Game Day Thread Official Post Game Thread- Vikings beat the Pats

[Zuma]

I haven't read any of these pages...needed a break after the game. I'm sure this is probably not a popular theme right now but I think Mac played very good. I see a lot of improvement from previous games this year. IMO we will win a lot of games if he and the team continue to play the same way.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

Henry NOT stepping out of bounds was so STUPID the team would be 1000% in the right to fine his dumba$$$ 10K for "Idiocy unacceptable for a professional Apple Picker".
I hope they took turns punching him in the face, and kicking Strong in the nuts.
Couple of fkn IDIOTS that directly affected the outcome of the game.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I would think having BB's respect, as a player or coach, is a point of honor. Thielen was an idiot during that odd sideline exchange four years ago; probably too late for him to apologize, though.

I can understand players not holding BB in regard. They may believe in the cheating BS or after making millions have little appreciation for coaches, etc.

...but he sought out BB in a 1/2 -assed way. Juvenile.

 

[Ian]

 

[crawhammer]

So many plays went against us

1. Judon untimely offside penalty on 3rd down ( 7 points and drive extension)
2. Bourne PI not called ( - 4 points)
3. Hunter Henry touchdown reversal ( -4)
4. Agholor dropping a dime from Mac Jones ( - 7 point equalizer)
5. Meyers and rham dropping passes killing drive
6. Special teams gaffe 1 - return touchdown ( 7 points gift)
7. Special teams gaffe 2 - roughing kicker ( 7 points gift)
8. Dugger slipping on coverage to hockensen ( 7 points instead of 3)
9. Jonathan Jones not able to recover 1 of the 50% interception chances ( - 3 down)

You even missed a few. Also, how many of the self-inflicted errors in this game are we putting on the coaching staff? Too many times last night they looked like a poorly coached team.

 

[Toofy]

You even missed a few. Also, how many of the self-inflicted errors in this game are we putting on the coaching staff? Too many times last night they looked like a poorly coached team.

I would definitely put significant blame on coaching especially special teams for not getting them ready for this game . We can't lose 14 points through special teams and average punt around 30 yards inside a dome. Unacceptable .

 

[captain stone]

Didn’t seem like it. Had two stupid face mask penalties, plus another dropped int he should have came up with.

Yeah the face mask penalties were bad… The INT was no gimme however… I was more upset that he couldn’t find a way to get his hands through some of those catches by Jefferson…

 

[venecol]

Listening to the CONSTANT whine of at least the last 3 pages is unbearable. Listen folks, this was a FOOTBALL game. Get a little perspective here. In EVERY football game there are going to be dozens of mistakes, errors, and questionable calls, even in games you win. DEAL with it. It is literally a no-win situation for many of you. When I read some of the tripe in this thread, I can only picture 2 year olds having a tantrum, or the archetype sulking teenager.

This team had to endure having to travel on a short week, perhaps the most single biggest disadvantage to overcome. They got the short stick of the officiating. They made 2 critical mistakes in the kicking game (see the bad officiating) which ended up costing them the game. And actually you could add 2 more. The 26 yd punt at the end of the game which allowed the Vikes to pin the Pats back at the 12, even though the D got the 3 and out. AND the fact MJones should not have tried to return that last punt. It cost us time and field position. But that was a judgment call, so I might be nitpicking here on the last one.

The point I'm trying to make here is the Pats were set up for failure for a number of reasons. The VIkes have a great RB, 3 top receivers, and top 12 QB. Yet the Pats went toe to toe with them and just missed on a few plays, while the Vikes seems to make theirs (or at least Jefferson did. This game SHOULD have been 26-26 with the Pats with the ball with a minute left to win the game. What more can you ask for as a fan.

Oh, I forgot we are now a fan base that will complain about EVERY questionable play call. EVERY mistake made by a player, etc and IGNORE any positive play that doesn't fit the narrative the whiners are trying to spin.

There's complaining/whining and excuse making. Not sure which is worse.

