Tom Brady throwing coach Tom House assesses Mac

[Bill Lee]

Nobody knows Mac's ceiling, that's just nonsense. As to the average arm, does that include Tom House who asserted he needs improvement (and can achieve it)? Your paranoia is out of control. Try some risperidone, it may help.

TB12 aside, I listened to the interview and I don't think he asserted that.

What I think he did assert is almost every athlete he sees is leaving something on the table, and in that sense you can say Mac needs improvement, but then again you can say almost every athlete needs improvement.

Exactly. Not saying that Jones will even come close to Brady, but this is the Brady setup. Intangibles, like dedication, nuance, competitive edge, are hard to teach, if not impossible, by this point. If a QB doesn't have those elements by the time they're drafted into the NFL, their likelihood of success plummets.

Brady had those intangibles PLUS the undeveloped body, just like Mac. Strength can be built. Experience can be gained.

I agree. House said Mac already has the things that are tough to develop, like accuracy, physical and mental agility, toughness and competitiveness, and the mechanical stuff is relatively easy to improve.

He also said Mac is still in the "skills development" phase of life, i.e. he has room to grow, and most athletes are in that phase till age 33 or so.

I can guarantee Mac will get a throwing Coach this offseason.

House said the Patriots staff use similar methods to his. Also said a lot depends on how much effort the athlete puts into training.

It's not. Brady could care less about the past (aside from losing to Eli twice) and whatever Bill and him spoke about in that room after the Foxborough game seems to have righted the ship in their relationship. They've both done nothing but candidly praised each other after that game. It's not like they hung out together even during the good 'ol days.

Brady's already said he's looking to come back to NE to hang out after he retires. He's not dumb to piss away the fan base of an entire region over some nonsense.

He does care about the past, for instance his draft position, the "MFer" that SF kept over him i.e. Jimmy G, etc.

 

[Bill Lee]

I keep forgetting how old he is; I’ve heard on players training with him as far back as the 1990s. Then I remember that he was the one who caught Hank Aaron’s #715 and I realize just how long he’s been around.

Can we all get in on this nostalgia thing?

Any dude on any 70s Red Sox team has a place in my heart!



Source: Tom House - Wikipedia

PS: He is now 74 years of age.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

It has been mentioned over and over and over that Tom wasn't very good his rookie year. Mac had a rookie year that was statistically better than Brady's second year, and then Brady became the GOAT. That is why the comparison is being made, not that Mac will be better than or equal to or close to Brady, but rather that Brady wasn't that good his rookie year, and Mac is starting at a higher level. Hopefully Mac will put in the work needed and continue to improve like Tom did, to become an all time great qb.

 

[upstater1]

Yep, he was, no question. I do however think Brady's arm is better thasn Macs, though arm strength is certainly not his calling card. i would not want it lost that I dothink Mac is terrific and I'm glad we have him. I am skeptical, though, that he'll ever find the sort of elite level of oreover, there's no question brady arm strength has steadiltimproved as he worked with House.Mahomes/Allen/Rogers. i hope I'm wrong, and my wife would point out that my being wrong is always a very live possibility, or likelihood.


Not sure we actually disagree. Brady's arm strength is better than is often appreciated, and it improved over his career (He is a much better deep thrower now than he once was, for example, and this is attributable at least in large degree to arm strength.), but he is not in the same league with the top - what? - five arms ever. And arm strength is not his calling card in any case: that goes to his will and his intelligence and his commitment to work. Mac's arm is not presently as strong as Brady's, and I am doubtful it will ever be. It doesn't matter all that much, given Mac's other virtues, but it is a fact, I think, that he will never be as good at the sort of throws requiring major zip - deepish throws across the field into tight windows, e.g. - as other qb's who have stronger arms, even though I think it likely he will be a better qb overall than many who surpass him in this one regard. My initial point is that Mac is not now nor is ever likely to be on a par - not just re arm strength but overall - with Mahomes, Allen, Rogers, etc.,and I will stand by that even as I hope I am mistaken

I think we disagree. But I can't do any better to explain it. Sports Science measured Brady's throws and they said he had the most velocity on his throws in the NFL. I am not saying Mac will develop into Brady, or into Manning, but if he can read defenses better than the vast majority of QBs and work within a concept that emphasizes his accuracy, he has the potential to throw with a lot of zip. We'll see. But in general, NFL fans overestimate the importance of arm strength.

 

[slash83]

Question is does Mac make the move and actually go put in the work with him..

 

[captain stone]

It is doubtful that Mac will get anywhere close to where Bready is, however coming into the league Mac was ahead of where Brady was Physically, many younger fans may not appreciate that.

