Patriots Only Had 10 Men on the Field After a Punt?

[Ian]

While doing the snaps for this week, I noticed on one punt play - after spending probably 10 mins looking at it from every angle - that they may have only had 10 men on the field on a punt block team on Sunday. It happened after the 3rd-and-8 at their own 43 at the 12:35 mark in the fourth quarter. Based on what I've seen, I don't think they've had a "Punt Block" team on the field prior to Sunday, and based on the previous groupings, it was likely either Robert Spillane or Charles Woodson who wasn't out there:



I'll defer to @KCSVEN, who has been looking at things longer than I have, and maybe he can verify this, and I just didn't see it. However, one other note is that the special teams counts by the league matched my totals, even with the missing player. I added a "Missing.Player" on the snaps breakdown, which I had to put in after I couldn't find it.

Plus the math didn't math. If you add all the league's final special teams totals from Sunday together, they come to 186. Divide that by 11 and it comes to 16.909. 187 (adding in the missing player) comes to 17 (which was the total number of special teams plays on Sunday). So if this is correct, it looks like someone (again, probably either Spillane or Woodson) may not have made it out there.

 

[Vindicate]

Huh. Pretty important return opportunity, too. You'd hope they'd be putting themselves in position for as much of a return as they can get. Turnovers, penalties, and a failure to get all men onto the field. Woof.

 

[Ian]

I'm thinking Spillane may have been the guy. He only plays on the opponent's extra point or opponent field goal teams, so maybe there was some confusion because the rest of the personnel in that group matches, save for the other gunner, which had Minor in for I think Elliss opposite Woods. Maybe Spillane didn't realize he was supposed to be out there since he doesn't play on the punt return team...?

 

[KCSVEN]

Good catch, only 10 listed in the all 22

 

[Ian]

Good catch, only 10 listed in the all 22

Drove me nuts because the way I coded it out, I didn't account for that and I couldn't leave the name blank, so I wanted to make absolutely sure I wasn't missing something but I couldn't find the 11th guy.

 

[signbabybrady]

Ernie was on games with names again recently and Jules told the story of the very first lesson he got from him.

Ernie had asked him as a rookie what is the punt returners first responsibility?

Jules said he gave a typical answer like make the first guy miss.

The actual answer Ernie was looking for was the first thing you do when you get on the field for a punt is count the players.

So it would seem like Jones made a mistake.

Edit: there's a chance it might have been the other podcast and he might have been talking about Scar. He had some nice things to say about Scar after seeing him at his induction ceremony. Seems like an Ernie story but I'm thinking it was actually Scars lesson.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm thinking Spillane may have been the guy. He only plays on the opponent's extra point or opponent field goal teams, so maybe there was some confusion because the rest of the personnel in that group matches, save for the other gunner, which had Minor in for I think Elliss opposite Woods. Maybe Spillane didn't realize he was supposed to be out there since he doesn't play on the punt return team...?

Why would he be the guy who was supposed to be there if he isn’t on the punt return unit?
Did you look at pittsburghs other 3 punts to see who was out there?

 

[Steve102]

High School level chit here. Someone, likely the returner, is responsible for counting heads.

 

[Ian]

High School level chit here. Someone, likely the returner, is responsible for counting heads.

You can see in the film Pettus does it quickly, but he doesn't look behind him or turn around.

 

[Ian]

Why would he be the guy who was supposed to be there if he isn’t on the punt return unit?
Did you look at pittsburghs other 3 punts to see who was out there?

Of Course. Go here:

2025 Patriots Snap Counts

Complete Patriots snap counts for 2025 season. Track playing time for Drake Maye, Patriots offense, defense & special teams. Updated weekly with detailed breakdowns.

www.patsfans.com

Click on Type > "Special Teams" > Mode > "Special Teams Groupings" and then click "View Personnel"

 

[Ian]

Why would he be the guy who was supposed to be there if he isn’t on the punt return unit?
Did you look at pittsburghs other 3 punts to see who was out there?

