Draft trade rumor

[Family]

That’s for you to judge.

It's ridiculous on so many levels. Why would the Giants basically give up 2 years of their draft for a 20-year-old QB that they would have to build around?

It's ridiculous that the Patriots wouldn't have taken that offer, especially since I've read that Kraft is cheap, and rookies cost less than veterans.

 

[Ring 6]

It's ridiculous on so many levels. Why would the Giants basically give up 2 years of their draft for a 20-year-old QB that they would have to build around?

It's ridiculous that the Patriots wouldn't have taken that offer, especially since I've read that Kraft is cheap, and rookies cost less than veterans.

I wasn’t asking for an analysis of whether Simmons is reporting correctly, but if he was, what is your reaction.
It seems you would have taken it.

And there is voluminous evidence of Kraft being cheap, especially the fact that he held back 40,000,000 he could have spent on veterans so yeah I bet he loves rookies.

The question would seem to be if Simmons is right who made the decision to reject it and why

 

[signbabybrady]

I wasn’t asking for an analysis of whether Simmons is reporting correctly, but if he was, what is your reaction.
It seems you would have taken it.

And there is voluminous evidence of Kraft being cheap, especially the fact that he held back 40,000,000 he could have spent on veterans so yeah I bet he loves rookies.

The question would seem to be if Simmons is right who made the decision to reject it and why

Wolf and for Maye

 

[Family]

The question would seem to be if Simmons is right who made the decision to reject it and why

If this were reported by Mike Reiss, Greg Bedard, or even someone like Zolak who we know is close to the team, ok.

So until someone with consistent connections to the team confirms this, it really is just rumor.

But Wolfe has last say, except Kraft. I didn't know that was a debate.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

What characteristics does Maye shine over Daniels?

Ive been through all this before the draft.

MOF accuracy. I believe Maye is an overall better at "rushing" bc of size ability to avoid big hits but he's still athletic and aggressive af. His size is franchise prototype. Daniels size and inability to avoid big hits absolutely will hurt him this level. Avoiding sacks - JD pressure to sack rate was terrible. Can't ignore age. I could go on.

As I've said I believe JD will flash and hit before Maye but Daniels will ultimately be more inconsistent / up & down than Maye. I like both but I would have taken Maye.

We're essentially rebuilding from scratch when you factore in the Judon trade, Barmore injury and lack of talent on the offensive side. This isn't easy and it won't be pretty. New HC, OC/offense, QB, WRs, OL. The best people in the world handicapping games think we're at best a 6/7 win team. I hope fans understand the task at hand here.

 

[Ring 6]

If this were reported by Mike Reiss, Greg Bedard, or even someone like Zolak who we know is close to the team, ok.

So until someone with consistent connections to the team confirms this, it really is just rumor.

But Wolfe has last say, except Kraft. I didn't know that was a debate.

Well Simmons got the news from someone.

The question is whether Wolfe or Kraft made the decision and which Kraft.

 

[Ring 6]

Wolf and for Maye

Do you agree that Maye is worth more than the #6, plus a 1st, 2 2nds and 2 3rds?

 

[signbabybrady]

Do you agree that Maye is worth more than the #6, plus a 1st, 2 2nds and 2 3rds?

I think so unless he's not good

 

[Family]

Well Simmons got the news from someone.

The question is whether Wolfe or Kraft made the decision and which Kraft.

Evidently, he got the news from a source no one else knows.

The people who do have known credible sources, inside the organization, have said nothing.

What big story has Bill Simmons ever broke with the team?

So there's no question to be asked, until someone more credible confirms this.

 

[Stu Pidassle]

Age and athleticism. He just turned 22 this week. Maye's size gives him a huge advantage over the others. Maye moves and runs well so he is athletic in addition to his size. That creates a higher ceiling than Williams or Daniels. This is easy to understand so I am sure you get it. Not sure why you avoid telling the whole story.

Williams and Daniels are definitely better QBs in 2024 and 2025. No doubt about that. But we do not want a QB for 5 years or less. Will Maye develop and emerge? Maye looked great on the 1st drive last week, and then his footwork and timing were off the next few drives. So who knows? Maybe Maye develops into a QB like Allen, or maybe he is a bust.

Either way Williams and Daniels have a higher floor. You are right about that. Maye has a higher ceiling than either guy, and the Pats picked Maye, so we have to wait and see.

Just as important as the raw physical attributes necessary to take NFL punishment, Maye passes the IT test. The leadership and intangibles are the most unpredictable attribute when picking a QB. He is a natural leader with a calm, confident demeanor without being ****y, works hard, learns from his mistakes and has a competitive streak. The comments from his teammates seem much more genuine than the Mac works so hard he deserves to be successful feedback we heard the last couple of years. Even though he isn't starting Maye has already passed his first development milestone and established that he is better than Brissett. Based on the very limited sample size, it he looks like the real deal who can become the franchise QB for a long time.

