Money and cap considerations: another year of Brady or ... ?

[fnordcircle]

He needs receivers who can stretch the field opening things up for possession guys.

We miss someone who can really threaten/pressure safeties in the seam. I think we had a guy who could do that in the past. Gunk or something.

 

[Tunescribe]

You have no idea what number Brady is willing to play for at New England. Maybe it’s $35m, maybe it’s $20m or anywhere inbetween.

What I'm suggesting is that even $20 million, which would mean a pay cut for Brady, is too much. The Patriots might not be able to afford Brady AND build a strong enough roster to contend for the playoffs in 2020.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

No offense, but how many Brady threads do we need?

 

[meatface]

how does Brady's contract extension from august play into this? Would he be cut or is there something I'm missing?

 

[Tunescribe]

No offense, but how many Brady threads do we need?

This thread is about more than just Brady. It's about the team's roster-building prospects for next season, Brady's contract being a major swing component.

 

[Boomer B]

It’s an odd situation. If Brady comes back we still need to retool the offence for 1 more run. That means a good WR and good TE. We’ll lose a few on D but I can’t see Brady wanting to come back to the same offence he’s had this year.

 

[Tottie]

how does Brady's contract extension from august play into this? Would he be cut or is there something I'm missing?

Brady carries a 13.5mil dead cap hit. If he leaves or retires they are paying that much at the QB1 position right off the bat. How can they bring anyone else in if people above think the pats can't afford to pay him 25. It doesn't add up. Brady probably wanted 2-3 year contract at the start of the year and the Pats rightfully balked at that. He will be back. They will pay him 23-27. No one makes less than 20. The only way he's not back is if BB truly thinks TB is done and in which case they wouldn't offer him 18 or anything at all. It's not about Brady taking a certain amount. I believe the amount will be easy for both parties. 1 year deal - push the dead money another year and make another run. You can't bring anyone in from the outside + Brady's dead money hit and make a run, and Stidham isn't ready. Bridge year? If BB thinks Brady sucks maybe.

 

[Tunescribe]

Brady carries a 13.5mil dead cap hit. If he leaves or retires they are paying that much at the QB1 position right off the bat. How can they bring anyone else in if people above think the pats can't afford to pay him 25. It doesn't add up. Brady probably wanted 2-3 year contract at the start of the year and the Pats rightfully balked at that. He will be back. They will pay him 23-27. No one makes less than 20. The only way he's not back is if BB truly thinks TB is done and in which case they wouldn't offer him 18 or anything at all. It's not about Brady taking a certain amount. I believe the amount will be easy for both parties. 1 year deal - push the dead money another year and make another run. You can't bring anyone in from the outside + Brady's dead money hit and make a run, and Stidham isn't ready. Bridge year? If BB thinks Brady sucks maybe.

It is not true that no starting QB makes less than $20 million. And you simply cannot say Stidham won't be ready next season any more than you could've said the same about Brady in 2001.

 

[Tottie]

It is not true that no starting QB makes less than $20 million. And you simply cannot say Stidham won't be ready next season any more than you could've said the same about Brady in 2001.

Look it up. Only backups, rookie contracts or second chance QBs are paid in that range. Probably the odd final year of a 5 year deal on some QBs. The closest you can find is Dalton. You want to roll with him? The point is it's not a reasonable expectation.

Quarterback Contracts and Salaries | Over The Cap

Again - I doubt Brady would be playing under such a contract under any condition, nor would BB ask him to do so. It's either Brady is good enough to play, or he isn't. It's not a matter of you can stay but only for a low ball contract. As for Stidham it's a safe bet he's not ready to go, but if BB believes TB is done then might as well roll with him since we will be taking a 13.5mil dead hit on Brady's deal.

 

[skinnydog]

For purposes of discussion:

The current NFL salary cap is $188 million and is expected to increase by $8 million next year. The Patriots are projected to have $49 million in cap space, which sounds good until you consider that both Indy and Miami will be $100 million under. Also, Buffalo will be $89 million under, Baltimore $48 million, the Jete $53 million, etc. Signing the team's own important free agents and competing in the marketplace will be a challenge.

Tom Brady's contract is $23 million and retaining him for 2020 likely will be north of that, perhaps significantly. With so many high-profile free agents on the team, aging guys like Edelman, etc. and a brutal schedule, next season is shaping up to be a pivotal retooling campaign no matter what -- perhaps the most "transitional" year of BB's tenure including prospective key front office and coaching departures (Caserio, McDaniels).

The argument FOR moving on from Brady is strong because: (1) his quality of play no longer is "elite," as in being a prime difference maker, (2) his contract money arguably could be put to better use shoring up other positions, (3) the roster might not be strong enough across the board to benefit from Brady's leadership and experience and (4) the team must establish a new identity to be competitive post-Brady.