 

[crawhammer]

Henry's catch was called a TD, and there was no indisputable evidence overturn it. His hand was under the ball, the hand hit the ground, and as he brought the hand & ball to his body the ball moved slightly while away from the ground. No way to determine if the ball itself hit the ground when his hand did, because his hand was clearly under the ball - you'd need a worm's angle to definitively know. The movement of the ball could have been caused by the hand hitting the ground, not the ball hitting the ground.

100% was not a catch. Ball clearly hit the ground and Henry clearly lost control of the ball.

The roughing the kicker: I may be wrong, but wasn't it more than 5 yards to go for the 1st? And isn't there both a 5 yard and 15 yard version of this penalty? Did they call the 15 yard version for what happened? The kicker left his foot way up just to draw contact, and Strong made contact with the sole of his shoe - not a dangerous hit at all.

Belichick's sideline interaction with Strong Jr. after the play is all you need to know about this one.

The kickoff return - how obvious does a hold have to be? Dugger was directly beside the lane the runner took, no more than 3' from him along the sideline. Blatantly held by the shoulder as he tried to make the tackle. That is a call that can't be missed.

Refs missed one there. They got a break on obvious non-call on the Marcus Jones punt return against the Jets. These things have a way of balancing out over the course of a season.

 

[slash83]

Yeah the face mask penalties were bad… The INT was no gimme however… I was more upset that he couldn’t find a way to get his hands through some of those catches by Jefferson…

Yeah wasn’t a gimme but that’s the second time that’s happened this season which isn’t bad but still would like to see him make the play.

Yes I agree with you.

 

[RobertWeathers]

100% was not a catch. Ball clearly hit the ground and Henry clearly lost control of the ball.

No. Call on the field was a TD. One angle had his hand under the ball. The other ground first. Video evidence needs to irrefutable to overturn the call on the field. It wasn't.

 

[crawhammer]

No. Call on the field was a TD. One angle had his hand under the ball. The other ground first. Video evidence needs to irrefutable to overturn the call on the field. It wasn't.

Can you repeat that and then still tell me it wasn't irrefutable?? You're acknowledging one angle showed the ball hit the ground. Who cares what some other obstructed view showed at that point?

 

[Ian]

Interesting comparison when it comes to the receiving totals of a couple of players.

For those looking at the other totals (the earlier Mac Tweet), Brian Hoyer skewed these with a 3/3 (100%) 85yds 1 TD performance at Cleveland in 2021.

 

[captain stone]

I understand people want to romanticize the Bledsoe/Brady thing, but as I've said repeatedly, it's not the same thing. And for those who want to say that Zappe is the answer, they seem to forget Zappe's 4th QTR against Chicago:

View attachment 47663

Not that I enjoy pointing that out because I'm not a big fan of s****** on our own players when Zappe's a great kid that didn't ask to be in this position.

At the same time, it's just strange to me that when Zappe played well, it was fine but when he had a tough second half (where they were shutout - BTW) it was either "the coaches suck" or the "team just sucks". Which I'm assuming is what would happen if he replaced Mac and also struggled with Patricia calling for reverses in odd situations.

This is such a bizarre year to say the least. Mac isn't a 5-year vet who hit his ceiling years ago. The kid's in his second season and missed a month's worth of football. I've also seen a fair amout of failed comeback attempts by Justin Herbert so far in Los Angeles. Is he a JAG with a better arm? I mean...it is what it is. It takes several seasons before you really know what you have.

Either way, these are the growing pains we're going to have to deal with and all of this is going to sort itself out eventually. Zappe's a rookie and they aren't in any rush with him. If he's ultimately the guy, we'll find out. If he's not, we'll find that out too. But the fact people are giving up on a kid who has barely been in the league for over a year, especially after everything that went wrong that he had nothing to do with (the kickoff return for a touchdown, the call on Hunter Henry, the running into the kicker call, etc.), is a little ridiculous.

