in the playoffs and the Bills are watching Carolina with interest.

Pretty good assessment

My only disagreements are Juju/Parker being better than Davis and Andrews over Morse.

I would rate them as a wash…all those guys are JAGs and replaceable TBH.

 

[50-yard-line]

This doesn't make sense at all. So the roster getting more talented doesn't lead to Superbowls?

So the drafting being poor and roster getting worse does?

It's been 4 years since we had our "reset year" and the roster is worse. That's not a successful rebuild

This roster is better and younger than 2020.

 

[50-yard-line]

Assuming we resign Henry, Dugger, Jennings if we add an adequate QB and a good OL we are a contender. That should be the priority. Anything we add on top of that just makes us a better contender.

Onwenu is the top re-sign, imo

 

[Real fan 02]

I ask because he is a band that I hear being bandied about as a GM replacement for BB.

People should be careful about what they ask for, just like replacing BB as HC.

There is a large body of evidence of the failures from other franchises who have tried that.

The Pats were arguable the worst franchise of any franchise in any sport prior to Parcels and BB, and so many fans seem so ready to throw that away,

For uncertainty.

Oh my friend I agree with you. We have to look at things realistically. NO ONE can replace Bill or Brady. However the Kraft family runs a business.. they have the bes view in the house than anyone. I trust them to know what they are doing.

They are likely going to look outside the organization for potential GMs.. however Groh in my opinion is the most obvious choice. I know full well how bad it was.. as a kid in the 80s watching them.. and early 90s.. team was almost moved to CT.

However it all starts with ownership. They are the ones that hire, and dictate what direction they want thier franchises to go. They all are billionaires for a reason.

 

[50-yard-line]

Pretty good assessment

My only disagreements are Juju/Parker being better than Davis and Andrews over Morse.

I would rate them as a wash…all those guys are JAGs and replaceable TBH.

Juju was clearly playing gimpy early on. He looks quicker so hopefully his knee isn’t done.

Parker showed last game what he can still do - with a QB better placing the ball. Davis is a 3, tops.

The Pats are missing that number 1 guy who demands attention (Diggs seems to be slowing, by the way). I still want Jeudy in a trade/extension, but doubt it happens.

And yeah, a lot are close, but I was responding to the claim that no one could start on the Bills - whose window is closing faster than many realize.

 

[The Gr8est]

I agree we're better off with him coaching.
The question remains: will he agree to giving up the gm reins?

BB certainly makes mistakes in player acquisition, as all GMs do, and he has also been hamstrung with drafting late in each round, as well as having high picks blatantly stolen by a league intent on bringing the Pats back to the pack.

Some picks were head scratchers for me, like Jordan Richards and Duron Harmon, although in Harmon’s case he became an excellent player for the Pats, but were there a lot fans who ripped the pick admitting their mistake later?

BB has also gambled on greatness on occasion.

He missed with Ras-I Dowling, who actually looked really good in his debut vs the Dolphins, and Gronk, which was the grand slams of grand slams.

A player like Gronk is only available where he was because of concerns outside of his playing ability.

Gronk could have easily flopped, if his injury issues became too much to overcome, and our “experts” would have been screaming for BB’s head for drafting “Gronk IR”, instead of Sergio Kindle, who so many of our “experts” wanted.

BB may also be unmatched at finding gems among the UDFAs.

BB has not been the disaster as GM that so many of our self proclaimed experts would have you believe.

 

[Ring 6]

Keeping a leader for 4 years who has not performed well is also bad business.

Keeping a leader in power when his vision, strategy and tactics have not evolved but the results have worsened is also a poor decision.

Those things are not the case here.