DRAFT DAY DISCUSSION Official Draft Day LIVE Discussion Thread - Day 3

[patman12]

Comparing a 6 yr high level high school DB to a HOF QB seems about right.

About as right as your “analysis”.

 

[iapatsfan]

So just for the hell of it, maybe you explain in your infinite wisdom why the man who is almost unanimously consider one of the few greatest football coaches of all time who has won more regularly than anyone ever has, picked Harry, and not only drafted no outside WRs but did not sign a single UDFA outside WR?
What is your analysis of why Belichick appears to think you are totally wrong?

That's easy...for the same reason he thought Jordan Richards was quality value in the 2nd round. Next question.

 

[Ring 6]

That's easy...for the same reason he thought Jordan Richards was quality value in the 2nd round. Next question.

Then since the sum total of his decisions are greater than anyone who has ever done the job you must be fine trusting his decisions.
He’s made a hell of a lot more good ones than bad. But by all means let’s find one draft choice that didn’t work out and call the GOAT incompetent.

 

[DaBruinz]

Dugger will be Chung's replacement

I think that Dugger is Harmon's replacement and that Phillips is Chung's replacement. I also believe that one they have a McCourty replacement, we'll see more traditional 2 Safety sets with Dugger being more of a Rodney Harrison type player..

 

[Bruins29]

I finally caved in. 13 years, ZERO on the ignore list.
Until now.
This POS "iapatsfan" is worse than any troll ever.
He is the corn in a Bill Polian turd.

Just a pu $$y loser. Laugh at him. Incel clown

 

[Ring 6]

I was just thinking about Keene & Asiasi.

It's quite possible they were TE1 & TE2 on their board. Or very close to it.

Like you were saying about boards being different. I had Asiasi as TE5 on mine. Very possible he's TE1 on the Pats. Same for Keene. Probably a lot higher than most thought be most just read the media.

Guys like Dugger & Chinn for example have been getting buzz since before the year. Everyone knew their name by the end of October paying attention to college ball.

Outside of a select few freaks, every player drafted must improve from today forward to be a good nfl player. The competition level also increases dramatically. 2 savants at evaluation could end up with entirely different projections about players after factoring in things such as, how the jump in competition will affect them, the liklihood their weaknesses are correctable (ie a TE who wasn’t taught how to block properly in a passing system vs one who was taught well in a running system) how they fit the role, whether they have peeked physically, how coachable they are, what their commitment to football is etc, etc.
the idea that there is a linear ranking among position groups much less between them that all teams share is crazy.

 

[iapatsfan]

Then since the sum total of his decisions are greater than anyone who has ever done the job you must be fine trusting his decisions.
He’s made a hell of a lot more good ones than bad. But by all means let’s find one draft choice that didn’t work out and call the GOAT incompetent.

I'd re-phrase that to say he made one enormously brilliant decision that compensated for a very large number of horrible ones. It's one thing to make horrible draft picks like Chad Jackson. Its an entirely different thing to make continually make obviously horrible picks that nearly everybody knew were horrible at the time. See Jordan Richards and N'Keal Treadwell.

However, I will give him credit for letting existing players walk at the right time. He does seem to have a skill for that.

 

[Ring 6]

I think that Dugger is Harmon's replacement and that Phillips is Chung's replacement. I also believe that one they have a McCourty replacement, we'll see more traditional 2 Safety sets with Dugger being more of a Rodney Harrison type player..

Nah dugger is the big nickel that bb has been looking for for many years.
His skill set fits that role better than anyone including Harrison whose skill level fit it best.

 

[Wax Frog]

Just a pu $$y loser. Laugh at him. Incel clown

No ignore for me! I'm still praying my popcorn craving kicks in.

 

[STUB STUB]

everybody knew were horrible at the time.

A lot of fantastic BB picks seem "horrible at the time" to everybody according to the mainstream media - Mayo, Collins, McCourty, etc. In fact, the media probably felt the same way this year, but the've learned to not criticize BB picks after being burned in the past. Also, the jury is still out on N'Keal - he had one injury-shortened season trying to play catch up in one of the most complicated NFL offenses run by a pretty intolerant and impatient QB who didn't like to play to his strengths.

 

[Deus Irae]

A lot of fantastic BB picks seem "horrible at the time" to everybody according to the mainstream media - Mayo, Collins, McCourty, etc. Also, the jury is still out on N'Keal - he had one injury-shortened season trying to play catch up in one of the most complicated NFL offenses run by a pretty intolerant and impatient QB who didn't like to play to his strengths.

