Camp Battle at WR - Kenbrell Thompkins vs Josh Boyce

[Marqui]

They are athletic abilities and the NFL is an athletic competition. An investment of resources would indicate significance and the economics behind the combine indicate that it has importance.

I don't think anyone said it isn't important. It's just not a be all end all indicator of how good a player is/will be.

 

[strngplyr]

They are athletic abilities and the NFL is an athletic competition. An investment of resources would indicate significance and the economics behind the combine indicate that it has importance.

Calling the NFL an athletic competition downlplays 90% of what goes into it. Vernon Gholston would have been a superstar if it was truly an athletic competition, the game is very comparable to things like basic training in the military.

It's 95% mental. Yes, you need some physical talents, but the player who is more mentally tough, fundamentally sound, and smarter, will beat the freak athlete in a team setting 9 times out of 10.

1 on 1 drills and individual workouts don't mean too much outside of correcting imperfections in your craft.

 

[Brady6]

Calling the NFL an athletic competition downlplays 90% of what goes into it. Vernon Gholston would have been a superstar if it was truly an athletic competition, the game is very comparable to things like basic training in the military.

It's 95% mental. Yes, you need some physical talents, but the player who is more mentally tough, fundamentally sound, and smarter, will beat the freak athlete in a team setting 9 times out of 10.

1 on 1 drills and individual workouts don't mean too much outside of correcting imperfections in your craft.

You should email Goodell and tell him he can cancel the combine and pro days, and replace it with a mental aptitude test. Think of all the money and time that will be saved.

 

[mgteich]

They are athletic abilities and the NFL is an athletic competition. An investment of resources would indicate significance and the economics behind the combine indicate that it has importance.

The combines are important, as well an the individual pro-days. The reason is that the combine adds information on players who have played in very different systems. The combines and pro-days are sort of entry exams to the NFL.

Of course, the most important parts of the combines for receivers is the running of route trees and the interview process.
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Where we disagree is on the use of combine numbers after a player is already part of an NFL team. For me, the combine and pro-day numbers are now irrelevant. Sure, height and weight matter, but it is the current information from the player's time in the NFL that is important. And height and weight are part of the information given by NFL teams.

I don't care how a player ran the 40 in underwear a couple of years ago. It really doesn't matter. I may need to have tryout (a new pro-day). I may need to see a player in practice for a couple of months. I may even need to see preseason and actual games to evaluate a player. HOWEVER, his performance on his NFL entrance exam doesn't matter.

 

[Brady6]

I don't think anyone said it isn't important. It's just not a be all end all indicator of how good a player is/will be.

I never said it was. I posted Josh Boyce's combine numbers and since it has been a parade if posts disagreeing, with Joker trolling behind rating each post a winner. Mountain out of a mole hill is an understatement. Obviously we have a lot of really bored people who cannot stimulate themselves in any way other than forum confrontation. I'm not really about that, it is annoying and pathetic.

 

[mgteich]

Do the scores of a doctor on his entrance exams to medical school matter in choosing a doctor? Perhaps you care where he or she went to college, or not. What you don't care about is exam scores.

That is an anomaly. Do you really want to argue that athletic measurements do not matter to professional athletes? That is sort of like saying a medical degree doesn't matter for a doctor once the see their first patient.

 

[Brady6]

Do the scores of a doctor on his entrance exams to medical school matter in choosing a doctor? Perhaps you care where he or she went to college, or not. What you don't care about is exam scores.

The people hiring the doctor to work at their facility certainly do.

 

[Bruins29]

Obviously we have a lot of really bored people who cannot stimulate themselves in any way other than forum confrontation. I'm not really about that, it is annoying and pathetic.

But why are you always in the middle of it?

 

[strngplyr]

You should email Goodell and tell him he can cancel the combine and pro days, and replace it with a mental aptitude test. Think of all the money and time that will be saved.

The combine brings a lot of revenue to the NFL, it doesn't cost them anything.

It has its uses, you're just overvaluing the importance by a mile. Talk to anyone who knows anything and they'll tell you they draft what they saw on film from the college season, not the workout they saw at the underwear olympics.

 

[pctronics0072]

If it was just the physical that mattered, all the time, then Tom Brady should not exist. Mental plays a huge role in it, but not 95% imo.

 

[mgteich]

The combine brings a lot of revenue to the NFL, it doesn't cost them anything.

It has its uses, you're just overvaluing the importance by a mile. Talk to anyone who knows anything and they'll tell you they draft what they saw on film from the college season, not the workout they saw at the underwear olympics.

While you point is well taken, Bridgewater and his agents say hi. They would like to have the millions that they lost in the underwear olympics and pro-day process. Many players help themselves in the combines (Watkins!) and pro-days (Manziel). Some hurt themselves.

But film is obviously much more important, as well as interviews.

For me, the more important aspect of the situation is that a couple of years AFTER their combine, a player's combine numbers are irrelevant.

 

[mgteich]

I thought I'd mention the thread topic again, though it seems off-topic at this point.

Boyce is a leading candidate to make the squad as a KR. He is also a likely candidate to make the roster as our #5 WR. So, with both roles, it seems that Boyce is all but a lock. Also, Belichick rarely cuts second year players drafted in the first 4 rounds who are showing some promise and can fill a role on the team. After all, such players are inexpensive and are the backbone of successful teams.

Thompkins is a strong candidate to be our #5 WR. As a rookie, he performed as well as most rookie wide receivers in the league. That is actually high praise for an UDFA.