As I said, that group basically matches the normal group that's out there for the opponent XP and FG groups. The only variation are the ones I mentioned (highlighted):

That group (Punt Block):
M.Williams
K.Chaisson
M.Jones
D.Pettus
Missing.Player
K.Minor
K.Tonga
C.Woods
K.White
J.Gibbens
B.Schooler

XP and FG Team Defense (this week):
M.Williams
K.Chaisson
C.Woodson
D.Pettus
R.Spillane
C.Elliss
K.Tonga
C.Woods
K.White
J.Gibbens
B.Schooler

Punt Return (this week):
M.Jones
J.Westover
K.Minor
D.Pettus
K.Dugger
M.Mapu
M.Robinson
C.Woods
A.Jennings
J.Gibbens
B.Schooler

 

[Ring 6]

As I said, that group basically matches the normal group that's out there for the opponent XP and FG groups. The only variation are the ones I mentioned (highlighted):

That group (Punt Block):
M.Williams
K.Chaisson
M.Jones
D.Pettus
Missing.Player
K.Minor
K.Tonga
C.Woods
K.White
J.Gibbens
B.Schooler

XP and FG Team Defense (this week):
M.Williams
K.Chaisson
C.Woodson
D.Pettus
R.Spillane
C.Elliss
K.Tonga
C.Woods
K.White
J.Gibbens
B.Schooler

Punt Return (this week):
M.Jones
J.Westover
K.Minor
D.Pettus
K.Dugger
M.Mapu
M.Robinson
C.Woods
A.Jennings
J.Gibbens
B.Schooler

Very confusing, why would we have the extra point or fg defense unit in for a punt return?
And the gunners are in.
Maybe it’s a special unit for situations where we aren’t sure if it will be a punt or a fg?

 

[Ian]

Very confusing, why would we have the extra point or fg defense unit in for a punt return?
And the gunners are in.
Maybe it’s a special unit for situations where we aren’t sure if it will be a punt or a fg?

No, I think they had that unit in to try and block the punt since it's basically the same group. I just don't know for sure if it was Spillane or Woodson who was supposed to be out there. Like I said, I'm pretty sure that's the first time they've run a punt block this year (based on that personnel), at least after what I've seen so far while doing this.

 

[Ring 6]

No, I think they had that unit in to try and block the punt since it's basically the same group. I just don't know for sure if it was Spillane or Woodson who was supposed to be out there. Like I said, I'm pretty sure that's the first time they've run a punt block this year (based on that personnel), at least after what I've seen so far while doing this.

Even stranger because from the clips it looks like they were setting up a return.

 

[Ian]

Even stranger because from the clips it looks like they were setting up a return.

Neither Woodson nor Spillane plays on the return teams...so yeah, it's definitely odd. The only ones who know for sure are in that building, and the only way I might even be able to figure it out would be if they happen to run it back out there again, but hopefully with all 11 on the field.

 

[PP2]

Ernie was on games with names again recently and Jules told the story of the very first lesson he got from him.

Ernie had asked him as a rookie what is the punt returners first responsibility?

Jules said he gave a typical answer like make the first guy miss.

The actual answer Ernie was looking for was the first thing you do when you get on the field for a punt is count the players.

So it would seem like Jones made a mistake.

Edit: there's a chance it might have been the other podcast and he might have been talking about Scar. He had some nice things to say about Scar after seeing him at his induction ceremony. Seems like an Ernie story but I'm thinking it was actually Scars lesson.

I remember the way Edelman used to count them. He'd point at each player.

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

High School level chit here. Someone, likely the returner, is responsible for counting heads.

Yup, on Edelman's podcast, he said that was the first thing Ernie Adams told him, count heads.

 

[PatsFan2]

Good catch, only 10 listed in the all 22

Attention to detail even Mayo was good at that.

 

[Gumby]

Ernie was on games with names again recently and Jules told the story of the very first lesson he got from him.

Ernie had asked him as a rookie what is the punt returners first responsibility?

Jules said he gave a typical answer like make the first guy miss.

The actual answer Ernie was looking for was the first thing you do when you get on the field for a punt is count the players.

So it would seem like Jones made a mistake.

Edit: there's a chance it might have been the other podcast and he might have been talking about Scar. He had some nice things to say about Scar after seeing him at his induction ceremony. Seems like an Ernie story but I'm thinking it was actually Scars lesson.

D Pettus has his arm up in the photo from Ian that makes it look like he is counting. (maybe)

 

[Gumby]

Neither Woodson nor Spillane plays on the return teams...so yeah, it's definitely odd. The only ones who know for sure are in that building, and the only way I might even be able to figure it out would be if they happen to run it back out there again, but hopefully with all 11 on the field.

Well they might have just gave away a tell to future teams; if that 11th guy shows up on Punt play; they will know they are going for a block.