Who thought Mayo was a horrible pick?

 

[Deus Irae]

Oh, ffs. He played in a signal offense at ASU. He went to a read and react offense in New England. That’s a huge difference.

Then he had to play with a QB who has been in that offense for 20 years, who Harry rarely worked with due to injury, no OTAs, other receivers, etc. Everyone could see he was thinking on the field. Am I running a third option dig here when where in a 12 formation and there’s motion and the corner is in press coverage and taking an outside position and the safety is cheating and Brady is now calling an audible and, oh wait, now the safety is off and the Will has rotated and the corner looks like he’s taking an inside position and . . . oh, **** . . . ? All that and more needs to be processed in about 3 seconds. Rookie WR processing all that skillfully, playing against experienced, grown men at a faster pace than in college? Good luck.

This ain’t Seattle’s offense, which has half the plays, relies on Wilson’s exceptional running ability and deep ball accuracy, audibles less. Plus, they ran bubble screens and slants to Metcalf, who’s in motion so there’s no press coverage for him to deal with.

Let’s see what he does this year before resorting to the simpleton’s tired refrain “he can’t get separation.”

Harry's questionable separation didn't just become a thing last season.

 

[STUB STUB]

Who thought Mayo was a horrible pick?

Not that Mayo was a bad player, but the consensus at the time was that this was a 15-25 pick reach, especially considering we were sitting at #7 originally. "Horrible" would be an overstatement, true.

 

[iapatsfan]

A lot of fantastic BB picks seem "horrible at the time" to everybody according to the mainstream media - Mayo, Collins, McCourty, etc. In fact, the media probably felt the same way this year, but the've learned to not criticize BB picks after being burned in the past. Also, the jury is still out on N'Keal - he had one injury-shortened season trying to play catch up in one of the most complicated NFL offenses run by a pretty intolerant and impatient QB who didn't like to play to his strengths.

The jury is not out on N'Keal Treadwell (which is a truly ironic nickname if you think of tread as a verb). The guy can't run. It's no more out on him than it ever was on Jordan Richards. They suffer from the same affliction....Feetstuckinmuditis.

 

[Wax Frog]

That's really the question isn't it? Strategically why would a team bury itself in continued cap jail with high priced offensive skill position guys if the one person that can get the ball to them isn't the right fit over the mid-term (2-5 years)?

Aligning next years team to its remaining strengths of defense and special teams with Brady leaving and solidifying the inner core with TEs and OL this draft so if he's not you can maybe still run the ball is a way to remain at the best competition level possible while not burdening the team with no flexibility coming out of a year where you can definitively determine if the QB is the guy or not.

Another example of many fans demanding instant gratification in every circumstance, aligning to fantasy cultural understanding, and not looking past the current minute much less the next 3-5 years.

I'm quoting this because I feel it deserves to be seen again, as futile an act as it might be. If I was the sort to write thoughtfully and at length about football matters this would have pretty much been my reply to all the Chixlittles. I applaud you!

 

[Deus Irae]

Not that Mayo was a bad player, but the consensus at the time was that this was a 15-25 pick reach, especially considering we were sitting at #7 originally. "Horrible" would be an overstatement, true.

Mayo was a pick people liked. That was the double blessing draft, where we were laughing at the Jets for grabbing Gholston, as well.

McCourty was a pick where there was a split about his ability to play CB. And those of us who didn't want him there were right in the end.

As for Collins, I remember most people drooling over him. The skeptics, such as myself, took a huge amount of **** for pointing out his flaws and wishing the team had gone in a different direction.

 

[oldrover]

As for Collins, I remember most people drooling over him. The skeptics, such as myself, took a huge amount of **** for pointing out his flaws and wishing the team had gone in a different direction.

Deus one time thought he was wrong...

...but turns out he was mistaken. (jk)

 

[Uptown]

 

[TomPatriot]

You're right...James White is a phenomenal runner of the football. That's why they give him 3 carries a game. Brilliant post.

No one said he was “phenomenal.” You said he can only catch passes. I just proved you wrong. Pretty nice effort by JW to score the winning TD in the SB, isn’t it?

 

[iapatsfan]

No one said he was “phenomenal.” You said he can only catch passes. I just proved you wrong. Pretty nice effort by JW to score the winning TD in the SB, isn’t it?

Exceptions don't prove anything. Should I post a video of Edelman throwing a TD pass and claim he's a quality passer? Don't be willfully ignorant.