Central Thread For Mourning/Canonizing Jimmy Garoppolo

[RobertWeathers]

Yeah it is a very small sample size. I do have to admit that Jimmy's play does not look flukey in the slightest. The guy knows what he is doing, good mechanics and poise. His supporting cast isn't very good and that team was garbage before he took over. But he has it running pretty smoothly in such a short amount of time. If he stays healthy he will be a great QB, I have little doubt about it.

Still I need to see what he does with a full season before I can confirm that belief.

Providing he has health, good coaching and a solid supporting cast, there is no question Jimmy will be a very good NFL QB. There is no debate there.

His career is off to an outstanding start

I've been hammering the Garrapolites for being chicken littles and completely uninformed and lacking an understanding of how little leverage BB had.

Reiss lays it out perfectly here.

Did the Patriots get enough from the 49ers for Jimmy G?

 

[CutiePie]

how many QBs in the league would you "definitively" rather have than jimmy g for the rest of their career?

carson wentz?

thats 1

who else?......and remember......"rest of career".....not 2-3 years

jimmy may not be proven yet......but he looks darn good compared to most of league

 

[GoBlue]

There are a few other young guys that are performing well, primarily because they are a real threat to run the ball. That usually doesn't last long as they have a tendency to get injured. When forced to become a pocket passer they fail. Jimmy seems to be in a good place with a team that is rebuilding and a very good offensive minded coach..

 

[aluminum seats]

As @Ivan noted and demonstrated- these things were said. And there are more examples too before the trade. We or anyone else have no reason to make these up. Quite amusing.

Belichick clearly decided that a 40 year old Brady whose window is closing - gives the team a better chance to win than JG, 14 years younger and with lots of upside. That tells me everything I need to know so I’m all in with that. Otherwise... if JG really was the next great superstar in the opinion of one of the greatest coaches in sports history..it wouldn’t have been JG who was traded. See Bledsoe, Drew.

As I said before, JG’s contributions here were wildly overrated by many. Nobody who likes their job will trade anything for that beyond what the team got.

Yeah, just waiting for a link, thanks.

But "Nobody who likes their job will trade anything for that beyond what the team got" is clearly wrong, as the Pats could have gotten more simply by moving him earlier.

Again, life goes on, but I'm amused by the anger that some here seem to feel when discussing it.

I should note too another obvious point that nevertheless seems to be missed, and it's in fact reinforced by any widespread belief that JG will be terrific. It matters not at all what JG actually becomes. If the PERCEPTION is held by many that he will be great, that only further drives the value of what the Pats could and should have gotten for him. That holds true if he gets hurt the next game and never plays another snap.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I heard a relative of mine yesterday say that this Guerrero stuff had been a problem for so long and with his mom's health situation that Tom went to Kraft and said to him he wanted to be traded to SF. BB knew this and as a way of throwing his weight around specifically traded Jimmy to SF. That's why they only netted a 2nd rounder.

I just stayed quiet.

Interesting how these conspiracy theories are created.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Yeah, just waiting for a link, thanks.

But "Nobody who likes their job will trade anything for that beyond what the team got" is clearly wrong, as the Pats could have gotten more simply by moving him earlier.

Again, life goes on, but I'm amused by the anger that some here seem to feel when discussing it.

I should note too another obvious point that nevertheless seems to be missed, and it's in fact reinforced by any widespread belief that JG will be terrific. It matters not at all what JG actually becomes. If the PERCEPTION is held by many that he will be great, that only further drives the value of what the Pats could and should have gotten for him. That holds true if he gets hurt the next game and never plays another snap.

I have already posted the posts, and I found the forum for you, all you have to do is go there. I’ve done my part.

 

[sb1]

Yeah, just waiting for a link, thanks.

It’s not difficult to search for them. We are not making it up, not sure why you seem to think we are.

But "Nobody who likes their job will trade anything for that beyond what the team got" is clearly wrong, as the Pats could have gotten more simply by moving him earlier.

“Could have” is an opinion, not a fact and certainly not a completed trade.

Again, life goes on, but I'm amused by the anger that some here seem to feel when discussing it.

Not angry at all, at least speaking for myself.

I should note too another obvious point that nevertheless seems to be missed, and it's in fact reinforced by any widespread belief that JG will be terrific. It matters not at all what JG actually becomes. If the PERCEPTION is held by many that he will be great, that only further drives the value of what the Pats could and should have gotten for him. That holds true if he gets hurt the next game and never plays another snap.

That belief and perception was nothing close to widespread until after the trade happened making it a completely and utterly irrelevant argument when discussing what the team got for him.

 

[mosslost]

how many QBs in the league would you "definitively" rather have than jimmy g for the rest of their career?

carson wentz?

thats 1

who else?......and remember......"rest of career".....not 2-3 years

jimmy may not be proven yet......but he looks darn good compared to most of league

I love Carson but would rather have Jimmy myself. But honestly that is based on already having had him around as the Brady back up binky.

I think Jimmy is going to be in the "Top 5" list as long as he plays, and will have interesting in division rivalry with Goff.

 

[Bill Lee]

Your first point: I'd be very, very surprised if Belichick discussed this with anyone in Foxboro before the deal was done. But, as I've said all along, I have no way of knowing that.

Your second point: Reverse Snark. It never got to the point where those calculations had to be made and everyone knew the number that would have to be worked around.

I'm kind of done with this conversation.

Merry Christmas.

