PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

Patriots currently projected to finish last in AFC East in 2023 by Vegas


And the Patriots have more holes than Swiss cheese we are not Three players away. :rolleyes: So the "it's just March crowd" better hope we hit on our FA and Draft acquisitions.
Umm, ya.

Look, there's a lot of you all that love to hand wring and basically complain that they don't win the off-season. I just don't get that wound up over it until we know what they look like coming in to camp. Likely, the biggest acquisition of the off-season is BoB. He will have the biggest impact on the most important position, the QB. I would expect the QB to be much better, and with that the rest of the offense. I could care less what the odds are right now. The season doesn't start right now.
 
I was talking strictly about player personnel... you know this because I already said Patricia was a colossal mistake.
You're not strictly talking about player personnel when you're also commenting on Patricia who was a major offseason move, which you admit was a colossal mistake but then claim it's a fact that the offseason was good. Doesn't add up.

The big spending spree in 2021 was because the cupboard was bare and the Pats made a decision to clear dead cap in 2020. The Patriots spent to the cap every season for two decades, the only thing that changed in 2021 was the amount of money they had to spend and available starting positions that needed to be filled.
That they spent to the cap isn't the point. How well did they spend their money is the question. Jonnu comes with a $17.2 mil cap hit in 2023 (second highest on the roster). They can't get rid of him either because he has a $19 mil dead cap, which is the highest on the roster by $6 mil.

Agholor had a $14.9 mil cap hit in 2022, virtually tied for the highest with Hunter Henry, who also wasn't worth the money. They paid Bourne $6.4 mil to be in Patricia's doghouse for the season. The list goes on.

It's funny how you remember to mention Jonnu and Agholor but forget to mention Judon, Hunter Henry, Mills, Andrews, Godchaux, Bourne, Folk and others.
I'll just cut to the chase... what do they have to show for that $159.6 mil spending spree? I'll concede Judon.
I mentioned Judon.

I like Henry as a player, but he didn't earn his money last season, and he needs to the 3rd or 4th concern for a defense to be effective.

I don't like Mills. I like Bourne a lot but as I just mentioned he got stepped over last season because Patricia didn't like him (for unexplained reasons).

Folk represents 1% of the cap so he's pretty irrelevant to this discussion.
 
Umm, ya.

Look, there's a lot of you all that love to hand wring and basically complain that they don't win the off-season. I just don't get that wound up over it until we know what they look like coming in to camp. Likely, the biggest acquisition of the off-season is BoB. He will have the biggest impact on the most important position, the QB. I would expect the QB to be much better, and with that the rest of the offense. I could care less what the odds are right now. The season doesn't start right now.
Yeah a lot of things need to happen for us I hope we are somewhat competitive with Bills this year we looked very overmatched last year. The Jets and Miami were both competitive with them unlike us. You can see why they have made and are pondering certain move the Bills are a little shaky to Jets and Miami not us.
 
He will have the biggest impact on the most important position, the QB.
I don't think this is a given, at least not to the extent you're suggesting. O'Brien should be a significant upgrade at OC but the QB has had issues since week 13 of 2021. Mac also hasn't shown the potential for a high ceiling... over a stretch of games, consecutive games, and rarely even in a single game.
 
Hard to disagree as things currently stand. Would love to be proven wrong this season.
 
Yeah a lot of things need to happen for us I hope we are somewhat competitive with Bills this year we looked very overmatched last year. The Jets and Miami were both competitive with them unlike us. You can see why they have made and are pondering certain move the Bills are a little shaky to Jets and Miami not us.
Allen struggled against the Jets defense last season. He torched the Dolphins. The Bills week 3 loss to the Dolphins was a fluke. The last 3 seasons, Allen has combined for 18 TDs and 2 INTs with a 6-1 record against the Patriots (the one loss coming in the wind storm).
 
I don't think this is a given, at least not to the extent you're suggesting. O'Brien should be a significant upgrade at OC but the QB has had issues since week 13 of 2021. Mac also hasn't shown the potential for a high ceiling... over a stretch of games, consecutive games, and rarely even in a single game.
Given the relatively small sample size, I will chalk the 2021 slide to the rookie wall, and I am throwing out the disastrous 2022 season. I am taking a very much wait-and-see approach to this season. I don't think Mac is going to morph into Mahomes/Allen/Burrow, but I believe he can be much more competitive than he showed in 2022.
 