You mean Athletically.

 

[captain stone]

Combine numbers. Tom Brady 6'4" 211 pounds. Mac Jones 6'3" 215 pounds. Peyton Mainning 6'5" 230 pounds. Peyton was a bit bigger coming out. Brady and Mac are pretty close. Of course the extra 2" in Peyton is his forehead.

According to NFLDraftScout, Brady measured 6043, whereas Mac measured 6025.

 

[captain stone]

Can we all get in on this nostalgia thing?

Any dude on any 70s Red Sox team has a place in my heart!

View attachment 40440

Source: Tom House - Wikipedia

PS: He is now 74 years of age.

As an early teenager then, I always dug the red caps, though I still preferred the belts instead of the expando-matic wastebands...

 

[moosekill]

According to NFLDraftScout, Brady measured 6043, whereas Mac measured 6025.

I think they rounded, I looked again and it had mack at 6'2 5/8" round up to 6'3" and Brady at 6'4"and a bit, so 6'4. Either way, 11/2 inches taller and 4 pounds lighter doesn't really make Brady "much bigger" than Mac

 

[venecol]

I think they rounded, I looked again and it had mack at 6'2 5/8" round up to 6'3" and Brady at 6'4"and a bit, so 6'4. Either way, 11/2 inches taller and 4 pounds lighter doesn't really make Brady "much bigger" than Mac

It's more like 1-3/4" taller, which rounds up to 2-inches. That's a lot.

 

[BigPeteG]

It's more like 1-3/4" taller, which rounds up to 2-inches. That's a lot.

View attachment 40466

Brady is bigger I think 1.75 inches is about right - his arm is better as well.. Mac has more speed and some acceleration with regards to the lower body. I think Drew Brees is the best case comparison with Mac. We should hire one of his offense coordinators to replace McD.

Problem for Mac - and why he fell in the draft is that we are in a big arm era. Mahomes, Stafford, Allen etc - all monster arms. Drew Brees and Manning are done. Only guy that comes to mind with an average NFL arm who is dominating is Burrow. I think Jimmy G fits that as well - his arm is below average too. But 49ers don't want him. LOL.

 

[holyredeemer]

Problem for Mac - and why he fell in the draft is that we are in a big arm era. Mahomes, Stafford, Allen etc - all monster arms. Drew Brees and Manning are done. Only guy that comes to mind with an average NFL arm who is dominating is Burrow. I think Jimmy G fits that as well - his arm is below average too. But 49ers don't want him. LOL.

Some serious recency bias there. Then again, I don’t blame you. The last two mins of the Bills v Chiefs game seems to have scarred everyone’s minds. Another argument could be made. Problem for Mac is that Mahomes has Hill & Kelce. Allen has Stefan Diggs and a pretty damn solid supporting cast of receivers. Burrow has Higgins, Boyd, Chase. Stafford has Kupp & OBJ. Mac has Myers, Bourne & Ag.

 

[skinnydog]

This reminds me of something that ESPN Sports Science pointed out about Brady that many people could never understand. Sports Science did a thing on the velocity of Brady's throws, and they stated that while Brady's arm didn't compete with the top arms they had either in the studio or at combines and pro days, no one threw the ball harder or with more velocity during a game.

I submit that a QB who can read Ds, get set up quickly, can then also throw the ball harder than a QB with a bigger arm simply because his mechanics are right. As bad as Cam Newton looks throwing the ball right now, it would not surprise me if he has a cannon in combine type tests when compared to most QBs, but the guy is never set when he throws, like EVER, he throws off his back foot, diagnoses late, and his balls look like they'll never get there.

We don't know what we have in Mac yet, and we won't know for a couple years. I just hope he sticks with McD for a few years because that will go a long way in making him a great QB.

Interesting. Brady always seemed to maintain proper throwing form during the game pass after pass. Year after year. He rarely threw off his back foot or off balance. Hard to maintain that discipline, but he did. I expect that’s why his in game velocity was very good.

 

[upstater1]

.

 

[ohiopatsfan]

TB was said to have a weak arm when he first joined the Pats. Also, was undersized and slow footed. With lots of work he strengthened his arm and added muscle. Mac can do the same thing.

 

[captain stone]

TB was said to have a weak arm when he first joined the Pats. Also, was undersized and slow footed. With lots of work he strengthened his arm and added muscle. Mac can do the same thing.

6043/211 was not undersized back then... The word probably most often used to describe Brady was Gangly; all arms & legs but little muscle definition... People need to face it that Mac has Less to work with than Brady had, but that still doesn't mean that he won't improve what he does have.