NFL to propose to improve a team's draft position if it hires a person of color as HC or GM

[Ring 6]

I think the argument is that the owners have some kind of implicit racism that’s making them believe that white people are more qualified or better fit to coach the team?

Do people really believe that?

 

[neuronet]

But what is more? What indicates the current level is not enough?
If no one can give even a ball park number but make comments like we could bucker about the exact number, how do you determine that it is too low?
It the % of HC exactly matches the % of black population is that acceptable?
There has to be a yardstick, you can’t just say it’s not enough but we won’t discuss what enough is.

That is a different question. I answered your actual question. More black people in positions of power in the league is what people want. That's what you asked. It is a reasonable goal, but it is also reasonable that the exact number could be up for debate, or even left unspecified. I think using the demographics of the league, rather than of the US population, seems a fair starting point for purposes of debate. But like I said, it doesn't matter. I don't have to give you an exact number. I can be happy watching you get red in the face at the thought of more black people in positions of power.

 

[Ring 6]

He said he was open to a backup role, though. And unless you can tell me what teams he's actually turned down, you don't know the situation any better than I do, yet you assume you do.

That was after the other players were signed.


I don’t assume I know anything other than teams appear to not want him and I understand why from watching him play, and the player he has now become.

 

[PatriotsReign]

Because you'd think the majority of black players in the NFL, who know the game inside and out, who've been playing since they were kids, would make up a higher percentage of head coaches. I don't know why this is a crazy thought. MLB - majority white players, majority white coaches. NHL - majority white players, majority white coaches. NFL/NBA - majority black players, majority white coaches?

The most important skills required to be a head coach aren’t really related to playing.

The absolute #1 skill necessary to be successful is organizational skills. An NFL head coach has to hire the right team that will implement his philosophy & vision. That includes position coaches, strength coaches, cooks, equipment managers, medical team, etc. It’s definitely not teaching playing skills.

 

[fightingirish595]

Do people really believe that?

I think some definitely believe the owners are either being explicitly or implicitly racist. Seems like we have a few in this very thread

 

[oceansizer]

I thought Rooney rule was an absurd but this time Roger has outdone himself.

 

[Ring 6]

That is a different question. I answered your actual question. More black people in positions of power in the league is what people want. That's what you asked. It is a reasonable goal, but it is also reasonable that the exact number could be up for debate, or even left unspecified. I think using the demographics of the league, rather than of the US population, seems a fair starting point for purposes of debate. But like I said, it doesn't matter. I don't have to give you an exact number. I can be happy watching you get red in the face at the thought of more black people in positions of power.

So I think you misunderstood my question.
What determines that there is even an issue?
Of course you decide to throw out accusations that I am racist, because that’s the quality of human being you are.

 

[fightingirish595]

The most important skills required to be a head coach aren’t really related to playing.

The absolute #1 skill necessary to be successful is organizational skills. An NFL head coach has to hire the right team that will implement his philosophy & vision. That includes position coaches, strength coaches, cooks, equipment managers, medical team, etc. It’s definitely not teaching playing skills.

if you can’t teach you literally can’t coach lmao. Are you serious with that statement. Even if that’s not the number 1 skill you need, you still need it

 

[Ring 6]

I think some definitely believe the owners are either being explicitly or implicitly racist. Seems like we have a few in this very thread

That’s the point of discussing specifics.
Poster says owners are racist. Ask poster why they say need more black people. Ask poster how many they call you racist.
It’s identity politics and it’s a ***********.

 

[PatriotsReign]

if you can’t teach you literally can’t coach lmao. Are you serious with that statement

Of course they have to possess teaching skills, but it’s not the most important skill set of a head coach. Plenty of coaches are great teachers but they suck at head coaching

If you think head coaches spend most of their time teaching players, you don’t understand professional football

The thing that amazes people that know Bill Belichick personally is his level of knowledge & involvement in every aspect of those employed by Robert Kraft. Almost no one gets hired without BB’s consent

 

[fightingirish595]

Of course they have to possess teaching skills, but it’s not the most important skill set of a head coach. Plenty of coaches are great teachers but they suck at head coaching

If you think head coaches spend most of their time teaching players, you don’t understand professional football

The thing that amazes people that know Bill Belichick personally is his level of knowledge & involvement in every aspect of those employed by Robert Kraft. Almost no one gets hired without BB’s consent

straw man.

head coaches certainly teach though.

