N’Keal Harry Requests Trade

[RobertWeathers]

If I were BB, I'd fold this back on the agent. If the agent really believes that Harry is that good, then BB should tell him what the Patriots will take in a trade and then let the agent see if he can get a team to make that deal.

I'm betting that's what happened. Back in the late winter/early spring BB sent some feelers out trying to get a sense for Harry's market and after being offered rocks, he stood down.

BB told the agent/Harry if he could find a deal the team would accept, to go for it.

 

[50-yard-line]

The defense was stout. The issue was our skill positions being among, if not the worst, in the league. I think I see where you’re going with this, though. “The system.” If I’m right, please point me to other drafted wideouts who washed out here and went on to have success elsewhere? If not, then please expand on why Brown and Metcalf could not have enjoyed similar rookie seasons here as they did in Tennessee and Seattle, respectively.

No, that's not where I'm going.

First, I don't think Metcalf would have nearly the stats here that he got in Seattle year 1 and 2. Wilson throws a perfect ball for him - the two of them are a match made in heaven, and even there, it took a while to get it up to speed. Wilson will heave it up into coverage downfield, and those rainbows he throws are tailor made for the guy.

I do think Brown would have shined here. But would drafting them have brought Brady to OTAs?

I don't think you can go nearly as far as you're trying to here, logically.

I do get that it's a bitter pill, though. I've said it here before: I wasn't surprised that they drafted Harry, given what I was reading before the draft, but if I had been the guy drafting, the pick would have been AJ Brown.
And with Metcalf still there in Round 2, I would have grabbed him without hesitation.
I'd also have landed Hunter Renfrow. The three picks would have cost would be: Harry, Williams, and Hjalte Froholdt. Those were the three WRs I wanted. If they had done that AND (big if) it had placated Brady, maybe they wouldn't have gotten wound up in the AB trainwreck or played footsie with Josh Gordon, or traded a 2nd for Sanu.

But that's an entirely different philosophy than BB has shown. It would have meant going through the growing pains of rookie WRs. They did this exactly once before, and it failed (Dobson, Boyce, and Thompkins).

It's all hindsight and speculation on my part, of course, just like the posts thinking a pair of receiving rookies would have miraculously made Brady play like Brady and want to stay, and delivered a Lombardi to a team that ran out of steam halfway through the year for more reasons than WR.. The Pats team that got knocked out in Round 1 was a hollow fraud - the Defense had carried them through a ridiculously easy first half schedule, but any time they played a good team, they were exposed. I don't see them as being anywhere near a SB contender in 2019.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Although people get mad at you for bringing this up a lot, it’s quite alarming.

No it's not. DropKick calls everyone a bust.

 

[Deus Irae]

I do think Brown would have shined here. But would drafting them have brought Brady to OTAs?

Literally nobody on the planet outside of the team coaching/management should still be silly enough to think Brady attending, or not attending, OTAs was an issue with regards to playing ability.

 

[RobertWeathers]

There’s also the more alarming fact that Floyd Reese oversaw the drafts from 2009-12, which saw them draft almost every star player of the 2010s.

I don't think Floyd oversaw drafts. He served as more of a mentor to Caserio on the business side (contracts & cap) of GMing.

It was Bill's board. Caserio just slotted names based on the evaluation criteria.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

No it's not. DropKick calls everyone a bust.

Not true, I don't call everyone a bust don't exaggerate. I call it like it is. I can be a pit bull at times but only when it's the right point. For the record Belichick HAS been good at drafting. In fact I'd put up his draft record against anyone in the league the last 20 years. And nobody finds all-star undrafted guys like him too. But it's FACT that the horrifically bad offensive draft bust picks have happened with the exact same offensive coordinator from 2005-2008 and 2013-now. fact.

The Patriots need a new offensive coordinator, not one who only looked good with Tom Brady and was a failure at 2 external places without Tom.

 

[Dingleberry]

He was just traded to McDonald's for a Filet o Fish, 2 small fries, and a shamrock shake. I think BB should have held out for a Happy Meal toy, but both sides are celebrating the deal.