You're not strictly talking about player personnel when you're also commenting on Patricia who was a major offseason move, which you admit was a colossal mistake but then claim it's a fact that the offseason was good. Doesn't add up.
Don't be coy... scroll back, I specifically told you Patricia was a massive mistake already. I believe with Josh McDaniels or O'Brien (a year earlier) this was a 10-11 win team last year. They weren't losing due to a lack of talent.
That they spent to the cap isn't the point. How well did they spend their money is the question. Jonnu comes with a $17.2 mil cap hit in 2023 (second highest on the roster). They can't get rid of him either because he has a $19 mil dead cap, which is the highest on the roster by $6 mil.

Agholor had a $14.9 mil cap hit in 2022, virtually tied for the highest with Hunter Henry, who also wasn't worth the money. They paid Bourne $6.4 mil to be in Patricia's doghouse for the season. The list goes on.
In 2021 they paid Cam Newton peanuts in the offseason and clearly knew they were taking a QB in that draft. You can't have a rookie QB join a team made up of rookie players surrounding him. That would be the blind leading the blind. The team needed veteran offensive players to put around him, even if it meant paying a little more for it.

Agholor was signed to a two year deal, he was a short term fix. He is already gone and didn't cost that much. If he hadn't reverted back to his fumbling ways he was the same player he was the past few years. Grumbling about him is ridiculous, it was a two year deal.

Jonnu was signed to replace the FB position, in year one McDaniels didn't utilize him. McDaniels was the guy who brought the FB position back after Bill O'Brien left the first time and Hernandez left for prison. The first player McDaniels signed as the new coach of the Raiders was Jakob Johnson. It's clear Josh preferred a traditional FB to a 2 TE set. In 2022 Patricia running the offense couldn't utilize anyone correctly, he was a dumpster fire.

They'll never get those two years back for Jonnu, the most Bill O'Brien can do now is maximize his capabilities and utilizer him now. He's the same good player he was when they signed him and Obie was the coordinator here when they were running two TE sets with no traditional FB back in the 2010's. The Pats have among the most cap space in the league, why are you worried about Jonny's salary?
I mentioned Judon.
You ignored him and all the good free agents they signed in 2021 and focused solely on Agholor and Jonnu. It's what disingenuous agenda pushers do.
I like Henry as a player, but he didn't earn his money last season, and he needs to the 3rd or 4th concern for a defense to be effective.
Patricia was a dumpster fire, how many times are you going to ignore this to push your agenda. The year before last Henry led the entire NFL in TE touchdowns.
I don't like Mills. I like Bourne a lot but as I just mentioned he got stepped over last season because Patricia didn't like him (for unexplained reasons).
You think all our best players suck. Mills was sorely missed last season when he went down with injury and big tall WR's like the Bengals feasted on our small slot CB's playing out of position. Football is about matchups, that means athleticism, height and mass.
Folk represents 1% of the cap so he's pretty irrelevant to this discussion.
You ignored everyone else as well, they all add up.
 
Allen struggled against the Jets defense last season. He torched the Dolphins. The Bills week 3 loss to the Dolphins was a fluke. The last 3 seasons, Allen has combined for 18 TDs and 2 INTs with a 6-1 record against the Patriots (the one loss coming in the wind storm).
I rest my case your Honor.
 
I thought we were competitive with the Bills in the season finale. The team was coached scared in the first game in Foxboro and it showed. The second game was much better. Take away the special teams breakdowns and it's a much closer game or even a different outcome. The Bills were on an emotional high, the game was in Buffalo, and realistically the Patriots should have had been blown right the eff out of the stadium. That didn't happen. Mac also played one of his better games last season.
 
Given the relatively small sample size, I will chalk the 2021 slide to the rookie wall, and I am throwing out the disastrous 2022 season. I am taking a very much wait-and-see approach to this season. I don't think Mac is going to morph into Mahomes/Allen/Burrow, but I believe he can be much more competitive than he showed in 2022.
You're pretty forgiving but most of this is fair.
 
You're pretty forgiving but most of this is fair.
What are my choices? B!tch like some of the negative nancies? Not how I choose to be a fan of this team. Just wait and see is the best approach as far as I am concerned. They might eff up the draft and not land anyone of consequence in free agency, and they might hit home runs in both areas. Time will tell, I just choose to not be pissed off at them because they haven't done anything as of March 13, just like I choose to put '22 in the rear view mirror. On to Cincinnati.

