PostGame Thread OFFICIAL POSTGAME THREAD: Patriots Beat Titans 31-13

[Real fan 02]

Tannehill's not a bad comp, I'd say Jones has a better arm overall. He was like 2 rounds overdrafted at least, and is probably pretty close to his ceiling right now (Jones).

Which isn't bad.

As a football observer like yourself it's not hard to see over a 6 year period if a QB can play or not. I'm just speaking for myself. I never saw first round talent in jones. Similarly to Mac Jones who realistically is a 3rd round QB.

 

[TommyD4207]

As a football observer like yourself it's not hard to see over a 6 year period if a QB can play or not. I'm just speaking for myself. I never saw first round talent in jones. Similarly to Mac Jones who realistically is a 3rd round QB.

I mean, sure, but Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder too, right? He's still playing.

Daniel Jones was a panic pick by the Giants, and got drafted way too high, it happens.

 

[PatsfanTN]

I had to run an errand today during work and listen to the local sports talk. Take aways from sports talk radio down here:
1. Drake Maye is legit. Very very high ceiling and is special
2. Cam Ward might be good, but ceiling will never be as high as Mayes possibilities. (Cites arm strength, passing, etc). They have hope in Ward, but the game made them realize he’s not and will not be in the same category as Maye
3. The Patriots turn around. Vrabel and McDaniels are a huge part. The Titans can’t see that happening like it is with the Pats
4. Absolutely zero faith in the current team management and ownership. Cites RK realized Mayo was a mistake and moved to rectify quickly.

Overall a lot of praise for the Pats organization, Maye, and coaching.

 

[TommyD4207]

I had to run an errand today during work and listen to the local sports talk. Take aways from sports talk radio down here:
1. Drake Maye is legit. Very very high ceiling and is special
2. Cam Ward might be good, but ceiling will never be as high as Mayes possibilities. (Cites arm strength, passing, etc). They have hope in Ward, but the game made them realize he’s not and will not be in the same category as Maye
3. The Patriots turn around. Vrabel and McDaniels are a huge part. The Titans can’t see that happening like it is with the Pats
4. Absolutely zero faith in the current team management and ownership. Cites RK realized Mayo was a mistake and moved to rectify quickly.

Overall a lot of praise for the Pats organization, Maye, and coaching.

#2 - Ward's never going to be Drake Maye, but he's shown flashes for long stretches that he has the possibility of being a really good QB in the right situation. Since he's gotten in the league, he's regressed to something unrecognizable.

That might be a result of #4.

 

[Real fan 02]

Good comp. Yes he's still riding a bench in NYG. That shoulder like it did to cam ruined russ.

I mean, sure, but Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder too, right? He's still playing.

Daniel Jones was a panic pick by the Giants, and got drafted way too high, it happens

 

[TommyD4207]

Good comp. Yes he's still riding a bench in NYG. That shoulder like it did to cam ruined russ.

And Russell Wilson made 2 Super Bowls and won one.

Now, he had an all-time defense, and a borderline hall of famer at RB too, so that helped, and at the time, the times before 'Let Russ Cook' Good arm, smart with the ball. It's not impossible D Jones gets them to the playoffs.

But he's not as good as prime Russ Wilson. IMO, the Colts go as far as their scheme and Jonathan Taylor take them.

 

[dliverey44]

Redirect Notice

Thanks for that, I had not seen or heard anything about him being in the convo

 

[mgteich]

But he's not as good as prime Russ Wilson. IMO, the Colts go as far as their scheme and Jonathan Taylor take them.

Vintage Wilson had "run the damn ball" Lynch. Why is this situation different?

 

[Bill Lee]

I mean, sure, but Russell Wilson was a 3rd rounder too, right? He's still playing.

Daniel Jones was a panic pick by the Giants, and got drafted way too high, it happens.

Not having a viable quarterback is a good reason to panic, IMO.

 

[Simpelton]

Vintage Wilson had "run the damn ball" Lynch. Why is this situation different?

