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Content Post A welcome relief and some thoughts

2021 Patriots Season:
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captain stone

Hall of Fame Poster
One question I have for everyone, does McCourty look like he's lost a step? I mean it was bound to happen at some point. In the past he had routinely been clocked as the fastest man on the field.

no doubt. He has clearly lost at least a step this year. He may be as fast as ever, as far as straight line speed, but the excellent instincts and reactions just are not as sharp as previous years.

Yep; that was DMac's worst game here in a decade... Hope it's not a sign of things to come...
 

PaulThePat

Third String But Playing on Special Teams
Harris's blunder. Again what should have been a simple run-in and TD (and frankly there wasn't enough evidence to overturn it on review either)
On the first few replays I saw there was nothing conclusive to say the ball hadn't grazed the front of the endzone. However, we just came back from a break and it had been overruled. Still haven't see the conclusive angle - not saying there wasn't one - just that I haven't seen it.
 

PScottman

In the Starting Line-Up
One question I have for everyone, does McCourty look like he's lost a step? I mean it was bound to happen at some point. In the past he had routinely been clocked as the fastest man on the field.
Likely. He's gone from all-pro to simply solid starter. On the TD it wasn't so much speed as a terrible angle as said previously, but in his youth he catches many guys from behind...I agree he's not that guy anymore.
 

1960Pats

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especially the swing pass to Bolden that gained over 25 yards
I enjoy swing passes but they need to be done perfectly. If the QB gives the RB the pass in stride and he doesn't have to stop or jump to get it that's a huge difference. It's one of the things that Brady did much better than Bledsoe that impressed me when I first saw Brady play. Mac seems to be better than Drew at that too.
 

PATSYLICIOUS

Pro Bowl Player
On the first few replays I saw there was nothing conclusive to say the ball hadn't grazed the front of the endzone. However, we just came back from a break and it had been overruled. Still haven't see the conclusive angle - not saying there wasn't one - just that I haven't seen it.

The refs had to have seen SOMETHING that showed a non -TD, maybe it was something that wasn't shown to us. Because you cannot overturn the on field ruling without absolute evidence that it was the wrong call.
 

1960Pats

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Likely. He's gone from all-pro to simply solid starter. On the TD it wasn't so much speed as a terrible angle as said previously, but in his youth he catches many guys from behind...I agree he's not that guy anymore.
Better to let a player go too early than too late. ;)
 

1960Pats

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The refs had to have seen SOMETHING that showed a non -TD, maybe it was something that wasn't shown to us. Because you cannot overturn the on field ruling without absolute evidence that it was the wrong call.
Didn't the on-field refs called it a TD? If there was another view that was clear then we should have seen that.

I wish I had the same faith in the NYFL that you do. But I don't. I've seen plenty of calls over the years that went the wrong way, even with clear video evidence.

The Browns lost fumble call a few years ago when the Browns runner stood up with the ball in his hands was a classic example of what I'm referring to. I also notice that they don't always show replays of penalties. That makes me suspicious too.
 

1960Pats

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Just wanted to say I am so relieved the Pats won today. I think a loss in this game would have REALLY been devastating. The Pats were in many ways superior to the Texans and a number of fluke-ish incidents made the game so tight.

Texans first drive - should have been a 3 and out and a stop instead they moved the chains on the 3 and 2 when it definitely looked like he was stopped. But NFL still has no accurate measurements of the markers and ball positioning and the officials eye-balled it to have been a 1st down. BB looked in disbelief but didn't challenge. Would have stopped the 10 minute drive and TD.

McCourty's rare blunder. What should have been just a spectacular 20ish yard circus catch over JC Jackson's inside coverage and a push out by the safety, turns into a 67 yard TD reception because of Devin's awful blunder where he overran Moore and turned a routine safety tackle into a touchdown.

Harris's blunder. Again what should have been a simple run-in and TD (and frankly there wasn't enough evidence to overturn it on review either) turns into a fumble recovery in the endzone.

The combination of the 3 above was a swing of 21 pts (ok 19 since they actually missed the 2 xp). But it was huge. And a loss would have been extremely deflating. Instead of being up 13-0 we were down 12-6, halfway through 2nd quarter.

And that's despite the horrible drop by Meyers, horrendous interception by Jones at start of 3rd quarter, and the secondary totally biting on the flea flicker.

Thankfully we had an own-goal from the Texans with the ridiculous punt trickery haha. We needed that so bad. Although it was still depressing to see us hand-off to frickin Bolden on the 3rd and 10 when we got the ball after that. Which was a waste. Thank god Folk put it through another 52 yarder. Totally changed the momentum of the game. That helmet-to-helmet roughing the passer on the last drive was a blessing as well.

Good teams find ways to win on their bad days. And that's how resiliency is built. We're not a great team, but we were definitely better than the Texans and played poorly relative to our potential and still won. It was much needed and hopefully there's some self-belief in this team now.