EDITED to correct missing not*
 
Last edited:
I thought we were competitive with the Bills in the season finale. Take away the special teams breakdowns and it's a much closer game or even a different outcome. The Bills were on an emotional high, the game was in Buffalo, and the Patriots should have had the doors blown off them. That didn't happen. Mac also played one of his better games last season.
Mac had 3 picks. I thought Buffalo just toyed with the Patriots in that game. When your KO returner spots you 14 points, it opens up your margin for error elsewhere. If Gab Davis was the broad side of a barn, Allen couldn't hit him that night at all. Basically Diggs killed the Patriots secondary and Allen hit to perfectly thrown deep shots for TDs.

On a side note, compare those deep throws by Allen to any comparable attempts by Mac... the difference is striking.
 
What are my choices? B!tch like some of the negative nancies? Not how I choose to be a fan of this team. Just wait and see is the best approach as far as I am concerned. They might eff up the draft and not land anyone of consequence in free agency, and they might hit home runs in both areas. Time will tell, I just choose to be be pissed off at them because they haven't done anything as of March 13, just like I choose to put '22 in the rear view mirror. On to Cincinnati.
I understand where you're coming from and I'm trying to be respectful of your point of view even though it's different from mine. I think "*****ing" is ok too provided you elaborate on your "negativity." Time will tell, I agree, but in the interim, we have to talk about something (positive or negative), right?
 
I understand where you're coming from and I'm trying to be respectful of your point of view even though it's different from mine. I think "*****ing" is ok too provided you elaborate on your "negativity." Time will tell, I agree, but in the interim, we have to talk about something (positive or negative), right?
Talking about it is fine, but you know as as well as anyone there's a whole bunch of posters that just complain.
 
Mac had 3 picks. I thought Buffalo just toyed with the Patriots in that game. When your KO returner spots you 14 points, it opens up your margin for error elsewhere. If Gab Davis was the broad side of a barn, Allen couldn't hit him that night at all. Basically Diggs killed the Patriots secondary and Allen hit to perfectly thrown deep shots for TDs.

On a side note, compare those deep throws by Allen to any comparable attempts by Mac... the difference is striking.
There were context on those picks and I posted about that a while ago and included images on them. One was on a pass that went through Henry's hands on a high throw where he was trying to make a play and put it where only Henry could get it on a 3rd and forever. Another was on a ball thrown slightly behind Harris that went off his hands and got picked. People talk about that game like Mac threw it right to the other team, and that's not how it played out. And he put together a fairly solid game before the two kickoff returns.

And if you're going to constantly compare Mac to Allen, then I guess you and others won't ever be happy. Although fans in Buffalo are doing the same nonsense about Allen and trying to run him out of town also, so this is clearly not just a New England-centric thing. QBs don't grow on trees and the fact remains that for those people looking to kick Mac to the curb, it doesn't change the fact that you still need someone lining up on Sundays. This means you need to get the most out of who you have until someone better comes along.

Right now, he's still better than any other street free-agent no one else wants, and he costs nothing, so it makes sense to let them hopefully put some people around him and see how 2023 plays out.
 
We have the best QB in the division and a real OC this year.

Imagine being one of the virgins projecting NE to finish last in the division. If you are one of these autism stricken nerds, I strongly urge you to go out and get laid.
 
We have the best QB in the division and a real OC this year.

Imagine being one of the virgins projecting NE to finish last in the division. If you are one of these autism stricken nerds, I strongly urge you to go out and get laid.
When did the Pats pick up Josh Allen?
 
They didn't. Why would they? The guy sucks.
That is objectively not true.

(Also, I like Mac and I think he has potential to be a pretty good QB in the NFL...you can win with pretty good)
 


Friday Patriots Notebook 5/3: News and Notes
Thursday Patriots Notebook 5/2: News and Notes
Wednesday Patriots Notebook 5/1: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Jerod Mayo’s Appearance on WEEI On Monday
Tuesday Patriots Notebook 4/30: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Drake Maye’s Interview on WEEI on Jones & Mego with Arcand
MORSE: Rookie Camp Invitees and Draft Notes
Patriots Get Extension Done with Barmore
Monday Patriots Notebook 4/29: News and Notes
Patriots News 4-28, Draft Notes On Every Draft Pick
Back
Top