Because Wilson could throw far. And of course to be a QB you have to throw far. There couldn't possibly have been a 6x world champion who didn't come out of the draft with a reputation for elite throwing power.

Lots of guys who erred on the side of accuracy and consistency rather than raw power went on to win a ring. The GOAT among them. Hell many of the guys who start as big arm guys have to learn to play the same way in order to survive, example being Peyton Manning. Wilson's in the crapper now exactly because he failed to make that transition.

People get starry eyes about big arms, but if those big arms are not attached to quality heads, Jameis Winston is the ceiling. You don't want to waste a first round pick on a guy only to get Jameis Winston. The head tool is critically undervalued in the draft.

If I had to choose between a big arm and a big brain I take the big brain 25 times out of 10 as a rule. I couldn't give less of a damn how far a guy can throw to the wrong target. Fortunately for us we didn't have to make that choice. We got a guy with a big arm AND the ability to make good decisions with it. That's the Holy Grail. That's what generational talent looks like, you can't just snap your finger and find those guys.

One of the reasons I'm so intrigued by Jones is that he's got old QB skills as a young QB. He started out iin the form that most premium QBs have to work hard to transition into as their bodies fall apart. he actually reminds me a little bit of Drew Brees with his current run of form. Drew had many of the same characteristics that are defining DJ's season to date. Rapid decision making leading to quick, accurate throws, distributing the ball well among his targets, old skills with a young body that kind of thing.

With this exception: Jones is bigger, stronger and more mobile than Brees ever was.

Of course the other obvious similarity with Brees is that he didn't thrive on his first team either. Not as drastically as Jones, but he had to get the hell out of San Diego to really find his forever home as a player too.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

We're Pretty Good.
We'll see.

 

[TommyD4207]

Vintage Wilson had "run the damn ball" Lynch. Why is this situation different?

Wilson had an A+ deep ball. That's why it's different.

 

[TommyD4207]

I got this really interesting feed on my MSN browser today. It put out the supposition that using that top pick to find your QB of the future to turn your team's fortunes around, almost NEVER works out for the team who did the drafting. And then they started to go down the list of QB's. Although some have turned out to be great QB's (like Goff, Darnald, and Stafford) it's never for the team that drafted them and then they went to name a number of guys who have flourished for other teams.

Interestingly they even include CWilliams, JDaniels, Nix, and Pennix, saying the they are not sure things and point out stats and ratings for all of them that are pretty mediocre even though their teams are currently above .500. Like barely 60% passing completion rates for them all and rating in the 20's for passing efficiency.

There is one exception of course and he is never mentioned in the article because he is clearly the exception that proves the rule. Drake Make. HE is the reason along with guys like Manning, Luck, Elway that teams waste all those high picks hoping that it brings them a guy that turns their fortunes around. I didn't realize just how rarely it actually turns to work out.

BTW TJ Stroud LOOKED to be one too, (he has TWO playoff wins to his credit) but this year he's looked very ordinary this year and last night he looked just bad. It should be a cautionary tale for us. Your QB is only going to be as good and the people you put around him, both players and coaches. And the seeming greatness we are seeing NOW has no guarantees for the future. The Texans screwed around with their OL and Stroud is paying the price and it looked ugly last night.

Also, you know, Mahomes, Allen, Jackson, Mayfield. Even Brees and Hurts were top of the 2nd round.

Draft picks in general are crapshoots, but that's a weird supposition by the article.

 

[patfanken]

Also, you know, Mahomes, Allen, Jackson, Mayfield. Even Brees and Hurts were top of the 2nd round.

Draft picks in general are crapshoots, but that's a weird supposition by the article.

The discussion was talking about those at the very top of the draft by bad teams looking for the type of QB that will "instantly" turn their fortunes around. It does happen, but most of the time it doesn't, yet it never stops them (including us) from trying. Only we might wind up being the exception that proves the rule.

BTW- of course EVERY draft pick is a crap shoot.

