Zappe vs Mac

[Rob0729]

This is something Jones rarely had the first three weeks - a clean pocket and his primary receiver wide open down the field. That was awful coverage.

 

[Rob0729]

Until the networks hear otherwise, they are going under the assumption that Jones is not going to play.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

This is all your opinion. Since when is winning the most super bowls or SB MVPs a prerequisite to being the greatest? Brady is the most accomplished NFL player in history. But he’s not the most talented. And Mahomes is just getting started. He got his first MVP in his first year as starter. Brady did not get his until he was 7 years into the league. And if it weren't for a fluky offsides by Dee Ford, Mahomes would have won the super bowl his first year as starter too.

Yeah yeah if my Aunty had balls she’d be my uncle. If Jimmy G and Shanny hadn’t choked away, Mahomes wouldn’t even have 1

When Brady came into the league, the NFL was different. Different rules, different style. Passing numbers weren’t inflated.

“Talent” what an obscure word. Im sorry Brady isn’t as pleasing on your eyes. How about “accomplished”…Mahomes isn’t in the same stratosphere as Tom Brady and most likely will never be.

 

[Nikolai]

I like to see the age old debates back up to ponder over again. Who's the GOAT?

Manning vs. Brady
Montana vs. Brady
Rodgers vs. Brady
Mahomes vs. Brady

Seems there's a common factor here. Wonder why we don't see any Mahomes vs. Montana talk...or Rodgers vs. Montana. It's almost like people have a problem with Brady, specifically, and want to find someone, anyone to supplant him.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

This is all your opinion. Since when is winning the most super bowls or SB MVPs a prerequisite to being the greatest? Brady is the most accomplished NFL player in history. But he’s not the most talented. And Mahomes is just getting started. He got his first MVP in his first year as starter. Brady did not get his until he was 7 years into the league. And if it weren't for a fluky offsides by Dee Ford, Mahomes would have won the super bowl his first year as starter too.

Also it’s not my opinion Brady is the GOAT. At this point it’s widely accepted by even his most ardent haters

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Yeah yeah if my Aunty had balls she’d be my uncle. If Jimmy G and Shanny hadn’t choked away, Mahomes wouldn’t even have 1

When Brady came into the league, the NFL was different. Different rules, different style. Passing numbers weren’t inflated.

“Talent” what an obscure word. Im sorry Brady isn’t as pleasing on your eyes. How about “accomplished”…Mahomes isn’t in the same stratosphere as Tom Brady and most likely will never be.

LOL lots of people choked against Brady and the Pats, man.

Also it’s not my opinion Brady is the GOAT. At this point it’s widely accepted by even his most ardent haters

Yeah it is. Not everyone shares that sentiment. Go on any team's message board and there is still talk of the Pats being cheaters. Brady being the GOAT is not a universally accepted statement. What is widely accepted is him being the most accomplished quarterback in NFL history. But that doesn't translate him into being the most talented.

 

[Nikolai]

For anyone wondering feeding into the Zappe spreads the ball around better than Jones, here's the breakdown on that:

Spreading the Love: Ball Distribution Totals Between Bailey Zappe and Mac Jones | PatsFans.com

With Mac Jones still sidelined with an injury, New England Patriots fans have been debating various stats, including little nuances within the offense where they believe one may excel over another. One topic of discussion that's come up in recent days has been who does a better job in terms of...

www.patsfans.com

I might have a small quibble with the analysis here. The most recent game against the Browns had Zappe completing 4 passes to five different targets. Mac did have a similar look in the Ravens game (4+ completions to 4 targets), but the distribution was still a bit more top heavy with Parker getting 10 targets. While there isn't the huge difference that people want to highlight in defense of "their man", Zappe's performance in Cleveland was certainly noteworthy for the even nature of his distribution, just as much for the breadth of it.

For the record, I'm agnostic on which one should start. Going with the ol' IBBWT

 

[Ian]

I like to see the age old debates back up to ponder over again. Who's the GOAT?

Manning vs. Brady
Montana vs. Brady
Rodgers vs. Brady
Mahomes vs. Brady

Seems there's a common factor here. Wonder why we don't see any Mahomes vs. Montana talk...or Rodgers vs. Montana. It's almost like people have a problem with Brady, specifically, and want to find someone, anyone to supplant him.

I cringe to think what might have happened had Garoppolo not gotten hurt in 2016, especially given all the talk to potentially trade Brady when Cassel was playing well in 2008.

I don't know...it's just weird. I don't get why we can't have an appreciation for two guys on the roster without tearing down the other. I mean, how many teams can lose a starter and take their time getting him back because they have a suitable guy who can win games playing behind them? Aside from what's going on in Dallas, it's pretty rare. I've had fun watching Zappe play these last couple of weeks, and I'll enjoy it again if he starts Monday night. It's just too bad some of these other discussions are going on that take away from that.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

I like to see the age old debates back up to ponder over again. Who's the GOAT?

Manning vs. Brady
Montana vs. Brady
Rodgers vs. Brady
Mahomes vs. Brady

Seems there's a common factor here. Wonder why we don't see any Mahomes vs. Montana talk...or Rodgers vs. Montana. It's almost like people have a problem with Brady, specifically, and want to find someone, anyone to supplant him.

Success breeds jealousy. Even the biggest haters in the world can’t deny Brady being the GOAT anymore. The last piece of rope they clung too was brady never proved he could win in different system with a different coach like manning did. Well at age 43, he went to a franchise that hadn’t made the playoffs in the past 13 years and he knocked off Brees, Rogers, and Mahomes 3 in a row to win his 7th Super Bowl and 5th MVP at age 43. He also threw for over 40 touchdowns per year and 5,000 yards per year on his new team at ages 43-44.