 

[PatriotsReign]

straw man.

head coaches certainly teach though.

No straw man at all

All coaches teach, but it’s not the most important quality of a Head Coach. It’s really everything it takes to get a team to believe in his system and to play selflessly to achieve their common goal...which is to win and win consistently

Some of the best teachers never succeed as head coaches

 

[DropKickFlutie]

It isn't as much racism. It's that the white GM or owner is able to rationalize a less qualified and less experienced white coach choice due to "fit" or "comfort" reasons. Happens ALL the time.

.

 

[PatsWSB47]

There probably should be more black coaches but better draft picks isn't the answer. It might be even be taken as an insult by suggesting black coaches need better players. I dunno, maybe some incentive based thing for new coaches and the teams that hired the that perform. Results then reward.

 

[Ring 6]

It isn't as much racism. It's that the white GM or owner is able to rationalize a less qualified and less experienced white coach choice due to "fit" or "comfort" reasons. Happens ALL the time.

.

Why???? Why would they do that. Why would they go out of their way to hire a less qualified person. Please identify which teams do this.

Competition is the great equalizer. You cannot afford to not hire the best person. But if that were the case and teams were more worried about race than success why do they all have so many black players that they pay multimillionaire if dollars too?

 

[Ring 6]

The bottom line here is that when you artificially enhance the opportunity for someone you take opportunity away from someone else.
The great equalizer is competition. If gives you incentive to hire the best and it gives the best the chance to be identified.
Competition has resulted in a situation where roughly the proportion of black coaches is the same as the proportion of black citizens and candidates.
Needing to put a thumb on the scale would require that it be obvious that there is an outright attempt to not hire black coaches, and given the rate at which they have been hired, it would require showing that they, as a group are substantially more qualified.
If you can’t show that you are creating a reason to implement a policy that would result in hiring someone because of the color of their skin rather than being must qualified. The most qualified person is harmed by this and that is unfair.
If there was proof that the mist qualified person is NOT getting the job due to race, then something should be done, but no one has shown me proof.

 

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Why???? Why would they do that. Why would they go out of their way to hire a less qualified person. Please identify which teams do this.

Competition is the great equalizer. You cannot afford to not hire the best person. But if that were the case and teams were more worried about race than success why do they all have so many black players that they pay multimillionaire if dollars too?

You can't be this naive? There are countless examples of this.

Andy I've never seen you breakdown the game in any aspect but even casual fans know less qualified guys get a shot and retreads get chance after chance.

 

[Ring 6]

You can't be this naive? There are countless examples of this.

Andy I've never seen you breakdown the game in any aspect but even casual fans know less qualified guys get a shot and retreads get chance after chance.

I break down the game quite often actually.

So you are telling me that it is your belief that NFL teams hire head coaches knowing they are not the mist qualified guy?
That they fail on purpose? And it’s due to racism.
Which current HCs do you identify as being hired only because they are white, and we selected over a clearly more highly qualified black coach? Let’s out the racist owners since there are countless examples.
Hey you are entitled to your opinion but that is quite a bizarre one.

 

[iapatsfan]

As crazy as this proposal is and it is crazy the problem is actually worse.

Anyone who thinks, well, "the best will get hired" , "the best will rise to the top" is being incredibly naive. If not disingenuous all together.

It's an awful idea and I'm not for it but denying there's a problem, a big problem, is out of touch to say the least.

We're talking about humans here. Counting on rich, ignorant humans who haven't gotten it right so far.

Again this proposal is a joke but the issue and problems are that bad.

What issue and what problems are you referring to?

 

[iapatsfan]

Because you'd think the majority of black players in the NFL, who know the game inside and out, who've been playing since they were kids, would make up a higher percentage of head coaches. I don't know why this is a crazy thought. MLB - majority white players, majority white coaches. NHL - majority white players, majority white coaches. NFL/NBA - majority black players, majority white coaches?

This could be the most ignorant post I have read in this forum.