 

[Real fan 02]

And Russell Wilson made 2 Super Bowls and won one.

Now, he had an all-time defense, and a borderline hall of famer at RB too, so that helped, and at the time, the times before 'Let Russ Cook' Good arm, smart with the ball. It's not impossible D Jones gets them to the playoffs.

But he's not as good as prime Russ Wilson. IMO, the Colts go as far as their scheme and Jonathan Taylor take them.

That's a very good question. " borderline " HOF RB. Would you say Lynch is one? I think he is.. but then again as of late HOF voting has become of topic of discussion. Anyway to your point Jones got the Giants to post season and even one a playoff game. I just never heard of such jones talk especially about a middling at best QB who never lived up to his draft status . To his credit he took Mara's money and ran. Good for him!

 

[Real fan 02]

Because Wilson could throw far. And of course to be a QB you have to throw far. There couldn't possibly have been a 6x world champion who didn't come out of the draft with a reputation for elite throwing power.

Lots of guys who erred on the side of accuracy and consistency rather than raw power went on to win a ring. The GOAT among them. Hell many of the guys who start as big arm guys have to learn to play the same way in order to survive, example being Peyton Manning. Wilson's in the crapper now exactly because he failed to make that transition.

People get starry eyes about big arms, but if those big arms are not attached to quality heads, Jameis Winston is the ceiling. You don't want to waste a first round pick on a guy only to get Jameis Winston. The head tool is critically undervalued in the draft.

If I had to choose between a big arm and a big brain I take the big brain 25 times out of 10 as a rule. I couldn't give less of a damn how far a guy can throw to the wrong target. Fortunately for us we didn't have to make that choice. We got a guy with a big arm AND the ability to make good decisions with it. That's the Holy Grail. That's what generational talent looks like, you can't just snap your finger and find those guys.

One of the reasons I'm so intrigued by Jones is that he's got old QB skills as a young QB. He started out iin the form that most premium QBs have to work hard to transition into as their bodies fall apart. he actually reminds me a little bit of Drew Brees with his current run of form. Drew had many of the same characteristics that are defining DJ's season to date. Rapid decision making leading to quick, accurate throws, distributing the ball well among his targets, old skills with a young body that kind of thing.

With this exception: Jones is bigger, stronger and more mobile than Brees ever was.

Of course the other obvious similarity with Brees is that he didn't thrive on his first team either. Not as drastically as Jones, but he had to get the hell out of San Diego to really find his forever home as a player too.

Brady had in football IQ in his own words whatever he lacked physical made up for it. You are correct on having the brain. However along with that you have to possess the physical ability to place the ball where only your guy can get it. Brady had both and became a better QB in his 30s than he was in his 20s with 3 rings. Brady said in his own words if not for Guerrero he likely would have been done by 31 as his shoulder would give him trouble. Daniel Jones was smart in taking the food that was offered to him at NYG and securing his future for his family by the contract. He chose a team like the Colts that were transitioning and likely knew he could challenge Richardson. He made the right decision and it's paying off. So if he can get them to the postseason and win a game he will likely be a long term solution for them.

I say if.. becuase so many things can happen to derail a teams postseason hopes..

 

[Real fan 02]

the other top picks at the moment (for the bettors) is Mahomes, Allen and Goff.

Taylor is on schedule to be the Offensive Player Of The Year
========
The MVP will almost surely go a QB. Mahomes, Allen, Goff and Mayfield are the betting favorites, with Maye starting to get more bets. I think that if Jones bring the colts to the title game, anything can happen in the voting.

I do expect that the MVP is likely to be one of the four QB's in the conference championships.

Agreed there. It's always going to go to the most important position wich is qb.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Do you mean Taylor or MVP Jones? Some posters have me confused... its Jones the reason why they are winning Taylor is riding his coat tails? That has to be it right...

I meant Taylor

 

[mgteich]

Wilson had an A+ deep ball. That's why it's different.

fair enough