All that typing, and you & others still fail to see the (or at least my) main argument: Zappy NEVER should’ve been removed from the starting gig in the first place. No reason Whatsoever to do so; and when it did happen, in prime time when everyone ass-umed that Bill would surpass Papa Bear, the results were a predictable, unprofessional, incompetent Catastrophe… Zappy should’ve remained the starter until he sucked in a game as badly as Corky has sucked in Multiple games this & last season. Everything Corky’s done (i.e.: losing, or sucking while winning) should Never Have Happened… And please don’t insult our intelligence by claiming that Zappy couldn’t have “accomplished “ what Corky did to “win” those games vs the Jete & Indy Blood Clots… Pats won IN SPITE OF Corky, not because of him…or his choke-ass circus clown play-caller.

 

[Ian]

All that typing, and you & others still fail to see the (or at least my) main argument: Zappy NEVER should’ve been removed from the starting gig in the first place. No reason Whatsoever to do so; and when it did happen, in prime time when everyone ass-umed that Bill would surpass Papa Bear, the results were a predictable, unprofessional, incompetent Catastrophe… Zappy should’ve remained the starter until he sucked in a game as badly as Corky has sucked in Multiple games this & last season. Everything Corky’s done (i.e.: losing, or sucking while winning) should Never Have Happened… And please don’t insult our intelligence by claiming that Zappy couldn’t have “accomplished “ what Corky did to “win” those games vs the Jete & Indy Blood Clots… Pats won IN SPITE OF Corky, not because of him…or his choke-ass circus clown play-caller.

He's - for now - their future quarterback, and in his second season, they need to evaluate him and figure out if that's going to stay the same, or if they're going to make a change. Zappe ended up in a perfect situation. He got sat down when his stock was at its highest, even despite the second half against the Bears.

As I said, Mac will need to continue this trajectory, or it's going to set up a situation next summer where Zappe, with the same offseason jump Mac had, could overtake him. But they needed to give him the opportunity because honestly, he's earned it. You don't bench the guy who won 10 games for you the previous season after three games in a new system with an offensive line that, at the time, was a complete mess.

But that's why Mac was put back in. There were other issues that complicated that rough start, which the coaches clearly took into consideration, or he wouldn't have gone back in. But as I mentioned in a previous post, that whole situation will play itself out, and with Zappe being a rookie, there's not the same urgency to make that decision just yet.

 

[crawhammer]

The point I'm trying to make here is the Pats were set up for failure for a number of reasons. The VIkes have a great RB, 3 top receivers, and top 12 QB. Yet the Pats went toe to toe with them and just missed on a few plays, while the Vikes seems to make theirs (or at least Jefferson did. This game SHOULD have been 26-26 with the Pats with the ball with a minute left to win the game. What more can you ask for as a fan.

There were too many in-game self-inflicted errors by the Patriots to put this loss on intangibles. You're overrating the Vikings too. Cook played like ass and they have 1.5 top receivers with Jefferson clearly in a class by himself. It's probably debatable how good the Vikings offense really is but there's no doubt their defense sucks and will certainly be their quick downfall in the postseason.

 

[captain stone]

I don’t know if he’s gutless. He stands tall in the pocket in the face of the rush. But he whines and cries like a little b.itch when everything isn’t going his way. He runs way too hot and it’s folly to think it doesn’t negatively affect his play. Maybe this is something that will correct itself over time, with maturity, or not. I hope it does.

What makes him Dead to me (until he shows otherwise) is that he has purposefully and Multiple Times now fallen short of the line to gain during a scramble when danger wasn’t exactly what I would call Imminent… And what has followed practically Every Single Time is failure to convert that bit of yardage on the Very Next Play… Almost Always a pass attempt.

 

[cmasspatsfan]

Can you repeat that and then still tell me it wasn't irrefutable?? You're acknowledging one angle showed the ball hit the ground. Who cares what some other obstructed view showed at that point?

Did the ground aid in him catching the ball? You see that play in the middle of the field all the time and if the recievers hands under the ball they call it a catch 100% of the time. He lost control when he brought it into his body and the ball hit his facemask, the ground didn't jar it loose.

 

[captain stone]

Wouldn't reaching the ball across the goal line be considered a football move?

Not when the catch process has yet to be completed.

 

[Ian]