P.S. Harris is a stud (despite the fumble).

P.P.S. I wonder what heated debate BB and McDaniels were having right after the TD pass to Henry to tie the game at 22-22. We just scored a TD and they seemed to be arguing. Weird. BB didn't like the call McD made? (even if it scored a TD)
Relief is just a win away.

The refs seem to have been instructed to move the chains whenever it's close. I've seen that happen many times in many games.

McCourty's blunder reminded me of a couple of other plays. The Seattle SB when Harmon jumped over Kearse instead of hitting him or the ball and the Saints playoff game when they lost on the last play vs the Vikings. The difference with that one was McCourty didn't take out his only teammate with a chance to catch him.

It's pretty obvious that the other teams know that Harris carries the ball in a way that makes it easy to punch out. I want nothing to do with him in the future and I'll be a nervous wreck every time he carries the ball in traffic.

P.S. Bolden has been more reliable than Harris this year.
P.S.S. Maybe Bill got a text a from @DropKickFlutie to tell off Josh. :)
 

PATSYLICIOUS

Pro Bowl Player
Didn't the on-field refs called it a TD? If there was another view that was clear then we should have seen that.

I wish I had the same faith in the NYFL that you do. But I don't. I've seen plenty of calls over the years that went the wrong way, even with clear video evidence.

The Browns lost fumble call a few years ago when the Browns runner stood up with the ball in his hands was a classic example of what I'm referring to. I also notice that they don't always show replays of penalties. That makes me suspicious too.

Correct, the on field ruling was a td. It was hard for me to conclude anything definitive that could have overturned it based on what I saw so assumed they had another angle to go off
 

reflexblue

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Correct, the on field ruling was a td. It was hard for me to conclude anything definitive that could have overturned it based on what I saw so assumed they had another angle to go off
The reffs used the same video angles that we see, they rely on the broadcasters feed. I don't trust an anonymous 'official' in NY ruling on anything when it comes t the patriots. What i saw was the ball cross the plain of the goal line, then it was punched out. On rhom Stevens "fumble" in the fins game, ive watched that more than a dozen times, his butt hit the ground, i never saw the ball come loose, stevens reaction was to just casually get up and walk away. Thats not how you act if you think there is any chance you've fumbled.
 
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Ring 6

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The Texans were aggressive though...they went for it on 4th down at least 3 times..... And have you ever seen J.C. Jackson play as bad as he did in the first half? A great week to do so after basically being signed off as the de facto #1 corner on D.... oh and don't get me started with DMac...still love the guy, but some bad angles out there today.

AND I believe that there is an ongoing trend over the past 2-3 years where the Pats D always allows a TD on the other team's first offensive drive then settles down after that. Maybe I am just imagining things......but why can't we just have some quick three and outs like other teams?
Belichick plays the long game, within each game, within each season and overall.
Many things don’t make sense in a vacuum. The other team gets paid too, so it’s not like, as is sometimes often suggested here, just will thinks to happen.
I think, proportionally to the points they allow, it may be accurate that they allow more on the first drive (I’d guess first quarter) but unless you honestly think one team can perfectly dominate the other, it’s a trade off.
There has been a lot of talk about the early defense yesterday. And really Houston gets credit for executing plays outside of their comfort zone, but the long game ended up with Houston’s final 5 drives (right after the flea flicker on the first drive of the second half) resulting in 20 plays, 81 yards, 2 first downs and no points.
That’s virtually half a game that they totally shut them down.
Im cool with a strategy that drives better play in the second half and 4th quarter at the expense not winning the first drive.
 

Ring 6

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Correct, the on field ruling was a td. It was hard for me to conclude anything definitive that could have overturned it based on what I saw so assumed they had another angle to go off
There had to be an angle we didn’t see.
on that note the first first down of the game looked short by a yard or more to me and they never replayed it.
 

1960Pats

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Belichick plays the long game, within each game, within each season and overall.
Many things don’t make sense in a vacuum. The other team gets paid too, so it’s not like, as is sometimes often suggested here, just will thinks to happen.
I think, proportionally to the points they allow, it may be accurate that they allow more on the first drive (I’d guess first quarter) but unless you honestly think one team can perfectly dominate the other, it’s a trade off.
There has been a lot of talk about the early defense yesterday. And really Houston gets credit for executing plays outside of their comfort zone, but the long game ended up with Houston’s final 5 drives (right after the flea flicker on the first drive of the second half) resulting in 20 plays, 81 yards, 2 first downs and no points.
That’s virtually half a game that they totally shut them down.
Im cool with a strategy that drives better play in the second half and 4th quarter at the expense not winning the first drive.
So true. Everything is a work in progress and by the end of games the Pats seem to be hitting their stride on defense. Soon, when Mac Jones and the newbies get on the same page, the offense will likely do the same. Things are looking up.
 