 

[Ring 6]

Evidently, he got the news from a source no one else knows.

The people who do have known credible sources, inside the organization, have said nothing.

What big story has Bill Simmons ever broke with the team?

So there's no question to be asked, until someone more credible confirms this.

It’s something that’s out there, so surely it’s something to discuss.
You seemed to be threatened by it. Why?

 

[Ring 6]

I think so unless he's not good

Well he will have to be really, really, really good not just not bad to be worth more than that haul.
I certainly hope he is.

 

[KCSVEN]

That Simmons thing was from Hard Knocks where Wolfe said to the Giants GM:

"If you offer us 1,2,3 this year, and 1,2 Next year- I mean I'm exaggerating" and the GM from Giants responds, "It would take something crazy like that?"
Giants then ask if a 1 this, a 1 next and something added this year would not be enough and Wolfe says not enough, and GM from Giants basically says not happening.

This was reported by ESPN, CBS sports and a few their outlets at the time also so this is likely what happened and probably did not change after this call.

"General manager Joe Schoen called the Patriots at 3:32 p.m. ET on the afternoon of the draft's first round and offered the Giants' first-round pick (No. 6 overall), a first-rounder in 2025 and another pick this year. "

In the last Decade I had Drake Maye, Patrick Mahomes and Justin Herbert as 1,2 and 3 as prospects by a wide margin to the next guy. I would have traded three # 1's for Maye.
If you feel like Maye is/was not that level of prospect or a top 5 NFL QB the next decade, and you think JJ McCarthy was good enough, then you would make that Simmons trade, though that trade likely did not exist.

 

[signbabybrady]

Well he will have to be really, really, really good not just not bad to be worth more than that haul.
I certainly hope he is.

You don't already know?

 

[rochrist]

Evidently, he got the news from a source no one else knows.

The people who do have known credible sources, inside the organization, have said nothing.

What big story has Bill Simmons ever broke with the team?

So there's no question to be asked, until someone more credible confirms this.

Never interrupt Felger when he's on a roll.

 

[Family]

It’s something that’s out there, so surely it’s something to discuss.
You seemed to be threatened by it. Why?

You said you started the thread to discuss this.

That the report is not true is the only thing worth discussing.

 

[signbabybrady]

Never interrupt Felger when he's on a roll.

 

[palialka]

Who the **** is Bill Simmons

Simmons is a local Boston reporter who went national. He’s known more for his Celtics coverage than the other 3 Boston teams but he does chime in on the Patriots on occasion. He’s pretty good overall but he can get annoying sometimes like all the press.

 

[palialka]

Assuming what Simmons said is true, that would have been quite a haul for the #3 pick. However, if you think that the QB at #3 is a real deal franchise QB, you stay put and draft him. That’s how I believe the Patriots feel about Maye. Let’s see how this decision pans out.

 

[Hugepatsfan]

Honestly, it's an impossible question for me to fully answer because I don't know how to scout QBs.

What I CAN say definitively is that if they didn't take Maye they were going to need to eventually address the QB position. I think we can all accept that as fact.

This isn't fact, but I am of the opinion that a better path forward for this organization would be to build with a young QB through the draft as opposed to stacking the rest of the roster to the point a proven QB worth going for would want to sign or be traded here. I think we're starting almost at ground zero with the talent on this team and it'd take at least 2 years of good to great drafts and FA hauls to where we're even approaching that territory.

I'm also of the belief that you don't skimp out on the QB. You don't take the lesser prospect because you can get him later. The bust rate is too high at that position to take less than you're favorite attainable prospect. So I would not have been in favor of the idea of trading back to take a QB prospect they think lesser of in this draft (like McCarthy) just to get extra picks. Because ultimately, those extra picks don't matter if you miss on the QB or only semi-hit to the point he's not good enough to win with. Your franchise will be stuck in the mud in that case.

So with the backdrop of those two points, if we didn't take Maye I think we'd have to be budgeting future draft capital for a QB. It wouldn't have made sense to invest high picks in a QB they liked less this year. And planning to take a QB in the future is uncertain, especially with a supposedly weak class next year. Even if you like a guy, you never know if you'll be in position to draft one. You could take the picks this year and end up giving them back to move up next year for a different QB that might not be as good (or could be better, to be fair).

A trade offer like this is a win if you end up getting a great QB later and keeping the picks. But I really just think it's too hard to predict that. I think you have to just evaluate the QB on the board for you and go with your scouting report. If they took Maye just because they felt they needed a QB this year and were going to take the top guy at #3 no matter what, then it's a terrible organizational decision. Even if they hit on Maye, that being their logic indicates they'll most likely fail at building around him because it implies terrible incompetence. But if their scouting report genuinely indicates that he was worth hitching their franchise wagon to, then I think they made the right call.