Yeah, I guess we're never going to see eye to eye on this one, but to even consider keeping JG on the franchise tag you have to know what it costs, not just in dollars, but in terms of keeping other players and draft priorities, and I'm sure that calculation was done. I'd be amazed if BB is doing all that math mentally instead of getting the support of his staff. I've seen somewhere (one of those HBO or Amazon shows) where the execs were going through how to fit a player onto a roster. They've got spreadsheets showing projections of how long they expect to keep each player, and how they think they'll fill the gap when the player leaves (promote another guy or acquire from outside). They need to know all that to know what the impact will be of any roster change. All that gets very much more complicated when you need to suddenly find another $24M.

On the other hand, I would not be surprised if it was only BB who handled finding the trade partner for JG, perhaps with minor input from the staff (i.e. would Hoyer be a good enough backup, etc).

As you say, none of us know how it went down, and probably won't know till BB writes a book about it all, if he ever chooses to do so. He's a big football historian so I hope he does.

Too late for Merry Xmas so I'll wish you and all your loved ones a healthy and prosperous New Year.

 

[CutiePie]

I heard a relative of mine yesterday say that this Guerrero stuff had been a problem for so long and with his mom's health situation that Tom went to Kraft and said to him he wanted to be traded to SF. BB knew this and as a way of throwing his weight around specifically traded Jimmy to SF. That's why they only netted a 2nd rounder.

I just stayed quiet.

Interesting how these conspiracy theories are created.

i think the other conspiracy theory is more "possible"

just my opinion......but i have a pea-brain......

 

[mosslost]

There are a few other young guys that are performing well, primarily because they are a real threat to run the ball. That usually doesn't last long as they have a tendency to get injured. When forced to become a pocket passer they fail. Jimmy seems to be in a good place with a team that is rebuilding and a very good offensive minded coach..

Jimmy has "it" in spades. The only thing is the still small sample size... Beyond that I am totally sold.

The thing though, with Brady, there is decent chance the Pats move on to become the most "Super Bowl championshipped" team in the whole league, and having the final Brady years is something that missing out on would have been unacceptable. Brady is still playing better than most QBs including Jimmy Garappolo will ever play. Pats get 7 Super Bowls and losing Jimmy just does not matter. Hopefully we find another QB and build another team good enough to win games, divisions, and even get to some Super Bowls and win some here and there in the future.

 

[Huckleberry1]

It will be very easy to find out if the Kraft’s told Belichick to trade Garrapolo, if Belichick steps down 5 seconds after their last game of the season then it’s true.

 

[sb1]

If the Patriots can trade up into a position to draft one of the Big Three QBs this April... watch the hand wringing about JG disappear.

 

[mosslost]

hey all, it's not like 31 other NFL teams are doomed for the next 14 years because they don't have Jimmy G. Heck we will have Tom F. Brady for the first 3,4 or god please 5 of those years, with the GOAT Coach for those.

I bet Pats win more SBs post Jimmy trade, then Jimmy wins post trade.

 

[mosslost]

If the Patriots can trade up into a position to draft one of the Big Three QBs this April... watch the hand wringing about JG disappear.

You think that is even possible? Just curious. Who would trade with us, and what would it cost. Pats have holes they need to fill I would imagine (though this is against the grain) that this may not be the year we draft Tom's "heir".

 

[Froob]

Can’t wait til around 2033 when people say “Well Brady did say he wasn’t playing in 2035...”

 

[mosslost]

I can and have criticized this team plenty of times. I won’t do it for this because there is nothing to criticize.

If my GM had gone after a guy like Garoppolo for a first round pick I would hope he is immediately relieved of his duties as GM.

You, ALREADY, have been proven wrong on this one. JG clearly is a round one quality QB.

 

[sb1]

You think that is even possible? Just curious. Who would trade with us, and what would it cost. Pats have holes they need to fill I would imagine (though this is against the grain) that this may not be the year we draft Tom's "heir".

The draft value chart seems to show that if we package the likely JG 2nd round slot with our own low first, it would be a fair trade to get into the top 10. Rosen is going very early but I’m sure one or two of them would be there.

 

[aluminum seats]

I have already posted the posts, and I found the forum for you, all you have to do is go there. I’ve done my part.

Couldn't find it, would take you about 5 seconds to post a link, but it's fine.

 

[convertedpatsfan]

Yeah it is a very small sample size. I do have to admit that Jimmy's play does not look flukey in the slightest. The guy knows what he is doing, good mechanics and poise. His supporting cast isn't very good and that team was garbage before he took over. But he has it running pretty smoothly in such a short amount of time. If he stays healthy he will be a great QB, I have little doubt about it.

Still I need to see what he does with a full season before I can confirm that belief.

I also believe he will be a great QB. But lots of great QBs won't ever have the number of Super Bowl chances we have with Brady's remaining window.

Being great in the regular season doesn't always translate to playoff success. Just ask Peyton Manning. And franchise QBs like Stafford, Luck, and Rivers have never had a chance to win a Super Bowl. MVPs like Newton and Ryan have only gone once, and failed spectacularly. Rodgers won once, then hasn't come close to getting back. Wilson went twice in a row, hasn't gotten back since.

There's a lot of luck and teamwork and coaching that goes into a playoff run. But there's also a moment where a team needs their QB to lift them. That's the part that Brady does more consistently and more often than any other QB I've ever seen. And if Jimmy does half of what Brady does, he'll be a HOFer.

But we can't just assume every QB has the same killer instinct as Tom, the same icewater veins, the same laser focus and clutch ability under the brightest lights. We've been spoiled by watching the GOAT for so long, we just assume this is normal. It is not.