Gumby

In the Starting Line-Up
The refs had to have seen SOMETHING that showed a non -TD, maybe it was something that wasn't shown to us. Because you cannot overturn the on field ruling without absolute evidence that it was the wrong call.
Yeah, they saw something. …. a Patriots jersey carrying the football.

cross-referenced with: Gotohell “points of emphasis “ guidance
 

Gumby

In the Starting Line-Up
Just wanted to say I am so relieved the Pats won today. I think a loss in this game would have REALLY been devastating. The Pats were in many ways superior to the Texans and a number of fluke-ish incidents made the game so tight.

Texans first drive - should have been a 3 and out and a stop instead they moved the chains on the 3 and 2 when it definitely looked like he was stopped. But NFL still has no accurate measurements of the markers and ball positioning and the officials eye-balled it to have been a 1st down. BB looked in disbelief but didn't challenge. Would have stopped the 10 minute drive and TD.

McCourty's rare blunder. What should have been just a spectacular 20ish yard circus catch over JC Jackson's inside coverage and a push out by the safety, turns into a 67 yard TD reception because of Devin's awful blunder where he overran Moore and turned a routine safety tackle into a touchdown.

Harris's blunder. Again what should have been a simple run-in and TD (and frankly there wasn't enough evidence to overturn it on review either) turns into a fumble recovery in the endzone.

The combination of the 3 above was a swing of 21 pts (ok 19 since they actually missed the 2 xp). But it was huge. And a loss would have been extremely deflating. Instead of being up 13-0 we were down 12-6, halfway through 2nd quarter.

And that's despite the horrible drop by Meyers, horrendous interception by Jones at start of 3rd quarter, and the secondary totally biting on the flea flicker.

Thankfully we had an own-goal from the Texans with the ridiculous punt trickery haha. We needed that so bad. Although it was still depressing to see us hand-off to frickin Bolden on the 3rd and 10 when we got the ball after that. Which was a waste. Thank god Folk put it through another 52 yarder. Totally changed the momentum of the game. That helmet-to-helmet roughing the passer on the last drive was a blessing as well.

Good teams find ways to win on their bad days. And that's how resiliency is built. We're not a great team, but we were definitely better than the Texans and played poorly relative to our potential and still won. It was much needed and hopefully there's some self-belief in this team now.

P.S. Harris is a stud (despite the fumble).

P.P.S. I wonder what heated debate BB and McDaniels were having right after the TD pass to Henry to tie the game at 22-22. We just scored a TD and they seemed to be arguing. Weird. BB didn't like the call McD made? (even if it scored a TD)

Relief is just a win away.

The refs seem to have been instructed to move the chains whenever it's close. I've seen that happen many times in many games.
There had to be an angle we didn’t see.
on that note the first first down of the game looked short by a yard or more to me and they never replayed it.

There was an article a year or two back talking about nyjfl (read Gotohell) changing the enforcement of various rules. At the same time as they kept the clock running on out of bounds plays (to speed up the game [for ratings]) they also told the refs to
give generous spots on plays between the 20s (to keep the game exciting/hi scoring [again for ratings]).

I think bb didn’t challenge because although disgusted by the ‘guidance’implementation, he probably felt he would lose the challenge to the ‘league-lackeys’ in the ‘unaccountable booth’ on the other side of the satellite connection.
 

DropKickFlutie

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Not sure where to put this so I'll just put it here. Those new taglines next to some threads are very... cringey. Look at this thing that sits at the top of some: "This has an opening post with good commentary and information, which we definitely recommend reading."

Look, we get it, there are some really thin skinned, insecure, crybabies here who are fake expert construction guys like bgc, craving adulation, and who don't like that they can't go around with their snarky arrogance unimpeded, trying to gatekeep which opinions are legitimate or illegitimate, or not liking all their bad draft analysis called out and proven to be flat out wrong, over and over.

But the solution isn't to change the whole forum with these really cringe taglines. "this thread is good, we recommend it". This is pretty bad....
 

PatsFanInVa

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P.P.S. I wonder what heated debate BB and McDaniels were having right after the TD pass to Henry to tie the game at 22-22. We just scored a TD and they seemed to be arguing. Weird. BB didn't like the call McD made? (even if it scored a TD)
"I just read the Patsfans.com Game Day Thread and chat and that was the WORST game-tying touchdown play ever called!!! I Swear to God, Josh, I am hiring somebody off Patsfans.com!"
 

DropKickFlutie

Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal
P.P.S. I wonder what heated debate BB and McDaniels were having right after the TD pass to Henry to tie the game at 22-22. We just scored a TD and they seemed to be arguing. Weird. BB didn't like the call McD made? (even if it scored a TD)

yeah McD flipping out on the sidelines after a TD. That was definitely weird. Wonder what that was about. They scored.

" I didn't call that, it was supposed to be yet another screen pass! I haven't called a redzone corner throw for 3 years Bill, it wasn't me! We have to address this with Mac tomorrow"
 

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