Watch him start winning Employee of the Week awards all of a sudden. Good for them if they know how to use him.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Not true. I call it like it is. I can be a pit bull at times but only when it's the right point. For the record Belichick HAS been good at drafting. In fact I'd put up his draft record against anyone in the league the last 20 years. And nobody finds all-star undrafted guys like him too. But it's FACT that the horrifically bad offensive draft bust picks have happened with the exact same offensive coordinator from 2005-2008 and 2013-now. fact.

You waaaaaay overestimate Josh's role in making picks.

 

[50-yard-line]

Literally nobody on the planet outside of the team coaching/management should still be silly enough to think Brady attending, or not attending, OTAs was an issue with regards to playing ability.

It was a sign of where he was at mentally, and that was not a good place.

If the Pats had said, "Okay, we've got three shiny new WR (rookie) toys," do you think that would have made a difference?

Asking seriously - and I'll add, if it were me in that room the weeks before the 2019 draft, I'd have asked Brady which rookie WRs he wanted, in order, then drafted the highest available with picks 1 and 2. I also would have signed Brady to whatever and however long a contract he wanted way back when. He should never have left New England, and if that meant s a couple of bad years, so be it. "You want to play to 45, Tom? Okay, show me the numbers that gets it done...."

Yes, I would have done that. But then, I'm still traumatized by watching Orr limp around in a Blackhawks jersey.

But that's in the past and I'm still a fan of the team above any player.

 

[Schmo]

I'm betting that's what happened. Back in the late winter/early spring BB sent some feelers out trying to get a sense for Harry's market and after being offered rocks, he stood down.

BB told the agent/Harry if he could find a deal the team would accept, to go for it.

That's the one way this whole situation makes sense. BB doesn't have to waste his time finding best value. Put the agent to work and Bill can just sign off on the trade.

 

[Deus Irae]

He was just traded to McDonald's for a Filet o Fish, 2 small fries, and a shamrock shake. I think BB should have held out for a Happy Meal toy, but both sides are celebrating the deal.

Watch him start winning Employee of the Week awards all of a sudden. Good for them if they know how to use him.

Ok, if BB got a Shamrock shake out of that deal, he won the trade by a mile.

 

[50-yard-line]

Not true, I don't call everyone a bust don't exaggerate. I call it like it is. I can be a pit bull at times but only when it's the right point. For the record Belichick HAS been good at drafting. In fact I'd put up his draft record against anyone in the league the last 20 years. And nobody finds all-star undrafted guys like him too. But it's FACT that the horrifically bad offensive draft bust picks have happened with the exact same offensive coordinator from 2005-2008 and 2013-now. fact.

The Patriots need a new offensive coordinator, not one who only looked good with Tom Brady and was a failure at 2 external places without Tom.

You think Michel was a horrifically bad draft choice, so there's that...

 

[50-yard-line]

Ok, if BB got a Shamrock shake out of that deal, he won the trade by a mile.

Because he also got 1.6 million in CAP space with the shake (since he won't have to cut Harry), so yeah.

 

[Deus Irae]

It was a sign of where he was at mentally, and that was not a good place.

If the Pats had said, "Okay, we've got three shiny new WR (rookie) toys," do you think that would have made a difference?

Asking seriously - and I'll add, if it were me in that room the weeks before the 2019 draft, I'd have asked Brady which rookie WRs he wanted, in order, then drafted the highest available with picks 1 and 2. I also would have signed Brady to whatever and however long a contract he wanted way back when. He should never have left New England, and if that meant s a couple of bad years, so be it. "You want to play to 45, Tom? Okay, show me the numbers that gets it done...."

Yes, I would have done that. But then, I'm still traumatized by watching Orr limp around in a Blackhawks jersey.

But that's in the past and I'm still a fan of the team above any player.

It's irrelevant to whether or not the team would have been a SB competitor. It's ridiculous to think that missing a few hours of half-practice in June torpedoed an entire season that started off 8-0. Stop with that nonsense.