Obviously, there is little reason to guess which will win a roster spot. After all, we could keep both as our #5 and #6 WR's. After all, we have both punt returners and our kick returners included with =in our WR listings. We also have a player who might take some reps as H-back or move TE. Finally, one of the WR's might not be available for the start of the season.

So, while I am a roster numbers junkie, I have no reason to speculate beyond a 60 man roster. Even then, much will happen in the coming months. So, my personnel conclusion is that both Thompkins and
Boye project to the mythical 60 man roster. I do see reason for considering the 46 man roster, but that is another issue entirely.

 

[Brady6]

The combine brings a lot of revenue to the NFL, it doesn't cost them anything.

It has its uses, you're just overvaluing the importance by a mile. Talk to anyone who knows anything and they'll tell you they draft what they saw on film from the college season, not the workout they saw at the underwear olympics.

Really, because Manx, Mayo, and OTG are the three most knowledgeable draft gurus on this board and all of them reference workout numbers, as do the majority of the other people who invest time in the scouting and drafting period of the offseason.

You seem to like many others think that what you see on Sunday is the end all be all and judge a player solely on that, you determine that if they are effective as a rookie, they will be great but if they struggle, they are going to suck. Once you see a player on the field that is all that matters is the philosophy preached, but that does not allow for the possibility for a player to develop.

If this were 2011, I would have posted Eric Decker’s combine stats you would have told me they do not matter and pointed out that he only had 6 catches as a rookie, others would have agreed. We would have determined Decker sucks, Joker would have rated the thread a “winner” and it would have went just like this discussion about Boyce.

 

[Bruins29]

If this were 2011, I would have posted Eric Decker’s combine stats you would have told me they do not matter and pointed out that he only had 6 catches as a rookie, others would have agreed. We would have determined Decker sucks, Joker would have rated the thread a “winner” and it would have went just like this discussion about Boyce.

 

[Mack Herron]

Really, because Manx, Mayo, and OTG are the three most knowledgeable draft gurus on this board and all of them reference workout numbers, as do the majority of the other people who invest time in the scouting and drafting period of the offseason.

You seem to like many others think that what you see on Sunday is the end all be all and judge a player solely on that, you determine that if they are effective as a rookie, they will be great but if they struggle, they are going to suck. Once you see a player on the field that is all that matters is the philosophy preached, but that does not allow for the possibility for a player to develop.

If this were 2011, I would have posted Eric Decker’s combine stats you would have told me they do not matter and pointed out that he only had 6 catches as a rookie, others would have agreed. We would have determined Decker sucks, Joker would have rated the thread a “winner” and it would have went just like this discussion about Boyce.

People use combine numbers, along with anything else they can get their hands on, to help predict the performance of rookies before there are any Sundays to judge them on. Nevertheless, combine numbers have poor predictive value of how a player will perform in the NFL. Predicting the future is simply a risky proposition; despite the best efforts of the smartest professionals supported by enormous resources, careful assessment of combine numbers, college production and everything else, most draft picks crash and burn.

 

[Deus Irae]

Really, because Manx, Mayo, and OTG are the three most knowledgeable draft gurus on this board and all of them reference workout numbers, as do the majority of the other people who invest time in the scouting and drafting period of the offseason.

You seem to like many others think that what you see on Sunday is the end all be all and judge a player solely on that, you determine that if they are effective as a rookie, they will be great but if they struggle, they are going to suck. Once you see a player on the field that is all that matters is the philosophy preached, but that does not allow for the possibility for a player to develop.

If this were 2011, I would have posted Eric Decker’s combine stats you would have told me they do not matter and pointed out that he only had 6 catches as a rookie, others would have agreed. We would have determined Decker sucks, Joker would have rated the thread a “winner” and it would have went just like this discussion about Boyce.

No matter how you beat this horse, you're not going to bring it back to life.

 

[Brady6]

But why are you always in the middle of it?

Because I post a lot, and if you post a lot and have an opinion that varies from the Jokers of this board they rip you down because if anyone does not think the same thing they are, they deserve to be verbally attacked on an internet board.

On the other hand, it could be the fact that I have a fan club like you for instance, in your last 25 posts 19 have quoted one of my posts; Joker has spent the last month rating anyone and everyone who disagrees with me as a “winner”.

It is all good I enjoy the fact that what I write on an internet board is able to impact posters so much, I can only imagine these posters were stellar athletes themselves, they probably excelled especially at not letting the opponent get into their head.

 

[Bruins29]

Because I post a lot, .

No ****?

 

[Bruins29]

Because I post a lot, and if you post a lot and have an opinion that varies from the Jokers of this board they rip you down because if anyone does not think the same thing they are, they deserve to be verbally attacked on an internet board.

On the other hand, it could be the fact that I have a fan club like you for instance, in your last 25 posts 19 have quoted one of my posts; Joker has spent the last month rating anyone and everyone who disagrees with me as a “winner”.

It is all good I enjoy the fact that what I write on an internet board is able to impact posters so much, I can only imagine these posters were stellar athletes themselves, they probably excelled especially at not letting the opponent get into their head.

Did you stop taking your meds?

 

[Brady6]

No matter how you beat this horse, you're not going to bring it back to life.

Deus I am just trying to give my fans what they want, if I do not post, Bruins29 will have nothing to disagree with, and if Bruins29 has nothing to disagree with Joker will have nothing rate as a “winner”.