My primary concern is that for Brady to be effective in 2020, he will need a much stronger supporting cast (skill players) than he has now AND a more solid OL in front of him PLUS a strong defense that won't force the offense into playing catch-up -- something vintage Brady was capable of overcoming. With crucial transitional moves looming both organizationally and with player personnel, accomplishing that appears doubtful. Last year the pieces were in place for Brady, this year they COULD have been if not for bad luck (injuries, AB fiasco). Next year, things look pretty nebulous.

For any QB to be successful next year a better O-Line and skill players are necessary. Vintage Brady could not overcome the cast he has around him. Lamar has a great o-line in Baltimore. Decent speed at the receiver position and 2 solid TEs. Mahoney, Brees, Jimmy G etc all have a better cast of players on offense around them. I can’t think of any QB in the league that could take this o-line, receiving group and TEs and turn them into a top offense.

 

[RobertWeathers]

For any QB to be successful next year a better O-Line and skill players are necessary. Vintage Brady could not overcome the cast he has around him. Lamar has a great o-line in Baltimore. Decent speed at the receiver position and 2 solid TEs. Mahoney, Brees, Jimmy G etc all have a better cast of players on offense around them. I can’t think of any QB in the league that could take this o-line, receiving group and TEs and turn them into a top offense.

Mahoney?

 

[skinnydog]

Mahoney?

View attachment 25747

Bad spelling and spell check and no editing! Love the reference!

 

[sportnik]

Agreed except for tanking. There's no compelling argument for tanking in the NFL.

Agreed. With this coaching staff, you never tank. look at the 01 roster. It’s pretty similar to what they might look like next year.

 

[skinnydog]

It is not true that no starting QB makes less than $20 million. And you simply cannot say Stidham won't be ready next season any more than you could've said the same about Brady in 2001.

Uh, yeah that’s a pretty safe thing to say. Brady, was a once in a lifetime kind of thing. Are you really suggesting the Pats load up on offense an go with Stidham?

 

[Tunescribe]

Look it up. Only backups, rookie contracts or second chance QBs are paid in that range. Probably the odd final year of a 5 year deal on some QBs. The closest you can find is Dalton. You want to roll with him? The point is it's not a reasonable expectation.

Quarterback Contracts and Salaries | Over The Cap

Again - I doubt Brady would be playing under such a contract under any condition, nor would BB ask him to do so. It's either Brady is good enough to play, or he isn't. It's not a matter of you can stay but only for a low ball contract. As for Stidham it's a safe bet he's not ready to go, but if BB believes TB is done then might as well roll with him since we will be taking a 13.5mil dead hit on Brady's deal.

I did look it up, you are wrong, and even the link you provide proves it. You have nothing to offer in argument against Stidham's potential. Moving on.

 

[Tottie]

I did look it up, you are wrong, and even the link you provide proves it. You have nothing to offer in argument against Stidham's potential. Moving on.

There is no Brady comparable below 20 and anyone in the low 20s is on a long term deal signed a long time ago. I'm guessing you didn't even load the list. Please produce some names here you think are comparable. Again you claim you can sign Brady to something below 20mil. I say the value is 23-27. Show me names that back up your statement. As for Stidham, absolutely it's a guess he's not ready and nothing more, just like you are guessing he is ready.

 

[Tunescribe]

Are you really suggesting the Pats load up on offense an go with Stidham?

One post-Brady possibility.

 

[skinnydog]

One post-Brady possibility.

I don’t see that as a viable option. Certainly not for a playoff contending team. If the want to rebuild, then yes I can see it.

 

[Tunescribe]

I don’t see that as a viable option. Certainly not for a playoff contending team. If the want to rebuild, then yes I can see it.

The whole point of this thread, as laid out in the OP, is pondering what it will take for the Patriots to REMAIN a playoff-contending team in 2020 (which cannot be assumed). Free agency/cap space loom huge, both in retaining key players and bringing in needed help.

 

[skinnydog]

The whole point of this thread, as laid out in the OP, is pondering what it will take for the Patriots to REMAIN a playoff-contending team in 2020 (which cannot be assumed). Free agency/cap space loom huge, both in retaining key players and bringing in needed help.

I get that, and if they go with Stidham, they have no chance. None. Like I said, Brady was a once in a lifetime thing. Based his college performance, he was drafted too low and 2001 was lightening in a bottle. Stidham would have big, big growing pains even with a better supporting cast. Who else is out there? Bridge water? He’ll cost 15 million next year. So a savings of about 10 over a Brady contract. That’s one very good but not elite receiver.