 

[DropKickFlutie]

You think Michel was a horrifically bad draft choice, so there's that...

For a 1st rounder absolutely it was a bad pick, just like Maroney was a bad pick with a 1st rounder. I think 20 other RBs would have also won a ring in 2018 running behind that dominant OLine and Gronk. And Michel defenders have no recourse explaining why Michel's option wasn't picked up.

And NKeal Harry SUCKs, no ifs ands or buts about it. Sorry to those who insanely defended the guy for years, now proven wrong.

.

 

[Sciz]

The timing here is bizarre, because nothing truly noteworthy has happened since the Agholor, Bourne, Henry, and Smith additions in mid-March. A high draft pick could have immediately pushed Harry off every roster projection, but instead they were ready to pass on the entire WR draft class until Ernie happened to pick one. None of the backup WR candidates really stood out during open summer practices, which is when the little speedy guys are at an advantage because the defense can't play press coverage.

It wasn't a great look for Harry's name to make the rounds among the aggregator sites this morning in response to Reiss naming him as the Patriot veteran most on the roster bubble, but being mentioned in an ESPN article can't possibly be a big enough deal to make them pull the trigger on a formal trade request...right?

 

[RobertWeathers]

That's the one way this whole situation makes sense. BB doesn't have to waste his time finding best value. Put the agent to work and Bill can just sign off on the trade.

BB has a long track record of empowering players to find their trade deals or market. This is nothing new.

 

[50-yard-line]

It's irrelevant to whether or not the team would have been a SB competitor. It's ridiculous to think that missing a few hours of half-practice in June torpedoed an entire season that started off 8-0. Stop with that nonsense.

Yeah, because that's all that I said. You have this grand ability to reduce any argument to the sound bite that suits you. What are you a lawyer or something?

 

[DropKickFlutie]

The timing here is bizarre, because nothing truly noteworthy has happened since the Agholor, Bourne, Henry, and Smith additions in mid-March. A high draft pick could have immediately pushed Harry off every roster projection, but instead they were ready to pass on the entire WR draft class until Ernie happened to pick one. None of the backup WR candidates really stood out during open summer practices, which is when the little speedy guys are at an advantage because the defense can't play press coverage.

It wasn't a great look for Harry's name to make the rounds among the aggregator sites this morning in response to Reiss naming him as the Patriot veteran most on the roster bubble, but being mentioned in an ESPN article can't possibly be a big enough deal to make them pull the trigger on a formal trade request...right?

It showed that his agent isn't very good. Could have done this behind the scenes. But I understand the impetus. NKeal has no role here as I projected months ago. He is a total waste on the roster. It is in NKeal's benefit to go elsewhere now instead of waste a whole year. I don't think a change of scenery will help him though, he can't get open so he has no chance.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

It was a sign of where he was at mentally, and that was not a good place.

It really all ties in together. Brady (and Gronkowski) didn’t want to be treated like children by Belichick. Their days off, rest and recovery, practice participation, workout routine, and rehab should be left up to them. Bruce Arians alluded to this, respectfully, when discussing Brady/Gronk practice exceptions for the 2020 season.

It’s a big jump to assume the quality of receivers played into Brady’s decision to skip OTAs. At the time, it was Edelman, D. Thomas, a first round pick in Harry, and Dorsett. He really wasn’t disgruntled about the skill players until after the AB release, Gordon re-suspension. Thomas trade, Edelman injury, and high school level tight ends. People forget the receiving corps was actually stacked in September with the addition of Brown, with comps to 2007. They had to release Berrios and Thomas, two players who would have made the roster most years.

So why didn’t he show up for OTAs? For one, he cited wanting to spend time with family...maybe people don’t like it, but it’s not the same as spitefully skipping camp because you don’t like the draft pick and wanted a different draft pick

Also, this. This is about something deeper than a receiving corps for Brady. He thinks players are already overworked by teams and should be able to manage their own workload. He has many times hosted his own activities in the offseason.