They have no argument for anyone else…

 

[Ian]

I might have a small quibble with the analysis here. The most recent game against the Browns had Zappe completing 4 passes to five different targets. Mac did have a similar look in the Ravens game (4+ completions to 4 targets), but the distribution was still a bit more top heavy with Parker getting 10 targets. While there isn't the huge difference that people want to highlight in defense of "their man", Zappe's performance in Cleveland was certainly noteworthy for the even nature of his distribution, just as much for the breadth of it.

For the record, I'm agnostic on which one should start. Going with the ol' IBBWT

I limited my thoughts on things in this one, and the numbers dictate the targets. And the 10 targets to Parker I still feel like wasn't Mac's top choice, especially given how things played out. I hated every bit of that, and I've said so multiple times since.

Again, the lower target totals by Zappe, I'm sure, was also dictated by the offensive play calls. But it can't work both ways. People can't fault Mac with things like you mentioned just like they can't fault Zappe for targeting fewer players if that's, in fact, what he was asked to do.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

LOL lots of people choked against Brady and the Pats, man.

i know this is hard but just admit brady is the GOAT

 

[Nikolai]

I limited my thoughts on things in this one, and the numbers dictate the targets. And the 10 targets to Parker I still feel like wasn't Mac's top choice, especially given how things played out. I hated every bit of that, and I've said so multiple times since.

Again, the lower target totals by Zappe, I'm sure, was also dictated by the offensive play calls. But it can't work both ways. People can't fault Mac with things like you mentioned just like they can't fault Zappe for targeting fewer players if that's, in fact, what he was asked to do.

Agreed. Ultimately, one could cherry pick a given distribution of stats to compliment their argument. Of course, it would be at the expense of some intellectual integrity. Hence...we get the kind of insipid debates we've been seeing.

Again, I feel we are a fortunate franchise to have this problem. After SBLI, I can die happy as a Pats fan. I'm here chiefly for the entertainment, and while we aren't a winning machine like we used to be, I am certainly entertained.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

LOL lots of people choked against Brady and the Pats, man.



Yeah it is. Not everyone shares that sentiment. Go on any team's message board and there is still talk of the Pats being cheaters. Brady being the GOAT is not a universally accepted statement. What is widely accepted is him being the most accomplished quarterback in NFL history. But that doesn't translate him into being the most talented.

Brady is widely accepted as the GOAT. It is universal. You could poll any message board to receive that same answer..also shouldn’t have to defend my case on a patriots message board. The guy brought us 6 titles, who the F are you?Why you even here get the F out of our message board dude.

 

[Ian]

LOL lots of people choked against Brady and the Pats, man.



Yeah it is. Not everyone shares that sentiment. Go on any team's message board and there is still talk of the Pats being cheaters. Brady being the GOAT is not a universally accepted statement. What is widely accepted is him being the most accomplished quarterback in NFL history. But that doesn't translate him into being the most talented.

You're killing me with this. Again, I know it's a schtick, and you have fun doing it, but please don't make me go back and dig out all of your posts under your previous username when you gushed over Brady (I was looking at them last week after a similar interaction and sort of shaking my head over it). Because posts like this are 100% the opposite of what you used to post.

 

[TommyD4207]

This poll is embarrassing.

 

[Zuma]

This poll is embarrassing.

It's missing RLKAG

 

[Ian]

Agreed. Ultimately, one could cherry pick a given distribution of stats to compliment their argument. Of course, it would be at the expense of some intellectual integrity. Hence...we get the kind of insipid debates we've been seeing.

Again, I feel we are a fortunate franchise to have this problem. After SBLI, I can die happy as a Pats fan. I'm here chiefly for the entertainment, and while we aren't a winning machine like we used to be, I am certainly entertained.

Exactly. This is sort of what I hoped would happen two years ago and we'd have fun going into each week wondering what we'd potentially see from Stidham, and obviously that never happened. Then we got Mac, and now we're getting to watch Zappe. What's getting lost on people is that it's just going to be fun seeing it play out and whichever one ends up getting us a high draft pick, I think after the last two years, people are probably a little more confident that they'll do a good job making sure they make the most of it.

This will be something we'll all be talking about again years from now. It's just a matter of who will still be on the roster by then.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

You're killing me with this. Again, I know it's a schtick, and you have fun doing it, but please don't make me go back and dig out all of your posts under your previous username when you gushed over Brady (I was looking at them last week after a similar interaction and sort of shaking my head over it). Because posts like this are 100% the opposite of what you used to post.

I'm allowed to change my mind

 

[Simpelton]

Just because Jones CAN strap up and play doesn't mean he's 100%.

We have the luxury of letting Jones recover properly. Give Zappe the ball for at least another week and evaluate week to week until Jones is 100%, or at least is able to fully trust his body. If Zappe struggles we can push Jones back in when we have to. In the meantime, Jones can focus on really getting back into top shape to play because the team is in the hands of a capable backup.

I hope when Jones comes back under center two things are true

1. Jones is fully healthy
2. Jones has a chip on his shoulder

That's the ideal outcome for me. Make sure Mac10 is playing with an edge. Make him prove that this is his team, and keep Zappe in the mix in case this doesn't work out for him. Similar to the way Young and Montana cooperated in SF.

 

[Ian]

I'm allowed to change my mind

True, but you did a 180° and you've gone to a bit of an extreme